Bobby TwoShots
Well-Known Member
- Aug 8, 2019
- 500
- 1,839
Think you're forgetting Lloris pulled off a worldie. But anyway, glad you're happy with a point. I wanted us to bust a gut trying to get all 3.
Jose Mourinho
- Thread starter TwanYid
- Start date
Ionman34
SC Supporter
- Jun 1, 2011
- 7,182
- 16,793
The comparison wasn't mine, it was in response to us being compared to them so...
Our counter attacking, especially Bergwijn‘s pace, had them scared so I cannot fathom why Sessegnon wasn’t introduced.
Massive finger pointing at the manager for me.
Ionman34
SC Supporter
- Jun 1, 2011
- 7,182
- 16,793
That's what you build towards. He can't just wave a magic wand and have them playing that way in the limited time he's had.
So many on here saying he's had half a season to do this, but when? Before Covid he had games coming thick and fast, no time to work with the players. Then Covid hit and no one was allowed on the training pitches to train, they just had to maintain their fitness as best they could at home.
Now he's had what, a week or 2 to work with them? Even in that short period of time we can see that he's beginning to implement cohesion, even Keane commented on how organised we looked. We weren't able to maintain that and dropped deeper, whether that was due to fatigue or instruction I don't know, neither does anyone else. It didn't help that both Kane and Son were effectively passengers and, if any criticism is to be levelled at Mourinho, it should be for not hooking one or both of them to gain 2 extra fresh bodies.
Regardless, I can see what he is trying to do, get that solidity and cohesion in our defensive work, THAT is the foundation you build a team on. It takes time and it's never pretty, but he's building for the long game.
Japhet
Well-Known Member
- Aug 30, 2010
- 19,303
- 57,734
It would be rather odd if the team went in at halftime with pretty good energy, then came out 2nd half and were immediately fatigued and then somehow regained their energy once Utd had equalized. Seems pretty obvious to me it was an instruction.
Ionman34
SC Supporter
- Jun 1, 2011
- 7,182
- 16,793
We've seen exactly that under Poch, great one half, poor the next. We've even seen them out there in the 1st half looking like strangers then looking like World beaters in the 2nd half.
Were these instructions too?
I don't know where the issues lie, neither do you. The difference is I'm not jumping to conclusions.
All I do know is that I'm seeing small but noticeable fruits of the limited time he's had with the squad, where it appears he has them beginning to work cohesively as a defensive unit. I don't expect us to completely shut out an opposition so they create zero chances, so Lloris making saves I expect. He's also part of the defensive unit, so they pretty much got the job done. Having a penalty, that I vehemently maintain wasn't, awarded against us spoiled the hard work that was put in, but that wasn't even a chance created. The 2 main chances they created both came in the 1st half so, despite us dropping off, they really created nothing of note in the 2nd half.
Tuesday will tell us more about whether the cohesion is setting in, as 1 game isn't anywhere near a true barometer, but I'm hopeful.
At the end of the day I desperately want him to succeed, because his success is our success, but I don't expect it overnight, unlike some. Nor do I expect our Football to be particularly pretty whilst he goes about building the team effectively from the ground up. But once he's got that solidity in place, I do expect to see us get better going forward, as he'll have built the foundation for it.
parj
NDombelly ate all the pies
- Jul 27, 2003
- 3,698
- 6,049
Do you honestly think playing with the current tactics will win us anything? We can't beat mid table teams now.
Playing positive football, JM got us the second in-form team. It was working.
Playing negative we have gone backwards.
Blueluigi6
Well-Known Member
- Aug 8, 2019
- 197
- 1,002
Are Manchester United a mid table team? I feel like people were always on Poch about not changing tactics based on who the opposition were, but when Mourinho plays defensively against a united team that were on a roll pre-covid, there are complaints?
kendoddsdadsdogsdead
Well-Known Member
- Aug 29, 2011
- 2,217
- 3,757
I get what your saying in principle but the issue is, is he building towards being more proactive or is that just how he wants to play especially against the better teams. It’s completely different as a defender playing in a low block with a lot of protection than playing higher up the pitch. If that’s the way he wants to play eventually should we be working on defending higher up the pitch as a unit because it’s a completely different way of defending.
