The Deadline Day ITK Discussion Thread - 1st September

[VoteMe4Prez]

Well CB will be the first position that we need to buy in Jan, no doubt about it

 

[Ghost Hardware]

Well CB will be the first position that we need to buy in Jan, no doubt about it

We will probably buy one on the last day of the window.

 

[Rob]

We will probably buy loan one on the last day of the window.

Fixed

 

[mr ashley]

I don't see the contradiction. He identifies Dav as not being good enough and wants 2 CBs. He gets asked if he's happy for Dav to leave despite only having 1 in.

"Yeah mate"

Would he rather use the kids than play someone who's not long term in his plans? Does that mean he's not annoyed by the situation?

Putting faith in the academy players is of course, incredibly risky.
I guess none of us know for sure how good they will be.
Kane is a great example of a player coming in and expelling but there are umpteen examples of players not quite maintaining a high level (often after a fantastic debut too btw)
So it’s really understandable that people have concerns about this bold approach ange is taking of resolutely clearing out those who don’t fit into his plans.
Let’s hope firstly that romero and vdv stay fit until January.
If not let’s hope Philips and dorrington do a great job

And for gods sake let’s make sure we have a cb signing in early January

 

[vegassd]

My only real question is what changed to get these two outs done today that we couldn't do last week when the window was open to get a CB in? Gala didn't just wake up this morning and go "you know what I really fancy signing Sanchez and Ndombele today!"

Are we that strapped that ENIC couldn't go without this 15 million transfer fee for five days?!

It's probably less about the money and more about the opportunity imo. We can't flog the players to Gala (or any club) until that club makes a move for them. And from Gala's perspective, they may well have been trying to secure different players earlier in the window. It's only as they approach their CL registration deadline that they decide to make the move for Sanchez & Ndombele.

So in some respects, Gala did wake up and think it's time to sign those players. I'm sure that wasn't there plan on day 1, but as their window of opportunity nearer the end they chose to move on plan B/C/D whatever it was.

It's clearly frustrating that we have struggled to move our "deadwood" out the door early in the window, but other clubs would not have been prioritising our fringe players. Ndombele and Sanchez leaving would have been on our wishlist for this summer, so at least that has happened now.

The CB situation is far from ideal. But Ange has often spoken about wanting players to buy into his way of playing despite the risks it carries, and recently he has talked about wanting the players to do it by instinct rather than being told what to do. If he thinks that the youngsters are more likely to pick up that instinctive play than Sanchez in the final year of his deal, then I can see why the move got a green light.

 

[cjsimba]

We will probably buy loan one Sanchez back on the last day of the window.

Fixed

Fixed again.

 

[nicdic]

I don't see the contradiction. He identifies Dav as not being good enough and wants 2 CBs. He gets asked if he's happy for Dav to leave despite only having 1 in.

"Yeah mate"

Would he rather use the kids than play someone who's not long term in his plans? Does that mean he's not annoyed by the situation?

When it's worded like this I agree, but I'm really not sure that it's helpful to post things like "by all accounts he's not happy" or "he's fuming" because it's inciting an already pretty tightly wound crowd that will jump on any single thing to take further aim at Levy.

To be clear, I don't disagree that Levy has his faults, I don't disagree that we are short. I don't disagree that we should have got in another centre back, even if we kept Sanchez. I would just love for the ITKs, and you yourself Rob, to be a little bit more responsible with the way that things are posted.

 

[McFlash]

Ange isn’t happy about the CB situation (and that was while we had Dav). “Raging” is the quote we had. I suspect there’s some hyperbole there but it’s still Levy up to his old tricks.

Same way we were told Conte was unhappy with players being forced on him and you know how that turned out…

It's a bit of an odd one really and it makes you wonder where his rage is pointed at.
I'll admit, it's more than likely towards Levy given his history of fucking about in the market but it could be at the situation of the market in general, like not being able to shift the Dier for example.

I guess we have to hope that we get a bit of luck until January and that we address the shortcomings as soon as possible once the window opens.
Also, that our youngsters cope if they end up being thrown into the deep end.

I still think it was a pretty decent window, apart from the one glaring hole.

 

[fecka]

I don't see the contradiction. He identifies Dav as not being good enough and wants 2 CBs. He gets asked if he's happy for Dav to leave despite only having 1 in.

