Ratings vs Man City

[jonnyp]

]Lloris - 8
Dier - 6 -
Kaboul - 4
Fazio - 5
Rose - 7
Capoue - 6
Mason - 6.5
Lamela - 6.5
Eriksen - 7
Chadli - 6.5
Soldado - 4

Subs
Dembele - 6
Townsend - 4
Vertonghen - 4

 

[Phn3Xta5]

Lloris - 9 monster performance. sucks that he had to ship 4 but 3 penalties were totally shit.

Dier - 6 okay. nothing much wrong here

kaboul - 6 hear me out. Kabs gets a 6 because i think he was putting in a shift for 2 people today. Fazio was nonexistant and totally useless and Kaboul was the one in the spotlight doing all the work. feel for him.

Fazio - 3 does nothing all game and when he finally does its to get a red and send off. upsetting

Rose - 7 looking really good danny....realllllly good keep it up. kept navas relatively quiet

Mason - 7.5 looks the bees knees. needs to finish though. I love the look of him so much

Capoue - 5.5 was meh all game.

Lamela - 6 still trying WAY too hard. some good stuff when he's ready but he needs to calm down and not try so hard to impress. there's definitely talent there. needs to relax and play his game.

Eriksen - 7.5 the Great Dane was great again today. good finish but i wish he got a freekick on target

Chadli - 5 got kept quiet all game

Soldado - 6.5 Great touches, nice linkup play was intstrumental going forward but it must be frustrating for him with the saved first time shot and the missed peno. start him. the goals will come. IF he ever starts firing he'll be an absolute MONSTER


SUBS

Dembele - 6 didnt do much. love to see him battle yaya toure. had him in his pocket as usual

Townsend - 3 sell.

Verts - 6 got outplayed.

 

[jonnyp]

Best attacking display for awhile despite lack of goals I thought. Think a lot of that was due to playing are strongest frontline for once

Disagree. Probably a lot more to do with the fact that City is an attacking team which leaves a lot more room for our players.

 

[fatpiranha]

MOM Lloris
2nd Mason
3rd Eriksen

We lost the match before it started when Poch selected Fazio at CB. Playing him against Aguerro was a poor tactical decision as he was always going to lack the pace to cope. Fazio isn't to blame for that, he was on to a hiding to nothing and this experience will do nothing for his confidence. We should have waited for the upcoming match against Stoke to give him his premiership debut. Horses for courses.

 

[Flashspur]

Lloris - 8 Excellent. Cant really fault him as he was left exposed for the goal. Pens were bad luck really. Some superb saves.
Dier - 5 He didnt offer much on th flank but then he is a CB. A steady game.
Kaboul - 3 Embarrasing really. Aguero tore him a new one. Gave away a sloppy pen and seemed to be ball watching too much for my liking.
Fazio - 5 Shame about the pen as he was Ok till then. Stupid foul and on another day he might have got away with it. Welcome to the PL mate. There are no excuses here!
Rose - 6 He was good and bad in parts. He gets caught upfield a little too much for my liking. They targeted his flank and he had two on him at times. Still he put in a shift.
Capoue - 4 Poor. There is a casulaness here which is not something you can take to play a team like City. This lethargic approach seems a bad habit that needs fixing against quick counter attacking teams. I hope Poch does something about this.
Mason - 8.5 Impressive! First half was a wonderful example of quick incisive passing and movement. He moves the ball forward quickly and accurately and helped our attacking play immensley. faded second half but looks like he belongs in the side.
Lamela - 5 Average day at the office for the lad. Nothing he tried seemed to work.
Eriksen - 7 I thought this was a better performance from him. He played some nice passes, dribbled well and was a threat including a well taken goal. The lad oozes talent but needs to be more engaged in the game. The Danish coach should put a few more rockets up him!
Chadli - 6 Contrary to some views on here, I thought he was decent enough. He showed for passes and was involved in the game but seemed to lose momentum in the second half when we were on the back foot.
Soldado - 7 If you look at his performance overall aside from the galring penalty miss, he wasnt that bad. He has wonderful vision and awareness for a striker and he was dangerous. He created at least 3 chances that could have changed the game if they were taken. He should be playing more!

Dembele - 6 didnt do much.
Townsend - 3 Poor decision making again. Its frustrating wathcing him.
Verts - 6 He was dropped in it and came in as we were being overrun. Coped well but got passed by Aguero for the goal. Surprised he did not start.

Poch - 7 I rate him a 7 because he went out there looking for 3 pts. It was good to see. Some of the attacking was brilliant, its just a pity that our defence were so poor again. He needs to work on this. He tried to keep the attacking shape with 10 men and showed bravery in his changes. He has to make sure that heads dont drop and we take the positives out of this game.

