Jose Mourinho

Aphex · Apr 6, 2021

Does anyone really think us signing a CB, a CM and a RB will really see us "kick on" next season under Jose? There is absolutely no evidence we are or ever will be kicking on under him.

If he stays this summer, next season will be toxic as hell and he will get sacked mid season, will be yet another wasted season.

midoshairband · Apr 6, 2021

daryl hannah said:
Unpopular opinion - I'm not necessarily #JoseIN however in response to Trix' earlier post - I'd actually rather Jose was still around this summer to force a rebuild and overhaul. There is absolutely no point going another season with the same personnel. WInks, Sissoko, Dier, Dele, Lamela really do need to go - they've had a good crack at the whip for the last 5+ years and we've won nothing. Poch knew the squad needed refreshing. Jose knows it. How long until Nagelsmann knows it? The definition of insanity... How many mistakes has Dier made (games in a row) recently? How great was Winks' substitute appearance? (The worst, ever?). Was Sissoko at all effective against Zagreb? I cba with next season watching the same players happen over and over agian.

A couple of new centre backs and a new right back and CM would really help us to kick on again. Otherwise it'll be a case of round and round we go...

my issue with that is do i trust Jose to buy the right players? do i wamt him to spend our (probably) limited budget on buying players to suit a negative, defensive style of play?

or do we take the risk of appointing someone new, giving them our limited budget, amd seeing how we go?

the only positive i could make, and it’s a bit of a reach, is that if he was in charge of a ‘rebuild’ he’s hopefully already made his mind up on Winks, Dier, Sissoko, Sanchez, Doherty etc and they will be shipped out. i don’t want to afford them the chance to pull the wool over a new managers eyes.

fishhhandaricecake · Apr 6, 2021

DenverSpur said:
Like that comment or not it’s true.
First goal mistake by Tanganga, mistake by Sanchez, mistake by Regullion for not being in his defense position there yet leaving Rodon as lone defender in the box, mistake by the midfield that no one came back to help protect the box. That’s a least four individual mistakes.
Second goal: Tanganga fails to stop cross, Regullion fails to prevent header back across goal, Sanchez and Rodon between them fail to close down one player and clear the ball and Lamela and LoCelso stood and watched Wilock run past them from the half way line to into our six yard box fir a tap in. That’s 6 individual errors. For both goals if just one player had done his job correctly it’s unlikely Newcastle score.
You can heap all the blame you want on the manager but it doesn’t change the fact that we did not win because numerous players made individual errors that lead to goals against. You can also add that Lamela twice made individual errors by failing to release the ball to players in goal scoring positions. If he had we may have had a 2 or 3 goal cushion going into the last 5 minutes.
You can blame the manager for many things but he can’t be held responsible for people not doing their job. And before people go on about it’s his job to set the tactics, etc etc these players are highly paid individuals who’ve for the most part have played at the highest level for a number of years so the manager has every right to expect them to know and be competent with basic football skills and positioning on the field in various scenarios. Do managers at top tech or high finance companies need to hold the hands of their highly paid subordinates and keep instructing them the basics of their jobs?
The tactical influence of managers is overrated. Ferguson wasn’t a tactical genius, neither was Dalgleish, Shankly or many other successful managers. What they were good at was getting good players with the right attitude and forging them into a unit. Dalgleish and Mourinhofor example didn’t buy the title they just used the money to get the right type of players they could mold into a winning unit. Having the money and a good manager helps but ultimately it’s the players who win games and titles but if the players don’t have a winning mentality the team won’t win much and that has been the problem at Tottenham for decades - too many powder puff players who fold when the going gets tough. That’s why we continually drop points against Weaker teams and wilt in big pressure games - eight FA Cup Semi-Final defeats in a row is a true reflection of what sort of a club we are and nearly 15 managers since Bill Nick haven’t been able to make us winners

yea fair points mate well made, although you don't hear many other managers in the PL go on about mistakes as much as Jose does and it just cannot be good for confidence or morale, you win and lose as a team at the end of the day.

daryl hannah · Apr 6, 2021

Aphex said:
Does anyone really think us signing a CB, a CM and a RB will really see us "kick on" next season under Jose? There is absolutely no evidence we are or ever will be kicking on under him.

If he stays this summer, next season will be toxic as hell and he will get sacked mid season, will be yet another wasted season.

But at least error prone players will have been moved on. Some of them have been here 8 years. You still have the ability to sack the manager next season. But at least you'll have shipped out the deadwood.

spurs mental · Apr 6, 2021

-Afri-Coy- said:
It's good to see the chaos is once again prevalent now that the international break is over.

In all honesty though, if we do finish 4th and win CC, can we say this season was a success despite the ups and downs? Genuine question here, I am curious to see where everyone lands on this.

I'd say yes. We'd have ticked two boxes that we all would have taken at the start of the season. Trophy and CL football next season.

Many others will say no. No phases or patterns of play visible in our games. Jose is a very naughty boy. The CC changes nothing.

And maybe it doesn't change much in the grand scheme but it gets the won nothing monkey off a lot of our players backs. And that in itself is a release of pressure for a bucket load of them

Aphex · Apr 6, 2021

daryl hannah said:
But at least error prone players will have been moved on. Some of them have been here 8 years. You still have the ability to sack the manager next season. But at least you'll have shipped out the deadwood.

So we potentially waste a whole new season just because we can't hire a new manager in the summer AND kick out the deadwood?

Makes no sense. I know managers want to evaluate the squad but surely the club could just tell JN for example, look we have some players who just aren't up to it and have been the same under Poch and Jose, we are selling to raise funds to bring in players you would like. Do we think JN won't agree to that? I can't imagine JN is looking at our squad and licking his lips at the thought of working with Winks, Dier and Sissoko.

DOX · Apr 6, 2021

I fully confess that I've been in the "Horrified - praying for the day he'll fuck off" camp from the very get-go. But holy f*ck, it's even worse than ever imagined. The problem is, he got Enic by the wallet*, especially due to the current Covid-19 situation. As much as I'd like him being sacked, it probably won't happen before the start/mid of next season, when it's no longer even an option, and we've lost all of our key players. And no, I'm not talking about Sissoko or Dier.

*Daniel & Joe's balls.

Teddy Klinsmann · Apr 6, 2021

-Afri-Coy- said:
It's good to see the chaos is once again prevalent now that the international break is over.

In all honesty though, if we do finish 4th and win CC, can we say this season was a success despite the ups and downs? Genuine question here, I am curious to see where everyone lands on this.

Its funny, in terms of actual success, it would be our most successful season since the start of the PL - a cup and top 4. You offered any of us that at the start of the season, we’d have snapped at it.

nidge · Apr 6, 2021

Teddy Klinsmann said:
Its funny, in terms of actual success, it would be our most successful season since the start of the PL - a cup and top 4. You offered any of us that at the start of the season, we’d have snapped at it.

i think it would be a sigh of relief if we managed top 4 at this stage of the season.

As for the Cup beating this Man City team in a final would be some achievement.

Everlasting Seconds · Apr 6, 2021

-Afri-Coy- said:
It's good to see the chaos is once again prevalent now that the international break is over.

In all honesty though, if we do finish 4th and win CC, can we say this season was a success despite the ups and downs? Genuine question here, I am curious to see where everyone lands on this.

I don't care about the cup final, but qualifying for CL, that would equal succeeding. After that we can argue whether it was Mourinho who managed to pull it off or whether it was the players despite their weak mentality who managed to pull it off.

Styopa · Apr 6, 2021

spurs mental said:
I'd say yes. We'd have ticked two boxes that we all would have taken at the start of the season. Trophy and CL football next season.

Many others will say no. No phases or patterns of play visible in our games. Jose is a very naughty boy. The CC changes nothing.

And maybe it doesn't change much in the grand scheme but it gets the won nothing monkey off a lot of our players backs. And that in itself is a release of pressure for a bucket load of them

If we make the top four this season it will be largely a result of our competitors underachieving. The fact West Ham led by David Moyes are in serious contention says it all.

Will Chelsea and Liverpool both be as poor next season as they have been this season? I seriously doubt it.

Have I seen anything in the last 18 months to suggest we will improve if Mourinho is given another season? Not really.

chrisd2k · Apr 6, 2021

Fixtures are the reason now? We had to qualify for the Europa at the start granted but really?

I look at the team and there's no plan other than Harry or Son will do something.

spurs mental · Apr 6, 2021

Styopa said:
If we make the top four this season it will be largely a result of our competitors underachieving. The fact West Ham led by David Moyes are in serious contention says it all.

