Jose Mourinho

[kremlyn]

This is true, but the point stands. It was made by someone literally winning. But it's used here to suggest style of play is more important than winning.

Yes glorious football is great, but winning with it even better. But winning is still better than losing with attractive football.

I think that's exactly the choice we have. Potentially winning with absolutely nothing else to cheer.

It makes me sad.

 

[thekneaf]

I think that's exactly the choice we have. Potentially winning with absolutely nothing else to cheer.

It makes me sad.

Come on, winning is great no matter how you do it.

Tension, desperation, yearning...RELEASE

Football isn't all about looking at nice patterns, it's about the need to win, the merging of your own desire with that of a team and all the people supporting them.

There is just no way, no way, that if we go on a boring 15 game winning streak at the start of next season, there will be anyone on here... no people might complain lol. But they'll be laughed out of town.

 

[emiley heskey]

What is amusing about the Potter thing is that he was an example, like Nagelsmann, of a highly rated, young attack minded coach. Rather than address the point of the post, which was that Mourinho is a bad fit for Spurs, some people have attacked the hypothetical alternative.

I don't want to brand people as morons because they disagree with me but I would like them to address the argument. Mourinho is a bad fit for Spurs, not a bad manager. He would be acceptable for arsenal who have a proud history of intentionally defending to win but not for us.

Nagelsmann has built a very exciting side at Leipzig and is ready to take the next step, Potter has done well with a limited squad, Nuno Santo is also.capable.

If the counter argument is that these guys don't have the cachet to keep Kane etc then Spaletti is free at the moment and he created a brilliant attacking side at Roma.

Are we going to win things with these managers? I don't know but we have as good a chance as any. With Jose, 26 trophy Jose, we don't know. This is the first time apart from man u that he hasn't competed with a squad of the best players in the league. Man U were horrible to watch.

Last season we have defended for our lives against Manchester city in UCL Quarter Final .. We have also defended majority of our games against borrusia dortmund in their field ...

 

[thekneaf]

Last season we have defended for our lives against Manchester city in UCL Quarter Final .. We have also defended majority of our games against borrusia dortmund in their field ...

And it was glorious!

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

This is true, but the point stands. It was made by someone literally winning. But it's used here to suggest style of play is more important than winning.

Yes glorious football is great, but winning with it even better. But winning is still better than losing with attractive football.

There's always going to be disagreement on how the club goes about it. Those wanting to do it the 'spurs' way, Billy Nic/Blanchflower quotes and all and those wanting to do it any way we can. Those wanting to do it organically, those wanting us to have some sort if sugar daddy, those wanting this manager, those wanting that manager and so on and so forth.

There is no way, absolutely no way, everyone will ever be happy or agree.

Not until we win a league title. Then you can bet both your bollocks that nobody will give a fuck how it was done

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Im not certain about this. Lots of people keep saying it (and without checking their ages) but his best performing players have been those just coming into the prime of their careers (robben, terry, lampard, ozil, Ramos) or in the prime of their careers (makelele, Ronaldo, Etoo, milito). It was only really at inter he bought/had an older team but I think that’s reflective of the game in that country at the time.

Lampard had scored 21 league goals for Chelsea in 3 seasons, having played all but 1 league game in that time, before Mourinho joined. He scored 40 across the next 3 seasons.

John Terry was 23 when Mourinho took over, well short of a centre backs prime. Ramos was 24, albeit an exceptional talent, but once again, some years short of a centre backs prime.

Mourinho signed Robben as a 20 year old, and Özil as a 21 year old.

It’s massively false to assert that these players didn’t improve under Mourinho, or if they did it was coincidental, considering the regularity with which players produced their best under his management. Ashley Cole, Drogba, Joe Cole, Essien, Sneijder, even Damien Duff, all produces their best for Mourinho.

He may no longer have it in him, but he was 100% an improver of players in his pomp.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

There's always going to be disagreement on how the club goes about it. Those wanting to do it the 'spurs' way, Billy Nic/Blanchflower quotes and all and those wanting to do it any way we can. Those wanting to do it organically, those wanting us to have some sort if sugar daddy, those wanting this manager, those wanting that manager and so on and so forth.

There is no way, absolutely no way, everyone will ever be happy or agree.

Not until we win a league title. Then you can bet both your bollocks that nobody will give a fuck how it was done

I’m agreeing with too much of what you say today.

Quickly, blame Levy for Covid or something.

 

[buckley]

People keep harping back to the past but in the past
The ball was like a medicine ball when wet ;try heading them balls its why I am dooly ally.
The pitches only had grass on them for a couple of months
You could pass the ball to the keeper and he could pick up the ball .
The majority of the players used to smoke (dear me)
There was a drinking culture at almost every club.
You were allowed to tackle from behind ; you can ask Jimmy Greaves about that and if he played now he would be a 40 plus a season man
You could barge the goalkeeper note Ray wood and Nat Lofthouse
What I am trying to say is never look back as it is pointless as the game was completely different .
You must always look forward to progress and so all this Poch did this Fergie did that Nicholson did so and so ; its pointless because football like everything in life evolves and as Jose said " the clever ones do not always succeed its the ones that can evolve that are successful "
Jose in the past apart from Sporting has had pot loads of money to assist him in building a side .
He is not going to get that at spurs and he knows this and is intelligent enough to adjust and evolve to bring us some joy in the future I am sure . The managers like Warnock / Pulis / Alidyce etc will never be at the very top because they are stuck in the past and cannot or refuse to evolve . As a Spurs addict I respect the past and wish we could repeat some past successes but it is futile I know that looking to the future is the only way we will have success .

 

[olliec]

Is it bipolar because if we don't win there is nothing left to praise?

If we don’t win it turns into hatred on this thread.

 

[emiley heskey]

Lampard had scored 21 league goals for Chelsea in 3 seasons, having played all but 1 league game in that time, before Mourinho joined. He scored 40 across the next 3 seasons.

John Terry was 23 when Mourinho took over, well short of a centre backs prime. Ramos was 24, albeit an exceptional talent, but once again, some years short of a centre backs prime.

Mourinho signed Robben as a 20 year old, and Özil as a 21 year old.
It’s massively false to assert that these players didn’t improve under Mourinho, or if they did it was coincidental, considering the regularity with which players produced their best under his management. Ashley Cole, Drogba, Joe Cole, Essien, Sneijder, even Damien Duff, all produces their best for Mourinho.

He may no longer have it in him, but he was 100% an improver of players in his pomp.

Mourinho also signed di maria when he was 20 years old

 

[SpartanSpur]

People keep harping back to the past but in the past
The ball was like a medicine ball when wet ;try heading them balls its why I am dooly ally.
The pitches only had grass on them for a couple of months
You could pass the ball to the keeper and he could pick up the ball .
The majority of the players used to smoke (dear me)
There was a drinking culture at almost every club.
You were allowed to tackle from behind ; you can ask Jimmy Greaves about that and if he played now he would be a 40 plus a season man
You could barge the goalkeeper note Ray wood and Nat Lofthouse
What I am trying to say is never look back as it is pointless as the game was completely different .
You must always look forward to progress and so all this Poch did this Fergie did that Nicholson did so and so ; its pointless because football like everything in life evolves and as Jose said " the clever ones do not always succeed its the ones that can evolve that are successful "
Jose in the past apart from Sporting has had pot loads of money to assist him in building a side .
He is not going to get that at spurs and he knows this and is intelligent enough to adjust and evolve to bring us some joy in the future I am sure . The managers like Warnock / Pulis / Alidyce etc will never be at the very top because they are stuck in the past and cannot or refuse to evolve . As a Spurs addict I respect the past and wish we could repeat some past successes but it is futile I know that looking to the future is the only way we will have success .

How's the hamstring?

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

People keep harping back to the past but in the past
The ball was like a medicine ball when wet ;try heading them balls its why I am dooly ally.

It's Dele Alli and no, you're not him you wombat

 

[Locotoro]

Im not certain about this. Lots of people keep saying it (and without checking their ages) but his best performing players have been those just coming into the prime of their careers (robben, terry, lampard, ozil, Ramos) or in the prime of their careers (makelele, Ronaldo, Etoo, milito). It was only really at inter he bought/had an older team but I think that’s reflective of the game in that country at the time.

You might be right.

Although my point was more about mentality than actual age. Many younger players just don't rise to the challenge mostly because they think they're all that. Whereas if you're at the top end of the game in your late 20s then you most definitely have the right mentality

 

[SUIYHA]

Amazing how one game can change the tone - 48 hours ago Mourinho was a cancer dragging this club to hell, now we're supposedly ready to challenge at the top again.

Beating Arsenal is always fantastic. I'll admit I didn't expect it at all, and the tactics were spot on. People talk about winning trophies but one thing Mourinho has done more consistently well than pretty much anyone in the business is beat Arsenal. Think it's only two defeats in his entire career against them and one was in the Community Shield - even in the year Chelsea imploded and nearly got relegated he still managed to beat them 2-0.

That being said - in isolation this result does not change anything. It was a great experience on the day, great to have the bragging rights, great to have a buzz around the club again. But as I said before the game - the leopard has four games to change his spots, and unless we turn up in all of the remaining three then I'm still going to be sceptical. Defending deep and compact to soak up the pressure and waiting for an error prone to side to make an inevitable mistake will work in a game like this, but it's not a long term strategy of how the team should play - we're going to come up against much more organised defences than Mustafi and Luiz and we're going to come up against teams that commit far less men forward than Arsenal did. I still saw our players taking too many touches on the ball in attacking positions and making poor decisions in the final third.

It's good to hear him acknowledge that the attacking play still needs work. But actions speak louder than words and I await to see how we now play against Newcastle.

 

[slartibartfast]

Lampard had scored 21 league goals for Chelsea in 3 seasons, having played all but 1 league game in that time, before Mourinho joined. He scored 40 across the next 3 seasons.

John Terry was 23 when Mourinho took over, well short of a centre backs prime. Ramos was 24, albeit an exceptional talent, but once again, some years short of a centre backs prime.

Mourinho signed Robben as a 20 year old, and Özil as a 21 year old.

It’s massively false to assert that these players didn’t improve under Mourinho, or if they did it was coincidental, considering the regularity with which players produced their best under his management. Ashley Cole, Drogba, Joe Cole, Essien, Sneijder, even Damien Duff, all produces their best for Mourinho.

He may no longer have it in him, but he was 100% an improver of players in his pomp.

When JM signed Robben etc Chelsea went and bought anybody with a fkin pulse. Ruined a lot of players in the processs and had to have an extension built on the bench. Anyone remotely talented was taken and they weakened half the PL teams in the process. You're not wrong in what you say but this doesnt shows he prefers younger players or older. Just that he has bought younger players when doing supermarket sweep lol.

 

[spursfan77]

What is amusing about the Potter thing is that he was an example, like Nagelsmann, of a highly rated, young attack minded coach. Rather than address the point of the post, which was that Mourinho is a bad fit for Spurs, some people have attacked the hypothetical alternative.

I don't want to brand people as morons because they disagree with me but I would like them to address the argument. Mourinho is a bad fit for Spurs, not a bad manager. He would be acceptable for arsenal who have a proud history of intentionally defending to win but not for us.

Nagelsmann has built a very exciting side at Leipzig and is ready to take the next step, Potter has done well with a limited squad, Nuno Santo is also.capable.

If the counter argument is that these guys don't have the cachet to keep Kane etc then Spaletti is free at the moment and he created a brilliant attacking side at Roma.

Are we going to win things with these managers? I don't know but we have as good a chance as any. With Jose, 26 trophy Jose, we don't know. This is the first time apart from man u that he hasn't competed with a squad of the best players in the league. Man U were horrible to watch.

I think it's because a lot of people have completely missed the point of where we are as a club right now and the suggestion of Potter emphasises that brilliantly. Not where we were 6 years ago, not 2 years ago, right now. We weren't looking for a manager to completely rip up the club and start again with a group of young players like we were when Poch was appointed. We were a club looking for a manager mid season, with a squad full of players either entering the prime of their careers, at the end of it or at the club too long. Plus they were/are a group off players who are obviously hard to motivate because of that. Kane and Son (and I don't dislike Potter btw) aren't staying around for someone like him. Mourinho though, similar to Poch, has the gravitas, ego and command that players usually respond to.

I brought up Pulis yesterday because it was the same then. We weren't looking for that hard line disciplinarian playing structure long ball football, we were looking for a technical coach (LVG) or someone to breathe life into the club (hence we were looking at Martinez, Rodgers and fortunately Poch). Its worth remembering then that (and Poch has said so recently) his brand of football was completely different then to what was being played, now everyone presses from the front, it isn't new, hence we stopped doing it and had problems with the current squad.

Is Mourinho the right coach, I don't know, but I do know that when ENIC go for appointments it is usually for the next shiny new thing (Ramos, AVB, Poch) when not in desperate steaks like we were in the winter. It's why I think Nagelsmann will be our next coach. But and this goes back to my first paragraph, we will more than likely be a completely different club then than we are now under Mourinho. If we aren't and it goes tits up again in November/December then we will get a caretaker in and wait for the following summer for a proper manager.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Amazing how one game can change the tone - 48 hours ago Mourinho was a cancer dragging this club to hell, now we're supposedly ready to challenge at the top again.

I think the people willing to be patient, even sceptics (which most of us are) are still being patient, and those who wanted to stick the knife in have piped down but will be ready should we fail to play well and win tomorrow.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

When JM signed Robben etc Chelsea went and bought anybody with a fkin pulse. Ruined a lot of players in the processs and had to have an extension built on the bench. Anyone remotely talented was taken and they weakened half the PL teams in the process. You're not wrong in what you say but this doesnt shows he prefers younger players or older. Just that he has bought younger players when doing supermarket sweep lol.

I never commented on his preference of player type, only said that it’s false to deny his ability to improve players. His career is littered with examples.

 

[thekneaf]

Not until we win a league title. Then you can bet both your bollocks that nobody will give a fuck how it was done

Exactly this.

 

[Norgie]

Personally I used to be all for the 'Spurs Way' but now I couldn't give a chuff, this club needs to win something and fast. The years tick by and we still cherish this 'Spurs Way'. I am getting to old now and I want to see Spurs win something again and I want my son to see them win something and not hang his head when he goes to school and we have been beaten by one of his mates teams for the last 5 years in a row.