"Yeah mate"

Would he rather use the kids than play someone who's not long term in his plans? Does that mean he's not annoyed by the situation?

I'd say there's a fairly long distance between being annoyed at a situation and "raging" tbh. You can be annoyed and understanding of the situation at the same time, while if he was truly "raging" over the CB situation I'd say letting the only real CB cover go would be contradictory as a statement or action. Like Conte-level self-sabotage. Wording matters, Rob.

I don't doubt for a second he's annoyed but he seems like a fairly pragmatic man who knows that while the situation isn't what it should be there's little to do about it now rather than make the most of it until we can actually do something about it.

 

[fletch82]

I wish people would stop referring to Ndombele as dead wood
I find it highly insulting








To dead wood he's more the ashes after the dead wood is burnt

 

[Rob]

I'd say there's a fairly long distance between being annoyed at a situation and "raging" tbh. You can be annoyed and understanding of the situation at the same time, while if he was truly "raging" over the CB situation I'd say letting the only real CB cover go would be contradictory as a statement or action. Like Conte-level self-sabotage. Wording matters, Rob.

"Raging" is the quote we had. Like I said, I expect that's hyperbole to some extent.

We heard similar about Conte with similar phrasing as well.

 

[GetSpurredOn]

I’m quite calm. I didn’t have high expectations for this year, other than some form of signs of change beginning to show through. If we squeeze back into Europe, even the conference, whilst playing football that is more pleasing on the eye, I’d see that as a successful first season for Ange, first building block whilst the squad reshapes.
If we have a couple of bumpy results due to lack of CB’s at certain periods, it’s not great, but equally you never know how the likes of Phillips or Dorrington could take the opportunity. Until we see it happen, no point losing any sleep over it.
Likewise, if we do see 1-2 youngsters integrated because Ange places more faith in over experience, then that sends a positive message to other youngsters in the club, and even young players we may and sign going forward. A clear pathway sometimes can be the difference maker when deciding on joining a club.
If the club now go and source a CB to come in on Jan 1st because the squad/salary space is now there (as Liverpool have done in the past), then it looks a little more planned. If we (as usual) only start looking/negotiating on Jan 1st, then it’s looking a lot more reactive.

 

[talkshowhost86]

"Raging" is the quote we had. Like I said, I expect that's hyperbole to some extent.

We heard similar about Conte with similar phrasing as well.

But to be fair that one all worked out wonderfully

 

[midoNdefoe]

It’s silly that we haven’t got the second CB in.
It’s worse that we’ve let the only decent fit backup for the system go.
There must be some logic behind it - they fancy the youngsters are good enough for bit part roles and integration for example.

It does feel like we’re going to be very shakey if either CB picks up a knock or suspension. As has been discussed to death: dier and Davies are not necessarily a great fit for the dynamic high line we’re playing.
The only silver lining in this situation is that this has cleared space for a top CB on Jan 1st. That should be in the pipeline getting everything ironed out before the window opens, so there are no “January is difficult” excuses.

 

[aussiespursguy]

"Raging" is the quote we had. Like I said, I expect that's hyperbole to some extent.

We heard similar about Conte with similar phrasing as well.

This I believe!
I think Ange would more likely be "Frustrated"

 

[Ledders Army]

It's probably less about the money and more about the opportunity imo. We can't flog the players to Gala (or any club) until that club makes a move for them. And from Gala's perspective, they may well have been trying to secure different players earlier in the window. It's only as they approach their CL registration deadline that they decide to make the move for Sanchez & Ndombele.

So in some respects, Gala did wake up and think it's time to sign those players. I'm sure that wasn't there plan on day 1, but as their window of opportunity nearer the end they chose to move on plan B/C/D whatever it was.

It's clearly frustrating that we have struggled to move our "deadwood" out the door early in the window, but other clubs would not have been prioritising our fringe players. Ndombele and Sanchez leaving would have been on our wishlist for this summer, so at least that has happened now.

The CB situation is far from ideal. But Ange has often spoken about wanting players to buy into his way of playing despite the risks it carries, and recently he has talked about wanting the players to do it by instinct rather than being told what to do. If he thinks that the youngsters are more likely to pick up that instinctive play than Sanchez in the final year of his deal, then I can see why the move got a green light.