I normally don’t like comparing other teams especially Liverpool and klopp but when he first came they were shipping a lot of goals, more than us probably but he didn’t just get everyone behind the ball ceding possession. He got them defending from the front as a unit higher up the pitch, they wanted more of the ball so their better players could do damage and eventually added a couple of defensive signings but their way of playing/defending hasn’t changed.
I just think this is how he wants us to play against the better sides in the league and if people are happy with that fine, but Im not going to try and convince myself he’s building into doing something else in these types of games.
I remember the early years ( not months ) of Ferguson and he was one match away from being sacked .
I remember the year Everton won the league for about 6 games in they were bottom of the league when Howard Kendall was manager .
The game is littered with people that were poor at the start of their reign only to go onto be very successful .
Our own Burkenshaw some would say was lucky not to get the tin tack .
For goodness sake chill out and give the man at least a chance to succeed ; surely the time to judge is at the end of next season when he has had the chance to put his own stamp on the squad all be it with mostly players out of contract .
He is not the manager of my choice but to go against him is to go against spurs as a club and my feelings is he will have my backing unless he becomes untenable due to results after a long series of bad results with no signs of improvement .
By the way for myself in the United game there were some positive signs with the defence and teams that are good are almost always built on a solid defence . Unfortunately we do not have a natural defensive midfielder if we had one I believe we dont concede that United goal.
I remember the year Everton won the league for about 6 games in they were bottom of the league when Howard Kendall was manager .
The game is littered with people that were poor at the start of their reign only to go onto be very successful .
Our own Burkenshaw some would say was lucky not to get the tin tack .
For goodness sake chill out and give the man at least a chance to succeed ; surely the time to judge is at the end of next season when he has had the chance to put his own stamp on the squad all be it with mostly players out of contract .
He is not the manager of my choice but to go against him is to go against spurs as a club and my feelings is he will have my backing unless he becomes untenable due to results after a long series of bad results with no signs of improvement .
By the way for myself in the United game there were some positive signs with the defence and teams that are good are almost always built on a solid defence . Unfortunately we do not have a natural defensive midfielder if we had one I believe we dont concede that United goal.
kaz Hirai
Well-Known Member
- Nov 5, 2008
- 17,692
- 25,340
Every time a manager has a bad start that old Alex Ferguson tale comes up .
That happened in the 20th century, in a different Division, with less completion and less pressure.
Soon be half a century ago
Is there no better modern take than that old testament stone engraving
I guess the disagrees mean there aren't any
Last edited:
Metalhead
But that's a debate for another thread.....
- Nov 24, 2013
- 25,483
- 38,600
Here's an up to date take on it then. If anyone thinks that Levy is anywhere near the stage of sacking Jose so that we can get this mythical 'Spurs' way back then they are deluded.
kaz Hirai
Well-Known Member
- Nov 5, 2008
- 17,692
- 25,340
Metalhead
But that's a debate for another thread.....
- Nov 24, 2013
- 25,483
- 38,600
A take on something is an opinion. It's how I see it.Lol That's not an up to date take on it at all, that's just your opinion
Ionman34
SC Supporter
- Jun 1, 2011
- 7,182
- 16,793
I'm not asking you to convince yourself, and you do have a point regarding how Klopp initially set up, but Mourinho isn't Klopp and the team he has isn't the same, so comparisons of that sort aren't really fair.
Having said that, Klopp's returns in his first 3 seasons were pretty ordinary, with pool never really looking like they'd challenge.
All I'm really saying here is that it's taken him 5 seasons to get where he is now, and he's had to make his own adjustments as he's gone along. Initially he tried to implement the "gegenpress" that everyone was banging on about and his teams burned out with a third of a season still to go. He's made his mistakes too, but he's been given time to get it right. Many of our "supporters" can't even give our manager half a season to get things working, and he's inherited a lot more issues than Klopp ever did.
Mourinho's track record, with regard to the Football his teams play when he's got his mix and methods right, speaks for itself. Whilst he has been pragmatic regarding certain fixtures in the past, mostly his teams have dominated and scored bundles of goals. We all accept he's not going to get the same financial backing he's received in the past, so why is it so hard to allow him the time to work with what he's got to make the sum greater than the parts? Christ, it took Poch night on 3 seasons to do that himself.
rossdapep
Well-Known Member
- Aug 25, 2011
- 22,339
- 80,478
Sess is a very different player to Bergwijn though. He's not a rapid winger who can play high and keep defenders on their toes.
He's better at arriving in the penalty area late and supporting attacks in the construction. In a game like Friday, you want him playing deeper.
rossdapep
Well-Known Member
- Aug 25, 2011
- 22,339
- 80,478
Let's be honest....
Having watched Spurs over the last year, what would have been the first thing you'd try to fix?
If it was me, it would have been the defence and the terrible mistakes we'd been making. Mistakes that had been happening very frequently in Poch's last year.
Start with that, build stability and grow confidence then work on helping players become more destructive in attack.
Having watched Spurs over the last year, what would have been the first thing you'd try to fix?
If it was me, it would have been the defence and the terrible mistakes we'd been making. Mistakes that had been happening very frequently in Poch's last year.
Start with that, build stability and grow confidence then work on helping players become more destructive in attack.
- Feb 1, 2005
- 55,657
- 205,649
- Admin
- #12,118
"The great fallacy is that the game is first and last about winning. It is nothing of the kind. The game is about glory, it is about doing things in style and with a flourish, about going out and beating the lot, not waiting for them to die of boredom."
I guess we should throw that in the dustbin too
kaz Hirai
Well-Known Member
- Nov 5, 2008
- 17,692
- 25,340
"The great fallacy is that the game is first and last about winning. It is nothing of the kind. The game is about glory, it is about doing things in style and with a flourish, about going out and beating the lot, not waiting for them to die of boredom."
I guess we should throw that in the dustbin too
Why?
Kaz Hirai are you saying that you cannot learn anything from history and you are not willing to learn from things of the past ?
All I can say is that view is very short sighted and judging people in a knee jerk kind of way or disposing of everything that does not work straight away is crass and in my view stupid . There is a lot to learn from the past however old fashion it may seem and judging people before they have been given a fair chance is one thing that should be taken into account .
Anybody looking for instant success really needs to be supporting clubs that can almost guarantee that outcome namely the oil rich clubs with vast sums of money that enables them first pick of the worlds best clubs like Chelsea ( Abramovich ) the Arab oil rich who own Man City
Juventus PSG and now Everton and possibly Newcastle they can give you instant success with their wealth which gives them the ability to pay massive transfers and massive wages . Anybody supporting spurs who wants success instantly is in for a rude awakening .
Clubs like ours will have to learn to be patient unless of course someone like Amazon takes us over then we can join the instant success club
All I can say is that view is very short sighted and judging people in a knee jerk kind of way or disposing of everything that does not work straight away is crass and in my view stupid . There is a lot to learn from the past however old fashion it may seem and judging people before they have been given a fair chance is one thing that should be taken into account .
Anybody looking for instant success really needs to be supporting clubs that can almost guarantee that outcome namely the oil rich clubs with vast sums of money that enables them first pick of the worlds best clubs like Chelsea ( Abramovich ) the Arab oil rich who own Man City
Juventus PSG and now Everton and possibly Newcastle they can give you instant success with their wealth which gives them the ability to pay massive transfers and massive wages . Anybody supporting spurs who wants success instantly is in for a rude awakening .
Clubs like ours will have to learn to be patient unless of course someone like Amazon takes us over then we can join the instant success club
Similar threads
- Locked
- Sticky
