Viktor Fischer

[Barry Mead]

@Barry Mead
The stratford thing wasn't never going to happen as it was crazy for the Athletics board to accept moving however it was necessary to secure funding and make sure no one got a free stadium. As for the funding to be announced there is no reason to announce it as we are still in the process of purchasing the final bits of land.

Well we certainly spent quite a bit of money on proposals and then challenging the decision and had they given us the offer do you really think Levy wouldn't have taken it?

As for the funding or stadium rights or any sponsorship deals well of course they would announce anything that is agreed because it encourages others if there's a deal already agreed for the naming rights, or the funding or any sponsorship. They would be failing in their job not too, it would make no sense to not announce anything

With the velodrome I was using that as an example the original plan wouldnt scupper us in anyway, we would have WHL until the new stadium was bigger and ready however it would mean potentially a longer time building. moving grounds whilst trying to achieve a quicker lead time would result in saving money.

No because you stay at WHL you couldn't use the full stadium if you are having to take down sections so you lose revenue. If you hire another stadium they won't let you have it for free so you pay for hiring, either option costs you
Then you would no doubt lose on concessions at the ground because there would already be some in place. Then there's the issue of the very lucrative boxes, whatever ground you hired would need to have adequate boxes to retain that revenue but there's no guarantees every box holder would want to take up a temporary location

As for the selling players, yes we agree but last season we sold a player for £86million. We aren't going to do that, had we not sold him we would of still be expected to spend big. Its telling that we were the only club with a minus net spend and that was down to Bale.

Well there was also money from selling Caulker, Hudd, Dempsey and Parker so it was hardly only Bale, but if we hadn't sold Bale we probably wouldn't have spent £30 mill on Lamela and may not have spent other monies on some of the others. We were minus net spenders the two previous seasons and we didn't sell Bale those times so I don't see how telling it was last season.

The season before it was down to Modric, VDV, Bassong, Pienaar, Kranky and Charlie, the year before that it was down to Crouch, Pav, O'Hara, Hutton, Wilson and Keano.

This coming season there's no doubt a number of players we shall want to sell and maybe one or two we are put under pressure to sell and chances are we will see the same pretty flat net spend, that's the way we've been doing things and with quite a few players that potentially could be sold chances are that's what we'll do again

This season if we keep hold of Vertonghen and Lloris we won't replace the likes of Siggy, lennon, Ade and etc. with the money we raise we will use the TV money, the money the rest of the league was using last season. Along with factors listed. We should have about at least £20million extra to spend in the transfer market.

Last season we weren't going to be selling Bale and everyone was saying we have TV revenues that we would be spending. Sure we no doubt could have more than £20 mill of cash that could go into the transfer kitty but that doesn't mean it will. Likewise we might say now we won't sell the likes of Lloris, Verts and Paulinho but if, like Bale, they push for a move and Levy gets good offers then you wouldn't bet against them going. As I said before those three alone could probably raise £60 mill, other unwanted and surplus players could raise around £50 mill, even if one of the three mentioned leave thats around £70 mill in transfer funds. If Levy raises that through sales do you really think he'll throw another £20 mill into the pot to spend? I'd like to think he might if there was a chance to get certain more expensive targets, not that I particularly want us spending big money in every position we need, I think there's some excellent options around that we don't need to break the bank for, but either way looking over the last few years there's nothing to suggest Levy will feel any pressure to throw cash into the transfer funds if we can raise enough in sales

 

[Ossie85]

wow, that's a long post

 

[beats1]

Well we certainly spent quite a bit of money on proposals and then challenging the decision and had they given us the offer do you really think Levy wouldn't have taken it?

Are you sure about that because the design was the same as New WHL so it wouldnt of cost as much as people think. Plus we would of lost alot more if West Ham got a free stadium unchallenged. The Olympic proposal was a win win situation as everything was already made and cost nothing.

No because you stay at WHL you couldn't use the full stadium if you are having to take down sections so you lose revenue. If you hire another stadium they won't let you have it for free so you pay for hiring, either option costs you
Then you would no doubt lose on concessions at the ground because there would already be some in place. Then there's the issue of the very lucrative boxes, whatever ground you hired would need to have adequate boxes to retain that revenue but there's no guarantees every box holder would want to take up a temporary location

NO! There is no need to rip sections of white hart lane out, I don't know where you got this from. Our original plan is to build a 3/4's stadium next to WHL and then in the off season move to the new bigger ground. Like Athletic Bilbao.

As for the loss of revenue, we would have only move if we would save money from the above situation by building a full stadium in a shorter lead team. So therefore we would only move if the saving was higher than the expected loss of moving.

Well there was also money from selling Caulker, Hudd, Dempsey and Parker so it was hardly only Bale, but if we hadn't sold Bale we probably wouldn't have spent £30 mill on Lamela and may not have spent other monies on some of the others. We were minus net spenders the two previous seasons and we didn't sell Bale those times so I don't see how telling it was last season.

