The Mauricio Pochettino thread

[bubble07]

Maybe I’m wrong, but didn’t we agree to sell Wanyama? I thought the issue was he couldn’t agree personal terms with Brugge?

Correct. But asking 50m for Eriksen wasnt happening.

 

[Spurs' Pipe Dreams]

I think it was @Spurs' Pipe Dreams who used a similar analogy in the Brexit thread regarding eating out at restaurants and I think it could apply here too, so, sorry SPD for applying it differently.

You're taking Poch out for dinner for the night, and take him to your favourite restaurant and you're paying. He's gets shown a menu and you ask him what he'd like. He says he doesn't like anything on the menu. You leave and ask him what restaurant he'd like to go to. He's not bothered. He starts to get in a bit of a mood. You take him to a new restaurant, he's still being a bit moody, and doesn't like anything on this menu either. He starts moaning to the waiter that other restaurants have food he likes, so you offer to take him there. He doesn't want to go now.

You give up and get a cab. Poch sits there in a mood, so you ask him wtf he's so moody. He says 'I'm hungry'.

Wasn't me, I think it's Jay Rayner's analogy about going to a fish restaurant and Brexit. Thanks for thinking of me though

I still want Poch to stay fwiw, I think Eriksen, Toby, Jan and a little bit Danny are toxic currently, the problem is that Poch isn't making the hard decisions as he did with Ade, Benteleb, Benoit when he first joined. If you are not bought into the project then you stay away from the first team (even if they are some of our best players).

Dele and Dier being out of form haven't helped either but then they're not getting the minutes to play themselves into form. KWP is back from injury but didn't play today or on the bench.

We all know Poh is a great coach and a learning manager who makes mistakes, normally players improve under his coaching but some of them, namely the four I mentioned above are going backwards, so they're obviously not doing it in training.

I know everyone's got a bit of a hard-on for Ndombele currently but for me, apart from a couple of through passes and flicks, he's been very disappointing, he goes missing for great periods of games and can be lax coming back, £60m+ player he currently isn't showing atm.

Sheeeit we're in a slump, it happens but for me and I know people will disagree, if we get rid, I don't think anyone we can get in will be better than Mauricio. So we might have to put up with a fairly average (not shit) season. In which we're battling with Arsenal, Yanited, Chelsea and Leicester for the 3/4 positions, it's just all 5 teams will be massively behind Liverpool and City, which is a shame because with our signings I hoped to push on this year. TA, CE, JV need to sign new contracts or fuck off, to put it bluntly, and Serge can fuck right away from my club because he's shit and stupid.

I think Aaron Ramsay getting a reported £600k a week in Italy on a Bosman has turned a few players heads and agents for that matter, he's an alright player but that's 3 x times what reportedly Kane is on and 3 x what we have offered to Eriksen (again reportedly). Taking footballers back to being human for a second, if you could triple or quadruple your wages for doing the exact same job anyone would take it, I know it's different because of the emotion of football, especially for fans but in reality what loyalty do the foreign or bought from another English club have for Tottenham, none of them live there, were brought up in the club or even supported the club growing up. Asking for loyalty is a hiding to nothing but we do want them to do their job properly and currently, we're not getting that.

I'm old enough to remember us being a midtable team, working out in March that if we won every game until the end of the season we might just scrape a UEFA cup place, heady days...but let's be honest here, we have had a great run over the last few seasons, with 2 almost 3 actual title challenges, a few semis and even a CL final. Before Poch came in we had 1 CL appearance and that team had Modric, Bale and VDV, Poch has taken us to the CL for the last 4 years, a part of me thinks that players, fans and maybe even the manager have forgotten how much hard work it was to get there and expecting it to happen as a matter of normality now.

Fans expectation has risen massively, so much so that a CL final and a top 4 finish last year is seen by some as a disappointing season, I get the away form died off but the Man City and Ajax games were away fixtures and those were two of my best ever nights supporting this great club.

Will Poch make the hard decisions? Will some of the players start giving a fuck? Will Serge be the first man to have a brain transplant? Shit...I don't know.

What I will say though, is that we don't have a divine right to win every game and for the sake of everyone's sanity, we as fans getting angry, frustrated and taking it out on other people, be that friends, family or work colleagues does not help anyone. Spurs losing used to put me in a foul mood and even affect my mental health, the thing I realised a while ago, is that I have no control over Tottenham Hotspur FC, my few hundred quid I chuck at the club doesn't entitle me to be hateful or vitriolic to people doing their job. Basically, what I'm saying is enjoy the wins but don't take the defeats personally, have banter with opposition fans but don't let it get nasty, you only get one life on this planet and don't let some millionaires losing a game ruin your weekend, go out, have some fun...shit now I'm just babbling bollocks...anyway Poch might leave, he might turn it around, I don't get to change any of that, so I'll just enjoy the ride.

Apols @soup started typing and couldn't stop until it all came out

 

[Spurs_Bear]

To be fair Bear, things did change after the CL final. We increased players wages, but spent ‘big’ for Levy, and went big for Dybala.

I actually think he will spend better now we are in the stadium.

Depends what you believe about Dybala I guess Matthew...

 

[alfie103]

There’s nothing astonishing about it. Read what I said, not absolving Poch of all blame just saying it’s been fun and time for next cab off the rank.

Oh and I think I said Levy is a fucking ****. My reasoning for that is because Levy is a fucking ****.

Why do you think Levy is a ****?

 

[journeyman]

I was very much “Poch in” before today. But I’m starting to wonder now if he can fix it. That was shocking today. 3 humiliating results in last 4 games. But worse, a league record stretching back to 23 Feb that reads:

P 20; W6; D4; L10

I would still give Poch the next set of games before the Nov international break to try to turn this round. He has been a terrific manager for us and deserves that chance.

But people saying this is all Levy or the players’ fault are wrong. A big share of the blame for our league performances in 2019 is Poch’s. We may have 3 big players running down contracts, but Poch added to that uncertainty himself with all those press conferences towards the end of last season and in the summer questioning his own role and future. And the buck ultimately stops with the manager - he is the one charged with making sure the players perform. And we have a squad of 26/27 who should be performing to a much higher standard than they are currently.

So, more time in my view, but not indefinitely so. We need to see evidence in next few games that he can arrest this slide. It’s head over heart, but I would rather finish 4th with Allegri than 6th with Poch.

 

[fortworthspur]

Not a problem. They’ll all be gone next summer...

this is the real nightmare scenario. Finishing 8th and crashing out of the group stage of the CL is just one season.

 

[dricha1]

So a genuine question to those still backing Poch or willing to give him time. Taking into consideration our form since December 18, picking up only 2 points from a possible 30 away from home and being the 18th worst team in the league during that period.

What would be the last straw, genuinely would finishing 14-17th be deemed as a failure as, unfortunately for us, that is where we are heading. We play Watford next who are terrible but I can’t see us winning so possibly one point, then we go away to Liverpool where we will be absolutely ripped apart and have 12 points after 10 games.

not just picking on this post but haven’t we beat Everton, Cardiff and Fulham away from home since mid-December so that’s at least 9pts add away wins against Dortmund and Ajax?

There have been away defeats but I’d only put today’s down as totally unacceptable.

Burnley Away - Mike Deaned
Southampton - Rose brain fart (maybe this is what Poch started to see about his squad and painful rebuild)

Liverpool - last minute Lloris f*** up

Chelsea - trippier disaster

City - we actually played well few days after CL game

Bournemouth - ended up with 9 men...should have had pen and chance to equalise

Leicester this season - var

This is not to let Poch off the hook completely, but the players need to share the blame also. The Chpions league final was there for Eriksen to step- up and grab the game by the scruff of its neck. He didn’t. He’s no elite player. The other wantaways might be sniping to their agents that they can’t play the way Poch wants them too, but isn’t this what Poch knows himself. Physically these players are shot and they are not realistically moving upwards they are heading towards an easier European league such as Holland, France or Belgium - hardly moving to a top club?

What does Poch do? Drop them completely? He should and its what I’d do, but then he’ll have 5/6 players sniping from the u23 squad and constant bad press.

Levy should back Poch, tell him he has his backing to sideline the bad eggs, get the new signings fully integrated, recharge Dier, Alli & Sanchez and get back to his philosophy of hard work and the press. We might lose more games, but long term we’d be better for it

 

[rossdapep]

not just picking on this post but haven’t we beat Everton, Cardiff and Fulham away from home since mid-December so that’s at least 9pts add away wins against Dortmund and Ajax?

There have been away defeats but I’d only put today’s down as totally unacceptable.

Burnley Away - Mike Deaned
Southampton - Rose brain fart (maybe this is what Poch started to see about his squad and painful rebuild)

Liverpool - last minute Lloris f*** up

Chelsea - trippier disaster

City - we actually played well few days after CL game

Bournemouth - ended up with 9 men...should have had pen and chance to equalise

Leicester this season - var

This is not to let Poch off the hook completely, but the players need to share the blame also. The Chpions league final was there for Eriksen to step- up and grab the game by the scruff of its neck. He didn’t. He’s no elite player. The other wantaways might be sniping to their agents that they can’t play the way Poch wants them too, but isn’t this what Poch knows himself. Physically these players are shot and they are not realistically moving upwards they are heading towards an easier European league such as Holland, France or Belgium - hardly moving to a top club?

What does Poch do? Drop them completely? He should and its what I’d do, but then he’ll have 5/6 players sniping from the u23 squad and constant bad press.

Levy should back Poch, tell him he has his backing to sideline the bad eggs, get the new signings fully integrated, recharge Dier, Alli & Sanchez and get back to his philosophy of hard work and the press. We might lose more games, but long term we’d be better for it

Mistakes happen when players aren't 100% focused.

When a pattern emerges it hints at deeper issues. Teams can go through spells where luck isn't on your side but certainly not this long.

To be honest I'm fed up with the excuses. We have a new one every week.

 

[OPModric]

There has been lots of negative influences over the last 2 years and the blame sits at more than one door ...