City - 7 Yes they put 4 past us but until the missed penalty and red card we gave them a few scares and matched them for creativity. You couldnt tell there was a few hundred million pounds more spent on their team until the ref made sure of the usual Sky 4 'equalizier'! On another day we could have had them.

 

[Mr Pink]

Just got round to watching a full re run of the game as I was at the funeral of a family member yesterday.

I thought it was a brave and valiant effort, I really did. The ref did his best to ensure the home side got the better of the decisions and unfortunately these affect us significantly - as we all know how fragile Spurs can be against better sides.

Not to say they wouldn't of edged it anyway, Aguero was fantastic and has a habit of really turning it on against us - an annoying habit its become.

Soldado was good, no doubt about it. Our attacking play looked more fluid and cohesive as a result and this front four, and the two behind them, should be allowed to develop the promising interplay we saw yesterday. Not entirely convinced it will be allowed to though. The penalty miss was a huge shame, that goes in and its a massive shot in the arm - and game on big time.

The first was never a penalty but the red card and penalty sealed our fate.

Scoreline was pretty harsh IMO. i see a lot of people going on about City scoring 7 or 8 in rebuttal to some claiming we could of had 3 or 4. Not for me, Aguero forced Lloris into some saves, but they're saves I'd expect him to make - some right down his throat etc. Mllner hit the post late on but the game is well over at that point.

I'm evaluating the game up until the red card really. It was over, psychologically, after that.

All in all I was happy with the performance and our tactical approach. Games after International breaks can often be quite slow and mundane, on another day - had Aguero been off the pace or missing etc, we could well of taken something yesterday, perhaps even won.

Looking at the bigger picture its another step on the progression ladder. We saw good pressing that brought about another goal, and our attacking players looked like they had a decent understanding. For me they must be allowed to carry this on.

Defensively we've still much to work on but I really do feel our attacking play is showing real signs of taking off now.

We've got some eminently winnable games coming up and whilst we're still developing and evolving as a side I expect us to rack up serious points from now to early December.

Eriksen was MOTM, took his goal really well and was much improved in just about every single sense. Mason not far behind.

Lloris was great for the penalty save but a lot of the other ones were saves I'd expect him to make.

 

[TheGreenLily]

Lamela - 6 still trying WAY too hard. some good stuff when he's ready but he needs to calm down and not try so hard to impress. there's definitely talent there. needs to relax and play his game.

This is one of the most sensible thing I have read about Lamela.

Nice one.

 

[Gilzeanking]

J

Looking at the bigger picture its another step on the progression ladder. We saw good pressing that brought about another goal, and our attacking players looked like they had a decent understanding. For me they must be allowed to carry this on.
e.

Yes quite , some great stuff. However surely we must take into account who we are playing and where . To go to City and play like we were at QPR seems stupid. They have some of the best players in the world and going toe to toe is a recipe for a 4-1 drubbing .....which we got .

Teams who accept they are poorer than us come to WHL, work from solid defence and counter attack and do very well .

We , it seems , are unable to accept other teams are better than us and play open vs Man City for example. WHY ? Its just throwing away points . I thought Poch did have a plan B after the Arsematch success...and then we get this drubbing . Yes there are consolations for Spurs fans in the City match , but a drubbing is a drubbing . Poch's setup simply wasn't realistic .

For Poch's future reference don't play full on attack at Barcelona , Real Madrid ,Bayern ,Man City...etc

 

[ClintEastwould]

Disagree. Probably a lot more to do with the fact that City is an attacking team which leaves a lot more room for our players.

How do you explain our performance at arsenal then? They are just as much if not more attacking.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

At the risk of sounding like "one of them", I really like the way Soldado plays. He may never make it with us, and I think the sad truth is that it's got to the point where there are those on here that actually don't want him to make it here just to be proved right, but he has his moments and I think he suits the way Poch has set up this team more than Ade does. I took a quick glance in the Soldado thread and wasn't surprised to see people shitting on him yet again though, completely ignoring the fact that he did actually have a good game, grabbing an assist to boot. I think he's been unlucky with us. He was signed to play for an AVB side that he didn't suit, since there was no effort to try and feed the striker, and then was left out in the cold by Sherwood. He didn't help himself by fluffing his lines on occassions and missing some sitters, but I think a lot of that is down to him feeling the pressure and being over-eager to try and justify his price-tag. Same goes for Lamela in a lot of ways. Had we signed Soldado this summer under Pochettino, a manager who seems to utilise his talents a lot better and set up a more free flowing, fluid attack that he can participate in, then we could be looking at a very different player.

