Jose Mourinho

[neogenisis]

Is it Jose's fault? or the players fault? in the end its a sub plot. Its Jose's responsibility. The Manager always goes before the players.

 

[nico97531]

I just don’t understand why everyone seems to believe our defensive problems will magically disappear if we just push more man forward and played on the front foot, we will just get picked off more easily as a result! And please stop this idea of us playing a possession base attacking football as we simply can’t with most of our players not comfortable receiving the ball under any kind of pressure. It’s always the easier way to just sack the manager when the team doesn’t seem to be responding but what the club should have done is let them know in no uncertain terms that the manager is not going anywhere and they either fall in line or find another club. That’s what We should have done with poch, but we took the easy route that just leads us back to where we were with the same problems.

 

[Styopa]

The players and Mourinho share responsibility for the dismal level of performance we have descended into.

However this narrative about these being the same players that got Pochettino the sack just isn't accurate.

By my calculation we have signed at least 5 first teamers since Mourinho joined: Reguilón, Doherty, Højbjerg, Bergwijn and Bale as well as a back up striker and a highly rated young centre back. Mourinho has also had much longer to work with Ndombele and Lo Celso who were still relatively new to the country and the club when Pochettino left. Maybe these players aren't good enough but you can hardly say they're the ones who got Pochettino the sack as most of them weren't even here then.

 

[SuperSpurs69]

Not if we were sitting in a low block and creating 2 chances every 90 minutes we wouldn't.

Sorry, I should have been more clear with that bit but it was late haha. What I meant with that bit was with regards to the players back then.

That squad was far, far better than what we have now and I believe the players back then would have fitted the mourinho mould than the ones we have today, a few players aside.

If we had that defence of prime Toby and Jan in the centre with walker and Rose today then I don't think we'd be seeing the football we are.

Jose certainly should get some blame but half the squad play at a level which is signifanctly lower than what is needed.

I honestly think Klopp or pep would struggle with this squad too.

 

[Beni]

I’ve held leadership positions at two organisations.

The first organisation was on the brink when I joined and the top dog was leading a turnaround successfully. The culture at the start and the end were completely different. Many of the elements were the same. There was a gradual improvement in the quality of personnel but the big changes happened through leadership strategies and processes. And in the quality of relationships and morale.

In the second organisation (where I am now) the quality of personnel has stayed constant. The quality of leadership has had a deleterious effect over time. The loss of one key senior leader last summer (during a period where we are contending with Covid and Brexit) has had a huge impact in the quality of relationships and motivation.

The fact is that the staff can be made to shine by good leadership. This idea of some fixed mindset in an organisation is a myth. Football fans love myths but an elite organisation needs to rise above that (indeed it is on the leader to create that distance between internal processes which people can control and external noise. Equally a culture can degrade very quickly given poor results and a lack of direction.

These are just facts of organisations. The poor morale and performance at THFC are also facts but it can be fixed with better leadership.

In all organisations, corporate, industrial or football clubs, managers are one or many leaders depending whether you have a good team or failing one. Successful teams in all walks of life, have employees that are leaders aswell and do not rely just on a manager to lead for them. Leadership doesn’t just stop at management level.

 

[RickyVilla]

At least 10 points from the next 5 league matches or it should be good bye ;

West Brom at home
Man. City away
West Ham away
Burnley at home
Palace at home

He can also fuck off if we won't beat Wolfsberger over two matches, but I don't expect too many problems against them.

I'd expect problems against the Red Lion ladies team at the moment!

 

[wrd]

I know there's a fair few teams in the league who simply have better players than us, that much is clear and the players effort levels have been absolutely fucking awful in recent games.

However to simply blame the players when there's teams in this league who are getting a hell of a lot more out of their squads than we are results wise and their squads are significantly worse than ours.

There's also a lot of teams who are getting much better performances out of their resources than we are despite their limitations. What that tells me is that Jose can't get what he specifically wants out of the squad. He's tried and he simply can't do it so for me he now has to adapt to the squad he has at hand which he simply does not seem to be willing to do.

We should be getting better performances out of the squad than what we are getting. If we lose to the likes of Liverpool and Chelsea then result wise it's not surprising given the squads they have but the manner in which we lose absolutely should be better. Hence why we're suddenly able to spring into action here or there.

 

[spurs mental]

GLC is probably his favourite player. If you know what I mean.

 

[E17yid]

Both the players and Mourinho share responsibility for the dismal level of performance we have descended into.

However this narrative about these being the same players that got Pochettino the sack just isn't accurate.

By my calculation we have signed at least 5 first teamers since Mourinho joined: Reguilón, Doherty, Højbjerg, Bergwijn and Bale as well as a back up striker and a highly rated young centre back. Mourinho has also had much longer to work with Ndombele and Lo Celso who were still relatively new to the country and the club when Pochettino left. Maybe these players aren't good enough but you can hardly say they're the ones who got Pochettino the sack as most of them weren't even here then.

That won’t stop the same people saying it over and over again.

 

[dudu]

Yes I agree the dynamic will be different. But it’ll be different at Oxfam and Virgin and Total and your local restaurant. The bread and butter of motivating teams and managing humans to improve performance will still apply across contexts. It is just the particular challenges will be different. That’s why the systems and approaches will be different. And someone who can do one can’t necessarily do another.

I agree that player performance is been bad. But my point is that these players are capable of more and that this is an institutional problem.

I’d say the same to @-Afri-Coy- too.

It’s just not plausible that so many players are playing so poorly without a group dysfunction. You can get 2 or 3 members of such a group being consistently bad and a number more showing natural fluctuations in performance. But when you reach a critical mass this is no longer down to individual issues but group dynamics. And those are solved by better leadership and management.

I’ll stress again - these players have a higher ceiling when well led. We know that because they consistently reached the top 4 and a CL final less than two years ago. The players now are stronger than then. Much derided players have achieved better results and played better football than they are now. Why are these players not playing as well en masse? That is a leadership issue.

I agree there's group dysfunction, again, and I agree we need a different approach to getting the best out of these players while we still have them all together.

It's just not as cut and dry for me. I take personal pride in everything I do and even if I'm not motivated by some guy who is there to motivate me, I put in the effort regardless.

motivating someone who knows they can sit on their ass and get paid millions a year isn't the same as getting Dave from IT to pull his finger out.

 

[talkshowhost86]

I just don’t understand why everyone seems to believe our defensive problems will magically disappear if we just push more man forward and played on the front foot, we will just get picked off more easily as a result! And please stop this idea of us playing a possession base attacking football as we simply can’t with most of our players not comfortable receiving the ball under any kind of pressure. It’s always the easier way to just sack the manager when the team doesn’t seem to be responding but what the club should have done is let them know in no uncertain terms that the manager is not going anywhere and they either fall in line or find another club. That’s what We should have done with poch, but we took the easy route that just leads us back to where we were with the same problems.

Mourinho isn't getting anything out of them whichever way you look at it.

I am perfectly happy for Mourinho to play his negative style if it gets results. I know some don't agree with that but being a pragmatist, if that's the style that he thinks best suits our available players then fair enough.

But it isn't working, and hasn't been working since he arrived.

So I still see absolutely no justification for keeping him at the club.

 

[Deleted member 27995]

Both the players and Mourinho share responsibility for the dismal level of performance we have descended into.

However this narrative about these being the same players that got Pochettino the sack just isn't accurate.

By my calculation we have signed at least 5 first teamers since Mourinho joined: Reguilón, Doherty, Højbjerg, Bergwijn and Bale as well as a back up striker and a highly rated young centre back. Mourinho has also had much longer to work with Ndombele and Lo Celso who were still relatively new to the country and the club when Pochettino left. Maybe these players aren't good enough but you can hardly say they're the ones who got Pochettino the sack as most of them weren't even here then.

The players mentioned though haven't replaced the ones for the most part, people were climbing over one another to have a pop at on a regular basis. The ones that were supposedly, in part. the reason Poch struggled to get his point across too.

Player recruitment in a manager thread, well I never.

 

[Nynorsk]

Jose Mourinho and Thomas Tuchel hold opposing ideals on two sides of the same coin

Two of Europe’s leading managers meet for the first time at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium on Thursday evening

www.independent.co.uk

Interesting read.

 

[Deleted member 27995]

Mourinho isn't getting anything out of them whichever way you look at it.

I am perfectly happy for Mourinho to play his negative style if it gets results. I know some don't agree with that but being a pragmatist, if that's the style that he thinks best suits our available players then fair enough.

But it isn't working, and hasn't been working since he arrived.

So I still see absolutely no justification for keeping him at the club.

Hmm, really?

 

[NEVILLEB]

The players and Mourinho share responsibility for the dismal level of performance we have descended into.

However this narrative about these being the same players that got Pochettino the sack just isn't accurate.

By my calculation we have signed at least 5 first teamers since Mourinho joined: Reguilón, Doherty, Højbjerg, Bergwijn and Bale as well as a back up striker and a highly rated young centre back. Mourinho has also had much longer to work with Ndombele and Lo Celso who were still relatively new to the country and the club when Pochettino left. Maybe these players aren't good enough but you can hardly say they're the ones who got Pochettino the sack as most of them weren't even here then.

Levy got Pochettino sacked.

He failed to invest in the team over several seasons with quality players either leaving or declining. Then he began to look for a new Manager cutting Poch out of the recruitment process (Coach instead of Manager) thus undermining him and causing him to become disillusioned.

I'm not saying Poch is perfect. But everyone has short ********* memories on here.

There's always the shiny new Manager at Tottenham to fix everything but it won't.

 

[therealGlenn]

A lot of differing opinions here and I seem to flip flop between them. Is it just Jose? Is it the players and Jose? Is Jose really a dinosaur? Are our players just total dicks? I'm so confused right now as to what is the best course of action for our beautiful club.

Would be Interested to get an overall feel from the forum.

Should we get of Jose now? Vote with agree or disagree

 

[Tyler24durden]

Mourinho drains all the players confidence.

on all or nothing, he constantly reminds the players how good the other teams are, how tough it is going to be.

not once did I hear him talk us up.

I honestly believe that this constant negativity has drained our players of their confidence.

I supported him, hoping he would change the mentality of the club, which I think he did initially with his point about being c*nts.

however, the football is dire, is tactically defensive with no real attacking plan and it’s getting worse.

he’s now reverted to type of sniping at players and the press.

such a pity that he couldn’t just get us defending better whilst playing the way we did against west ham and utd.

 

[nico97531]

Mourinho isn't getting anything out of them whichever way you look at it.

I am perfectly happy for Mourinho to play his negative style if it gets results. I know some don't agree with that but being a pragmatist, if that's the style that he thinks best suits our available players then fair enough.

But it isn't working, and hasn't been working since he arrived.

So I still see absolutely no justification for keeping him at the club.

We did manage to be at the top of the league for a while so to say it hasn’t been working since he arrived is just factually incorrect.

 

[Rosco1984]

I just don’t understand why everyone seems to believe our defensive problems will magically disappear if we just push more man forward and played on the front foot, we will just get picked off more easily as a result! And please stop this idea of us playing a possession base attacking football as we simply can’t with most of our players not comfortable receiving the ball under any kind of pressure. It’s always the easier way to just sack the manager when the team doesn’t seem to be responding but what the club should have done is let them know in no uncertain terms that the manager is not going anywhere and they either fall in line or find another club. That’s what We should have done with poch, but we took the easy route that just leads us back to where we were with the same problems.

So Brighton can play possession based football but we cant have a word with yourself. What about Leeds I guess their players are better than ours as well? How many times did we ever have less possession under Poch? Maybe against city and Liverpool but that's it. They are the same players. Poch got us as far as he could and ran out of steam. I really don't think it was as simple as losing the players things just went stale. What was needed was someone to reinvigorate but continue what poch started not a negative confidence sapping disciplinarian to tear it all up and start from scratch destroying everything we built. These players kept the ball for Poch they can still keep the ball now they need confidence and encouragement to play and be brave. Maybe we will still concede but we might actually score a few as well.

 

[dudu]

Mourinho drains all the players confidence.

on all or nothing, he constantly reminds the players how good the other teams are, how tough it is going to be.

not once did I hear him talk us up.

I honestly believe that this constant negativity has drained our players of their confidence.

I supported him, hoping he would change the mentality of the club, which I think he did initially with his point about being c*nts.

however, the football is dire, is tactically defensive with no real attacking plan and it’s getting worse.

he’s now reverted to type of sniping at players and the press.

such a pity that he couldn’t just get us defending better whilst playing the way we did against west ham and utd.

He was very complimentary about Sanchez's balls if I remember correctly

Also you saw less than 1% of everything he has ever said to those players. You have zero idea of what he tells them