We wouldnt of signed Lamela and Eriksen but before Bale was sold we had spent £59million(but mods says its £50million). which was about £26million net spend. So perhaps there was money to spend and also Levy gave money to Sherwood to spend but he came out said he doesn't want anyone as we signed 7 players who haven't settled

The season before it was down to Modric, VDV, Bassong, Pienaar, Kranky and Charlie, the year before that it was down to Crouch, Pav, O'Hara, Hutton, Wilson and Keano.

This coming season there's no doubt a number of players we shall want to sell and maybe one or two we are put under pressure to sell and chances are we will see the same pretty flat net spend, that's the way we've been doing things and with quite a few players that potentially could be sold chances are that's what we'll do again

See thats the thing, Im trying to highlight. Thats not the way we have been doing things we have always been doing things the same even when we were Spending big. The money to spend has ALWAYS been a balance of Wages and transfer with the total of the two being the maximum that is possible and still breaking even. Initially there was more spent on transfer but that changed to more in wages and breaking even on Transfers. The influx of extra cash would mean that it goes back to more being spent to on Transfers.

Also last season we did make a minor net profit but had the Moutinho transfer gone through at the eleventh hour it would of been a positive net spend.

Last season we weren't going to be selling Bale and everyone was saying we have TV revenues that we would be spending. Sure we no doubt could have more than £20 mill of cash that could go into the transfer kitty but that doesn't mean it will. Likewise we might say now we won't sell the likes of Lloris, Verts and Paulinho but if, like Bale, they push for a move and Levy gets good offers then you wouldn't bet against them going. As I said before those three alone could probably raise £60 mill, other unwanted and surplus players could raise around £50 mill, even if one of the three mentioned leave thats around £70 mill in transfer funds. If Levy raises that through sales do you really think he'll throw another £20 mill into the pot to spend? I'd like to think he might if there was a chance to get certain more expensive targets, not that I particularly want us spending big money in every position we need, I think there's some excellent options around that we don't need to break the bank for, but either way looking over the last few years there's nothing to suggest Levy will feel any pressure to throw cash into the transfer funds if we can raise enough in sales

Bale wasn't sold because he pushed for a move. Bale was sold because we got a world record bid. If a bid that wouldnt make him the most expensive player of all time come in, we wouldnt of sold.

Also I think if £60million bid came in for those players they will still be here. I think it will take near to two world record bids for Vertonghen and Lloris to leave.(World records for Keeper and CB, £32.6million and £35million)

Now bear in mind Neuer went for around £30million, I can see us asking for a similar amount especially since he cost about £15million. Though Sherwood says £100million.

As for Vertonghen, he has won player of the year last season but he could have a great world cup and harry says that we would only be listening to £40million. Now I don't think considering that Marquinhos went for £30million, Silva and Luiz are said to be valued at 40mill and Lescott £24million. I think that around £30million for Vertonghen would be what he wants for Vertonghen perhaps more.

Now if those players go for that money I don't see us having a big net spend but if they stay I think there will be. But I do see us going for more expensive targets as Levy has stated he doesn't want to spend money on several and instead wants to buy 3 or 4 players strengthening key areas.

 

[Barry Mead]

Are you sure about that because the design was the same as New WHL so it wouldnt of cost as much as people think. Plus we would of lost alot more if West Ham got a free stadium unchallenged. The Olympic proposal was a win win situation as everything was already made and cost nothing.

I ask the question again, do you think Levy would have turned it down had we been offered it? Of course he wanted to get a ready built stadium cheaply. Lets not kid ourselves that Levy only wanted to stop Wham getting it, he's not the guy who would get sentimental over staying at WHL if he thought he could save a couple of hundred mill. Also lets not forget the club were still waiting for some agreements from the local council and TFL. No I think there's no doubt that we were serious in our application

NO! There is no need to rip sections of white hart lane out, I don't know where you got this from. Our original plan is to build a 3/4's stadium next to WHL and then in the off season move to the new bigger ground. Like Athletic Bilbao.

Well I read that they would have needed to effectively turn the pitch around and need to take down sections of the existing stand to allow some of the development. Now we have had new architects and new plans so maybe things have changed, but in the stuff I read there was going to be problems building a new stadium without impacting the existing one which meant that for quite a period of the work the stadium would have to operate on reduced capacity. One of the reasons for looking at other options like Wembley or Milton Keynes was because of this and the feeling that trying to build around the stadium would slow the work

As for the loss of revenue, we would have only move if we would save money from the above situation by building a full stadium in a shorter lead team. So therefore we would only move if the saving was higher than the expected loss of moving.