I know there's the same old argument of him being a striker and therefore should be scoring, but I just don't think we play in a way that exclusively feeds the striker. For years we've been like that, well before Soldado came by. AVB couldn't teach our players how to open up spaces with clever runs or even just move and show for the ball, we were devoid of any spark up front. Tim was....well, it just seemed like he told people to have a go and hoped for the best as, despite being a bit more successful up front, we looked like headless chickens. Poch seems to have gone some way to improving that and implementing a game plan. We're creating chances a lot more now and our movement is better, but with him it's not so much about having a goalscoring number 9, it's more of an attacking unit with the front 4 being fluid and contributing to the goals/assists each. I think it suits Soldado as he has the ability to drop and slot a pass in for the those running in from wide or deep. I'm not saying he's the best thing since sliced bread, I'm just saying that he isn't as bad as people make him out to be.

Anyway, I personally couldn't give a shit who scores, whether they're the number 9 or not, as long as we create chances, take those chances, and win the games we need to win. The front 4 (5 including Mason) had a good game against a bloody good defence, and if those 5 play that way against the weaker defences in the league then we'll be seeing goals and points.

I have never been a huge fan of the pure No.9. One of the reason's is the very same you give, that I have always thought it more important that the team score than everything is geared towards one player scoring, which is why I never wanted us to sign players like Bent. I think for a pure No.9 to be of value to a team he's got to be worth at least 24/25 goals a season because they invariably aren't contributing much else in terms of team play, build up and others scoring. Defoe being the perfect example. Rarely exceeded 15/16 a season, rarely touched the ball more than 10/12 times a game. Just not good enough.

When people kept saying "all we need is a striker" I (and others) kept pointing out that just buying a pure striker is not the solution, what we lacked was the creativity and intelligence to to make chances even more.

With all those caveats in mind, I have actually been impressed by Soldado's effort on many occasions. He's tried to play a game that isn't entirely natural to him and done a pretty decent job for the team on a few occasions. You think back to his last league game against Southampton last season, he chased down Lovren won the ball and set up a goal. I'm pretty sure he was one of most productive assisters (per minute on the pitch) last year and he should have had two yesterday.

Unfortunately Soldado just can't seem to do the thing that most are judging him by. Early on when he was playing regularly it was in a new country, new league and n a team going through a massive attacking upheaval. He had the insipid Lennon, Townsend shooting from 30 yards every time he got the ball, Sigurdsson being played out of position, Eriksen bedding in and being less than inspiring at times and Lamela barely playing. His confidence wasn't great and that showed in the odd rare chance that fell his way. He couldn't even shank one in, which is maybe what he needed. And on other occasions when he'd had decent games in cups, when it might have been the chance to play him with a bit of confidence he was invariably left out next game.

I'd always pick a fit and on form Adebayor ahead of a pure 9 type like Soldado, I like my strikers to contribute more than just goals, especially if they aren't particularly prolific.

But I think Soldado has made a decent case for himself to have a couple more games. I think the front 4 looked more in sync than they have with the lack lustre and very unpredictable Adebayor of late. And worst case scenario it will kick Adebayor up the arse, which IMO he severely needs.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Yes quite , some great stuff. However surely we must take into account who we are playing and where . To go to City and play like we were at QPR seems stupid. They have some of the best players in the world and going toe to toe is a recipe for a 4-1 drubbing .....which we got .

Teams who accept they are poorer than us come to WHL, work from solid defence and counter attack and do very well .

We , it seems , are unable to accept other teams are better than us and play open vs Man City for example. WHY ? Its just throwing away points . I thought Poch did have a plan B after the Arsematch success...and then we get this drubbing . Yes there are consolations for Spurs fans in the City match , but a drubbing is a drubbing . Poch's setup simply wasn't realistic .

For Poch's future reference don't play full on attack at Barcelona , Real Madrid ,Bayern ,Man City...etc

I don't think Pochettino's pre match plan was to have an open end to end slug fest GK. You can criticise him for not achieving whatever his aim was, through selections or application or not having time yet to indoctrinate those plans as habit etc., but I don't think his modus operandi has ever been to play that way, especially away at places like City.

 

[Syn_13]

I have never been a huge fan of the pure No.9. One of the reason's is the very same you give, that I have always thought it more important that the team score than everything is geared towards one player scoring, which is why I never wanted us to sign players like Bent. I think for a pure No.9 to be of value to a team he's got to be worth at least 24/25 goals a season because they invariably aren't contributing much else in terms of team play, build up and others scoring. Defoe being the perfect example. Rarely exceeded 15/16 a season, rarely touched the ball more than 10/12 times a game. Just not good enough.