Will Chelsea and Liverpool both be as poor next season as they have been this season? I seriously doubt it.

Have I seen anything in the last 18 months to suggest we will improve if Mourinho is given another season? Not really.

What? Your reply has literally little or no relevance to what I posted, nor what I was responding to.

All I said was if we won the CC and finished top 4 it would be a successful season. At no point did I mention Jose staying on, Jose going.

The only thing relevant is that you've said our competitors have underperformed, alongside us. Will Leicester and West Ham overperform next season? I doubt it.

You can only beat what's in front of you. It's nobodies fault but their own that those clubs have faltered, no matter how you paint it.

Styopa · Apr 6, 2021

nidge said:
As for the Cup beating this Man City team in a final would be some achievement.

It certainly would be an upset, but it's definitely possible in a one off game. Still, Mourinho has a terrible record in the cup competitions since he arrived.

With the exception of a penalty shoot out win versus Chelsea, we have gone out to most half decent sides we have come up against: Leipizig, Norwich, Everton and Zagreb. The only other exception I can think of is the replay win versus Southampton.

rossdapep · Apr 6, 2021

carpediem991 said:
Stop this nonsense if that eleven would have started in the last year of Poch they would have had no chance. We were flying at that time with a great spirit and self confidence. And we were not able to maintain that and build up on this. And there are mainly Poch and Levy at fault because the fall started about a year before Jose.

You're right about the fall out times.

But to be fair to Poch we were in poor form and performances in the league around this time to. After we beat Dortmund we went on that dreadful run and prior to Dortmund we'd scraped past Fulham, Newcastle and Watford with poor performances. The rot had already started to set. We certainly weren't flying and weren't close to peak Poch, which had started to drop the year prior I felt.

So to be able to get that result vs Dortmund was actually quite incredible.

I think Poch still had the players on his side in the CL and that's testament to the mentality he created. But once the final was finished he'd lost them all.

Styopa · Apr 6, 2021

spurs mental said:
What? Your reply has literally little or no relevance to what I posted, nor what I was responding to.

All I said was if we won the CC and finished top 4 it would be a successful season. At no point did I mention Jose staying on, Jose going.

The only thing relevant is that you've said our competitors have underperformed, alongside us. Will Leicester and West Ham overperform next season? I doubt it.

You can only beat what's in front of you. It's nobodies fault but their own that those clubs have faltered, no matter how you paint it.

Sorry mate, I misread the post you quoted. My apologies.

Your points above are fair enough. However regarding Leicester, I don't actually think they are overperforming that much. I just think they're probably a better side than us right now. Maye not third best but definitely top 5 or 6 even with a stronger Chelsea and Liverpool.

neogenisis · Apr 6, 2021

-Afri-Coy- said:
It's good to see the chaos is once again prevalent now that the international break is over.

In all honesty though, if we do finish 4th and win CC, can we say this season was a success despite the ups and downs? Genuine question here, I am curious to see where everyone lands on this.

On paper yes, but its abit like pulling a top bird at the pub, drilling her all night long, then the next evening you start to feel the burning and itching of an STI.
Winning the CC and top 4 is just not the whole story. Jose is not what we need period.

rossdapep · Apr 6, 2021

teok said:
Chelsea had their centre back red carded after 30 mins then pulisic did his hamstring just before half time. That to me seems bad day at the office in an already rotated team. Look at the rest of their results under him.

Agreed.

Under Lampard they were making regular mistakes and looked disorganised.

Tuchel has improved the structure immediately and a lot of mistakes have disappeared because of that. The players look more focused and assured. Don't think they have a particularly good defence either.

So whilst Sanchez and Dier are not the answer and are capable of stupid errors, I also think a better structure would help paper over the cracks somewhat.

Deleted member 29446 · Apr 6, 2021

daryl hannah said:
But at least error prone players will have been moved on. Some of them have been here 8 years. You still have the ability to sack the manager next season. But at least you'll have shipped out the deadwood.

Who says a new manager can't or will do that? I'm sure if they are going to be the next manager, that they will have done a lot of research on our squad. At least Levy should be able to see things clearer.

Saoirse · Apr 6, 2021

chrisd2k said:
Fixtures are the reason now? We had to qualify for the Europa at the start granted but really?

I look at the team and there's no plan other than Harry or Son will do something.

Not to mention that we only had to play Europa qualifying because of Jose's below-par performance last season

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