Exactly. The advantage Gala have over other teams is that their window closes later. They have to wait & see who's left once the other windows have closed

 

[Thenewcat]

When it's worded like this I agree, but I'm really not sure that it's helpful to post things like "by all accounts he's not happy" or "he's fuming" because it's inciting an already pretty tightly wound crowd that will jump on any single thing to take further aim at Levy.

To be clear, I don't disagree that Levy has his faults, I don't disagree that we are short. I don't disagree that we should have got in another centre back, even if we kept Sanchez. I would just love for the ITKs, and you yourself Rob, to be a little bit more responsible with the way that things are posted.

Everyone could do with dialling things down occasionally (including me) but since we are here you could also take your own advice. As someone you have been interacting with I wouldn’t say I am ‘tightly wound’ or even anti-Levy - I’m old enough to remember a bad levy season was a good season in the 90s so know it can be a lot worse. But that didn’t stop you from telling me I shouldn’t believe Ange’s own statements about wanting a CB plus the ITK about him being unhappy as that’s feeding my own bias.

Personally, I just call things as I see them on individual issues, and I think Levy has always been bad at managing outs and has always tended to do the minimum required to be top 4 competitive on the ins. To give credit where it’s due our recruitment in terms of player quality over the last couple of years has been excellent. Let’s hope the kids aren’t needed and/or are great if required as there is nothing more fun in football than seeing a youngster come through and perform

 

[JamieSpursCommunityUser]

.

I’m quite calm. I didn’t have high expectations for this year, other than some form of signs of change beginning to show through. If we squeeze back into Europe, even the conference, whilst playing football that is more pleasing on the eye, I’d see that as a successful first season for Ange, first building block whilst the squad reshapes.
If we have a couple of bumpy results due to lack of CB’s at certain periods, it’s not great, but equally you never know how the likes of Phillips or Dorrington could take the opportunity. Until we see it happen, no point losing any sleep over it.
Likewise, if we do see 1-2 youngsters integrated because Ange places more faith in over experience, then that sends a positive message to other youngsters in the club, and even young players we may and sign going forward. A clear pathway sometimes can be the difference maker when deciding on joining a club.
If the club now go and source a CB to come in on Jan 1st because the squad/salary space is now there (as Liverpool have done in the past), then it looks a little more planned. If we (as usual) only start looking/negotiating on Jan 1st, then it’s looking a lot more reactive.

In this context, I suppose I have two issues with what we've done.

Firstly, do we think Bissouma, Udogie, Romero etc will be quite so sanguine if we squeeze back into the Conference League when City, Bayern, Madrid etc come tapping up our best players?

Secondly, why does the club always have to retreat from any momentum like this?

A good start = an opportunity to make a few bob from Sanchez and hope to get away with it.

Rather than, let's give ourselves the best possible chance to capitalise with either Top 4 or even an unexpected Title charge in the Spring if luck with injuries goes our way.

I'm 100% behind Ange, Gabbanini, and our many outstanding young prospects, but this constant leaving us short every window is beyond infuriating.

 

[Hercules]

I do not want to say much. Ange was happy on how we conducted our transfers. He wanted one more CB in, who could also play LB. Kelly was seen as a deal we could do. Had we offered what Bournemouth wanted he would have been here. Not about year left. Daniel wanted to move Sanchez on first. He was not keen on PEH going, as he felt we didn’t have the cover, and again ideal players he would have wanted Daniel was not sure if he could spin it.

The difference between Ange and Conte, he will keep his emotions in-house. But if you believe he waa happy, you are very much wrong.

 

[sidford]

I do not want to say much. Ange was happy on how we conducted our transfers. He wanted one more CB in, who could also play LB. Kelly was seen as a deal we could do. Had we offered what Bournemouth wanted he would have been here. Not about year left. Daniel wanted to move Sanchez on first. He was not keen on PEH going, as he felt we didn’t have the cover, and again ideal players he would have wanted Daniel was not sure if he could spin it.

The difference between Ange and Conte, he will keep his emotions in-house. But if you believe he waa happy, you are very much wrong.

Sorry for being slow but 2nd line said he was happy but last line seems to say he isn't?