When people kept saying "all we need is a striker" I (and others) kept pointing out that just buying a pure striker is not the solution, what we lacked was the creativity and intelligence to to make chances even more.

With all those caveats in mind, I have actually been impressed by Soldado's effort on many occasions. He's tried to play a game that isn't entirely natural to him and done a pretty decent job for the team on a few occasions. You think back to his last league game against Southampton last season, he chased down Lovren won the ball and set up a goal. I'm pretty sure he was one of most productive assisters (per minute on the pitch) last year and he should have had two yesterday.

Unfortunately Soldado just can't seem to do the thing that most are judging him by. Early on when he was playing regularly it was in a new country, new league and n a team going through a massive attacking upheaval. He had the insipid Lennon, Townsend shooting from 30 yards every time he got the ball, Sigurdsson being played out of position, Eriksen bedding in and being less than inspiring at times and Lamela barely playing. His confidence wasn't great and that showed in the odd rare chance that fell his way. He couldn't even shank one in, which is maybe what he needed. And on other occasions when he'd had decent games in cups, when it might have been the chance to play him with a bit of confidence he was invariably left out next game.

I'd always pick a fit and on form Adebayor ahead of a pure 9 type like Soldado, I like my strikers to contribute more than just goals, especially if they aren't particularly prolific.

But I think Soldado has made a decent case for himself to have a couple more games. I think the front 4 looked more in sync than they have with the lack lustre and very unpredictable Adebayor of late. And worst case scenario it will kick Adebayor up the arse, which IMO he severely needs.

I'm very much with you on this. The one thing I never knew Soldado could do was adapt his game from being a typical number 9 into a more supporting forward man. I'm actually quite surprised at the creativity and quick thinking he shows. He has a good first touch, and can spot a very good pass, which works brilliantly for what Poch wants out of our attacking midfield trio. What might hold him back is his lack of physicality. He does like to get stuck in, sometimes overzealously, but he's not strong and can be brushed off the ball. We have very physical defenders in this league and he's going to have to improve on that, because he hasn't got the pace or silky skills to get away from them either. It isn't a matter of strength either, it's just mental determination and tenacity, knowing that you have to give as good as your getting from the big defenders.

I have issues with Adebayor, and not just because he lets his brain go on a wander. Don't get me wrong, I do like him, but I find that he's a fairly poor finisher, takes too many touches, hasn't got the best control, and for a big man doesn't win enough in the air yet by virtue of being a big man we sometimes resort to lofting it up to him. On his day, when he's mentally up for it, he's very good. He pushes himself and makes a bloody nuisance of himself. Makes some good runs, pulling defenders out of position and uses his strength and long strides to get that ball moving forward. He's also got a knack of scoring some great goals when he hasn't got much time to think, despite not having great composure as a finisher when he is given time to think.

There are other players that would suit what Poch wants and can do a better job than either Soldado or Adebayor, I'm sure of it. As for Kane, I much prefer him playing in a deeper role as I think he influences play well and supports the front man well. We need a striker. Not a number 9, but a forward with a good blend of abilities who can impose themselves physically on the game. Someone that isn't adapting from being a traditional number 9, like Soldado, and somebody who has more consistency and less flaws than Adebayor. Until then, I quite enjoyed seeing Soldado play yesterday with our front men and he definitely deserves the game against Newcastle.

 

[parklane1]

Just got back and I have to say there were times in that game when we made City look poor, we lost to a team that has far more options then we have but we gave them a good game, there is still a lot of work to be done but I am not joining the knee jerkers by saying we were awful.

My MOM was Eriksen with Soldado, Mason not far behind.

 

[Sevens]

Lloris - 8
Dier - 6
Kaboul - 4
Fazio - 5
Rose - 5
Capoue - 4
Mason - 6
Eriksen - 7
Lamela - 5
Chadli - 4
Soldado - 6

 

[Bulletspur]

I was very disappointed with rose, especially after how good he has been thus season.

He was constantly caught miles out of position and then put zero effort in getting back, meaning navas and Silva were always dragging the cbs out if position.

I lost count of the times I saw rose casually jogging back while city were breaking down their right hand side.

Lloris motm, some brilliant saves. Mason & Eriksen close behind

I observed this well, hence my "Rose of old" dig in my opening post.

 

[Gilzeanking]

I don't think Pochettino's pre match plan was to have an open end to end slug fest GK. You can criticise him for not achieving whatever his aim was, through selections or application or not having time yet to indoctrinate those plans as habit etc., but I don't think his modus operandi has ever been to play that way, especially away at places like City.

OK , its just that vs Arse we saw what looked like a viable defensive/counter setup . It looked like a Plan B and it worked .

I think taking the opposition into account and setting up accordingly is the way to go .The Jose example of course . Also it makes us less predictable to the opposition . Good footie at City yes, but the result was grim .

 

[Bulletspur]

I like this. We got hammered, score wise, but everyone can see the potential. Brilliant. I was gonna avoid this place for a while but I'm loving that most could see what I saw.
2 points.
I was hoping I was wrong about Kaboul and I really hope he can get back to his form of 2 or 3 seasons ago but I'm worried. Missed the last few matches but was encouraged by the fact that people thought Kaboul played well but again today I thought he was a bit suspect.
Soldado. Love him, I really hope he stays in the teams for a while. He might not have the physicality of Ade, who I also like and rate, but his technical ability, and creativity to not only spot but make the correct pass perfectly is brilliant.
Like others have said give him a run and we could the Soldado we expected to get, with the added bonus of his creativity, which I didn't realise he had when we signed him.
I know we've had to patient but I have a feeling once he starts to score again and gets his true confidence back he'll be formidable.

Against both Arsenal and Southampton he was the Kaboul of old but unfortunately yesterday the poor Kaboul did turn up

 

[Sevens]

Against both Arsenal and Southampton he was the Kaboul of old but unfortunately yesterday the poor Kaboul did turn up

I went against the grain of general opinion at the time too but I thought the Kaboul of old was not of the required standard either. For someone who can be so strong in the air his defensive headed clearances are atrocious (more skyward than out) and his positional play has always been poor. The only time Kaboul looked remotely like a centre half who could make top quality grade was when he was partnered with Gallas.

 

[Bulletspur]

Lloris - 9 monster performance. sucks that he had to ship 4 but 3 penalties were totally shit.

Dier - 6 okay. nothing much wrong here

kaboul - 6 hear me out. Kabs gets a 6 because i think he was putting in a shift for 2 people today. Fazio was nonexistant and totally useless and Kaboul was the one in the spotlight doing all the work. feel for him.

Fazio - 3 does nothing all game and when he finally does its to get a red and send off. upsetting

Rose - 7 looking really good danny....realllllly good keep it up. kept navas relatively quiet

Mason - 7.5 looks the bees knees. needs to finish though. I love the look of him so much

Capoue - 5.5 was meh all game.

Lamela - 6 still trying WAY too hard. some good stuff when he's ready but he needs to calm down and not try so hard to impress. there's definitely talent there. needs to relax and play his game.

Eriksen - 7.5 the Great Dane was great again today. good finish but i wish he got a freekick on target

Chadli - 5 got kept quiet all game

Soldado - 6.5 Great touches, nice linkup play was intstrumental going forward but it must be frustrating for him with the saved first time shot and the missed peno. start him. the goals will come. IF he ever starts firing he'll be an absolute MONSTER


SUBS

Dembele - 6 didnt do much. love to see him battle yaya toure. had him in his pocket as usual

Townsend - 3 sell.

Verts - 6 got outplayed.

Your opinion I know but your assessment of Dier Kaboul Fazio Rose and Chadli is the opposite to how I assessed these players. You may want to watch the game again as I did and you will see that Kaboul was all over the place, making very poor decisions and positioning, where Fazio was quietly mopping up where the red card (deservedly so) was one of a few marks against him. Rose caused alot of the City's offence play to be effective in that Fazio had to be drawn out of position when City counter attacked where Rose just jogged back after making a marauding run. Chaldi was involved in most of our offensive play and was drawing the defenders all over the place. Just don't agree with your ratings of these particular players which I see is in direct contrast to most on this thread.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

OK , its just that vs Arse we saw what looked like a viable defensive/counter setup . It looked like a Plan B and it worked .

I think taking the opposition into account and setting up accordingly is the way to go .The Jose example of course . Also it makes us less predictable to the opposition . Good footie at City yes, but the result was grim .

I get what you mean in as much as Arsenal seemed a more deliberate strategy effected (badly IMO) but I think we disagree on "a viable defensive/counter set up". Having 36% of your team effectively take no part in a game is never viable to me.

I don't mind a bit of pragmatism, but what we saw at Arsenal was dire. They walked through our front line of players, pulling our CM2 all over the place (picking mason for this task was naive IMO) and it was only Wenger's poor choice of players and their abysmal application and execution that saw us get away with it.

A good counter attacking policy should involve way more counter attacking than we did that day as well, IMO.