• Poch wrote a book about his current players.
• We have moved stadium twice in two years.
• We suffered badly from a WC hangover last season, with 9 players involved in the WC Semi Finals and missed pre-season, followed by an injury plagued season with a much lower intensity in our playing style (which has not recovered despite a full pre-season this year)
• We went two windows without signing any players and ended up with a very stale squad.
• Levy allowed several senior players to reach the last year of their contracts (Toby, Eriksen, Verts).
• We didn't move on several players who have admitted they wanted out (Rose, Aurier, Eriksen).
• We took too long to move on players who were not wanted or past their best (Jansen, GKN Wanyama).
• Poch said a few days before the CL final he would leave if we won.
• Poch flirted with other clubs in the media Madrid and Man U.
• Poch keeps picking players who (a) want to leave and/or (b) are bang out of form (Eriksen, Alderweireld etc.)

When you add all that up it seems inevitable that we'd got to pot this season, and the writing has been on the wall since February

I think its even more questionable why he switches the formation so much under this period. Feels like we played so many formations. Standard now is two formations each game.

 

[RichieS]

Levy can't afford them and more so their demands of money for transfers, we all know how mean he is.

Any numerical evidence to back up this assertion?

 

[maltahotspur]

Any numerical evidence to back up this assertion?

Go back to our net spend in the time Poch has been here (85 M) and compare that to the top six (5 excluding us). That's the crystal clear evidence.

 

[RikkiRocket]

the ONLY players that have standing to complain about Poch are Moura and Davidson

We know that Rose, Toby, Eriksen, Aurier, Wanyama were all looking for new teams in the summer....and it shows.
Also funny (not really) that no one came in for them (apart from Brugge).
Perhaps they ain't as good as they think they are at the moment.

Judging by your comment it suggests the agents are those with our stars: Kane for instance.

If that is the case I don't think it makes a difference. They along with the our want greener pastures 5 aside team have been treated with kid gloves by Poch.

IF Poch gets a couple more games after the international break I hope he decides to channel some of the first season post Villa spirit - pick players who want to be here (and show it with their contracts) and show it on the field.

By the way, those asking for Allegri or Mou....neither are idiots. Their demands (in addition to a bigger salary than Poch) will include getting rid of 6-7 first teamers right away and signing at least that many more - and not potential but the finished product.

The VERY thing Poch has been talking about but isn't getting. And don't go on about the 3 players we brought in this summer (two of which haven't played yet).

Ah bugger it.

Levy has three options: 1 he's going to make a colossal error and sack Poch
2 status quo until the summer - cheaper option
3 back Poch big time

my guess is it won't be 3 as there is fark all evidence of that happening with Danny

Have they ever managed in the top leagues. There songs are shit. ?

 

[RichieS]

Go back to our net spend in the time Poch has been here (85 M) and compare that to the top six (5 excluding us). That's the crystal clear evidence.

No it isn't. The club shouldn't be spending money it doesn't have on signings. Until very recently every other top 6 team had far more money available to spend simply because they had so much more coming in.

 

[jurgen]

Can't have sympathy for Poch with this, he knew exactly how Levy operates when he joined the club.

As will any other manager out there we wish to replace him with..

 

[SirHarryHotspur]

Just watched the highlights of the Bayern Hoffenheim game from today maybe we should be signing the Hoffenheim manager . He used controversial tactics like keeping space behind the back line of defenders to a minimum and this is a new one when there was a goal kick or free kick from the Hoffenheim penalty area the goalkeeper launched the ball over the halfway line now why didn't we think of that on Tuesday.

 

[Walmerspurs]

pretty cool



5:40 lolz

Does Poch need to freshen things up with a new assistant?

 

[mike_l]

i still don't want him to go despite whatevers happening behind the scenes and today's awful performance. Feel for the man at the moment.

That's the sad thing, looking at him on the sidelines I do feel for him as a human, no matter what I think about his abilities or his future with us, I know he cares.

Doesn't mean he's the right guy anymore though and ultimately I care more about Spurs than I do him, he's done well out of us financially and will eventually get another decent job so it's only his ego that will be hurt. Might do him some good in the long run to be humbled somewhat too.

 

[Essex Spur]

I'm sorry I don't want another potential loser as a manager. It's got to be a proven winner for a couple of years to install the winning mentality Into these pricks we have playing for us. If it's possible

There’s no need to apologise if you believe what you are saying.

Ramos was a proven winner, just saying...
[/QUOTE]
And as bad as he was he won us a trophy

 

[poc]

Go back to our net spend in the time Poch has been here (85 M) and compare that to the top six (5 excluding us). That's the crystal clear evidence.

Liverpool?

 

[SpartanSpur]

I think its even more questionable why he switches the formation so much under this period. Feels like we played so many formations. Standard now is two formations each game.

The players looked lost, confused and devoid of all confidence out there. Going back through @Trix posts it's clear there's been a lot of kick back from the players over this, and is refusing to listen.

I'll always love and respect Poch for what he's done for us, and I have no doubts he's been dealt a tough hand at times, but he's been central to this massive decline in 2019, both with his comments and general demeanour, and some very poor tactical choices.