Again you are still ignoring the very basic fact that either way we would be earning less money, either because of having to pay for another stadium and losses of related revenue, or we would be operating on less revenue because of reduced capacity

We wouldnt of signed Lamela and Eriksen but before Bale was sold we had spent £59million(but mods says its £50million). which was about £26million net spend. So perhaps there was money to spend and also Levy gave money to Sherwood to spend but he came out said he doesn't want anyone as we signed 7 players who haven't settled

They had offers from Real and a bigger offer from United, spending ahead of a sale was hardly that risky simply playing Levy's usual game of holding out for the best deal but knowing that we were going to bring in a big sum to cover. As for Sherwood yes he may well have offered to give him funds to spend but we don't know how conditional, he might have said OK we'll sell say Siggy (we reportedly had a decent offer in Jan), Livermore (Hull were reportedly anxious to tie up a permanent) Benny maybe or any players Sherwood might have suggested he didn't want. Making money available for transfers isn't necessarily stumping up cash you can sell players to raise cash and typically that is what we have been doing in recent seasons

See thats the thing, Im trying to highlight. Thats not the way we have been doing things we have always been doing things the same even when we were Spending big. The money to spend has ALWAYS been a balance of Wages and transfer with the total of the two being the maximum that is possible and still breaking even. Initially there was more spent on transfer but that changed to more in wages and breaking even on Transfers. The influx of extra cash would mean that it goes back to more being spent to on Transfers.

Any business has to have control over all expenses and that's hardly a new thing with any businesses, but we have rarely bought players for big fees and very high wages, the likes of Gallas and Ade who were both reportedly two of our biggest earners were brought in free and in Ade's case at a low fee to allow for his wages. The thing is you get nothing from their sales although you do cut a wage bill. It might give you more to pay on wages but nothing to pay on transfers

Of course players that join and start doing well will increase their wages and if you sell at a high fee you also reduce a high earner but lets look at this we have lost
the likes of Bale, Gallas, Ledley, VDV, Modric etc arguably our biggest earners bar Ade and it has no doubt reduced our wage bill, despite bringing in new players adding to it and yet in the last few seasons we have still not spent money net on transfers so again I can't agree with your comments.

Also last season we did make a minor net profit but had the Moutinho transfer gone through at the eleventh hour it would of been a positive net spend.

Well we have heard this so often about players we nearly bought and made assumptions that that "unspent" money would be sitting there. I can remember the reported big bids for the likes of Rossi and Aguero, but that money never managed to see light of day. Two seasons back we were net up around £32 mill on transfers-where did that go? It didn't end up in next seasons kitty when we were up around £6 mill net. So I'm always a bit dubious about all these 11th hour deals, Levy was after all doing the negotiating and so he has it in his power to make a deal happen or kill it. To some degree it's fair enough that he wants to try and get the best price but I have a feeling that at times it has suited him to say that he couldn't tie up a deal

Bale wasn't sold because he pushed for a move. Bale was sold because we got a world record bid. If a bid that wouldnt make him the most expensive player of all time come in, we wouldnt of sold.

Oh you mean a bit like Modric, we weren't going to sell him either and turned down a bigger offer but eventually sold him for less. Sorry but Levy was adamant that Bale would not be sold yet because he got a bid that was a certain size he was happy enough. Bale was becoming a world class player, his reputation was going global, he was a bigger name here in Spain than Spurs were, he had a massive pull that given our needs to raise our profile and gain funding, sponsorship etc the actual fee even though a big one would have been more than offset from the commercial benefits of having Bale stay as well as the likelihood that his presence could have once again given us a lucrative CL qualification. So sorry I think that Bale and his agent were pushing the deal and that was what forced Levy to sell, sure he was going to hold out for the best price he could from a non PL club, but that was what pushed the deal

Also I think if £60million bid came in for those players they will still be here. I think it will take near to two world record bids for Vertonghen and Lloris to leave.(World records for Keeper and CB, £32.6million and £35million)

Now bear in mind Neuer went for around £30million, I can see us asking for a similar amount especially since he cost about £15million. Though Sherwood says £100million.

As for Vertonghen, he has won player of the year last season but he could have a great world cup and harry says that we would only be listening to £40million. Now I don't think considering that Marquinhos went for £30million, Silva and Luiz are said to be valued at 40mill and Lescott £24million. I think that around £30million for Vertonghen would be what he wants for Vertonghen perhaps more.

I like Vertonghen but he isn't world class and his attitude and displays this season won't have helped endear him to prospective buyers. Oh he can be a very good player when he wants but lets not kid ourselves a Thiago Silva he is not.
That aside when you look at other potential CB targets there are a number of options clubs would be considering that would no doubt offer better value. He may get a bit more than £20 mill if a big club decided on him above some of the others but I really don't see anyone offering too much more.

Lloris well he might get a bigger fee if City are really keen on him, PSG don't need him, Real already have two top keepers, Barca seem to have set sights on Ter Stegen, