The beginning of the end...

[Coyboy]

Sorry if it has been posted but what was the other ITK apart from Trix and VY?

 

[hellava_tough]

3 ITKs now all saying similar things, not good.

I'm really concerned the issue is where Poch's head is at. For the new project to work he needs to be bang up for it and I'm not sure he is right now. He seems fed up most of the time. If his heart is not in it we are in trouble. Trix's info suggests Poch is a big part of the problem currently. If he is lacking motivation it will trickle down to the players.

Fingers crossed things have improved since the wake up call on Sunday. NLD could be ideal timing to get everyone on the same page...

Who is the third one?

don't have the time to read back true the tread right now, but saw the info from
ValenciaYid and Trix but not a 3rd one...

Appreciate the info

It's actually 4 ITKs:

ValYid - said Poch has lost the dressing room

Hercs - not quite as serious as that, but things aren't great behind the scenes

Ali Z - again, not a total disaster, but not the most settled dressing room

Trix - he hasn't lost the dressing room, but things are far from harmonious

 

[danielneeds]

Agreed. This is the biggest single thing that needs to change at the club imo. Up until now “punching above our weight” has become the mantra of THFC. And whilst it may be technically correct I don’t believe we will start winning things unless we as a club ( board, manager, players and fans alike) expect to do so and see not doing that as a failure.

It's not something you can just flick a switch to do, though. Even City with all their riches have found it takes time to get that winning aura, both the club and the fans. Our fans, well, the ones under 60, have only suffered pain and heartbreak, so of course they're not gonna turn up expecting to win everything.

 

[GetSpurredOn]

Poch has moved us forward significantly on the footballing side. I look back to the end of the AVB era where we played Liverpool and we’re blown away by their tempo and movement off the ball, something that was night and day from the turgid stuff we were playing.
Fast forward to Poch’s arrival, and the subsequent brand of high energy dynamic football was fantastic. The man himself came across as very humble and enthusiastic about building his own legacy at Spurs. The players all clearly played with a hunger about them, eager to deliver for a manager that bonded them into a team. Great times to be a Spurs fan.
Now here we are, the style and brand of football has reverted to AVB’esque, pedestrian and lacking any kind of invention. The manager appears significantly more sullen and lacking spark, much like our playing performances. His press conferences are spiky, and he seems to be (semi) publicly falling out with players. These are not the traits he initially came to the club and instilled. (Some of) The players who would once have walked over hot coals for him appear eager to run down their contracts.
Something is broken within our club. Yes it’s early days in the season, but this slump in performances is not limited to 2019/2020 seasons games only. The back end of last season was the same, and the CL run merely papered over the cracks. We have slumped to numerous defeats against teams we really should be blowing away if we have any aspirations to compete with City and Liverpool. But we have failed to do so because of repeated loss of concentration defensively, and time and again failing to show enough invention or urgency to break down stubborn defences.

I personally hope Poch can get us back playing with the sheer intensity, spirit, discipline and dynamic cutting edge of previous seasons. Style that was synonymous with his early days at the club, and had us the envy of many. On that form, I would choose no other manager at our club. But to do that, he seriously needs to rediscover his mojo, and fast. His moody demeanour does not fill me with confidence this is happening any time soon. The suggestions of Mourinho fill me with even less enthusiasm, he really is not the answer.

Back on form Poch ideally, Allegri maybe, Mourinho please no.

 

[markiespurs]

I just want the smiley, happy, lovable Poch back, the one who had us playing some fantastic, high energy football. The one who had the players and fans dreaming of a bright and successful future.

The grumpy, miserable Poch we have now is just far too negative, which is being translated onto the pitch in our turgid performances.

 

[homer hotspur]

True but its also in their history to win big. We turned up (both club and fans) in Madrid like it was a day out.

It was extremely odd when Poch announced in the build up that he would probably leave if we won. Again, you have to wonder what effect that had on the players. It certainly wasn't what I wanted to hear. I tend to think he would have left and also if we hadn't made top 4 which , really, we shouldn't have, so I get the feeling his mindset has been that way for a while, a bit like several of his squad.

 

[Chinaspur]

If this thread reaches 100 pages does it mean it really is the beginning of the end?

 

[dagraham]

It's not something you can just flick a switch to do, though. Even City with all their riches have found it takes time to get that winning aura, both the club and the fans. Our fans, well, the ones under 60, have only suffered pain and heartbreak, so of course they're not gonna turn up expecting to win everything.

Yeah agreed. I only included fans because I wanted to emphasise that the club needs to change its attitude from top to bottom. I certainly don’t expect to win and am always leaning more on the pessimistic side through painful experience, but I also don’t look for excuses, which I think a section of fans do. It’s the ref/we don’t have the money/we’re always unlucky etc.

I mainly meant the board, manager and the players ( who’s attitude should reflect that of the manager). I personally feel that even if Poch tells them differently in private, the constant reminders that we can’t really compete as we don’t have the resources or other reasons/excuses amount to a drip drip effect to the players. Almost like we try to win, but nothing is really expected of us.

I believe I know why Poch does it. He’s a smart man and wants to deflect the questions if anything to take the pressure off himself and in a way I don’t blame him.

But it’s an easy safety net for the players in my view.

 

[Blackrat1299]

If this thread reaches 100 pages does it mean it really is the beginning of the end?

As Churchill said, Its the end of the beginning!

 

[McFlash]

What's pissing me off is that with the new stadium and some top signings, I was really excited about this season.
It's all gone moody really quickly.

 

[doctor stefan Freud]

What's pissing me off is that with the new stadium and some top signings, I was really excited about this season.
It's all gone moody really quickly.

 

[Spursfan1414]

I’m sorry mate no offence but all I see in your post is loads of excuses. The poor performances speak for themselves. People see what they want to see I guess. I’m not saying you’re wrong, it’s just the way we choose to interpret what we see. You are choosing to believe their were justified reasons why we’ve been playing so poorly for so long, and if you asked me in May I’d have possibly been with you, but it’s continued this season which is now setting alarm bells ringing. No one is panicking yet but it’s worrying.

It's been three games and Aston Villa wasn't even a particularly bad performance, we deserved to win that. Sometimes excuses are actually valid, there's not been a point in the last 4 years where not having both Dele and Eriksen wouldn't have caused us to play substantially worse for example, you can't just write stuff like that off as "a load of excuses".

If you'd have been prepared to believe in May that there were justified reasons for us playing badly then it's a bit weird not to be prepared to believe them 3 games later when those same reasons are still affecting the team that we can put out.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

I am not blabbering about something or am I. I never implied that ever.

I think we can agree that you are in fact blabbering a little bit.

 

[Coco-1101]

I think we can agree that you are in fact blabbering a little bit.

Ok.

 

[Trix]

But we’d still be stuck with Levy even if Poch goes. Which manager can be successful on the pitch at the level we now demand with him negotiating all our transfers?

Fans now want us challenging for the title, not going to happen just with a change of manager.

I’ve seen it all on this thread, some even believe Poch has had the same backing as Klopp and Pep ?

Levy is levy get that, but Poch got all 3 in that he wanted. Yes he had to wait but he got all 3.

 

[JAYSTAR]

It was extremely odd when Poch announced in the build up that he would probably leave if we won. Again, you have to wonder what effect that had on the players. It certainly wasn't what I wanted to hear. I tend to think he would have left and also if we hadn't made top 4 which , really, we shouldn't have, so I get the feeling his mindset has been that way for a while, a bit like several of his squad.

Maybe he was trying a Theresa May, by promising to leave if the lost dressing room (government) would just back him one last time?!

 

[Ronwol196061]

It was extremely odd when Poch announced in the build up that he would probably leave if we won. Again, you have to wonder what effect that had on the players. It certainly wasn't what I wanted to hear. I tend to think he would have left and also if we hadn't made top 4 which , really, we shouldn't have, so I get the feeling his mindset has been that way for a while, a bit like several of his squad.

It seems ridiculous to think Poch said that seriously then convinced a 100 Mil worth of players to come to us

 

[Ronwol196061]

If this thread reaches 100 pages does it mean it really is the beginning of the end?

The beginning of something Novel

 

[richard_gleeson]

Agreed. This is the biggest single thing that needs to change at the club imo. Up until now “punching above our weight” has become the mantra of THFC. And whilst it may be technically correct I don’t believe we will start winning things unless we as a club ( board, manager, players and fans alike) expect to do so and see not doing that as a failure.

Then we need to get in Mourinho and hope the old version turns up. Or hope Poch wins a trophy soon.
Or we will just be a "punching above our weight, hope club"

 

[Ronwol196061]

Then we need to get in Mourinho and hope the old version turns up. Or hope Poch wins a trophy soon.
Or we will just be a "punching above our weight, hope club"

What system would Mourinho play?
Defence? He would have to spend 150 M for the back line at least.
5 heavyweights across the middle? 200m
We then would need 250 m creative players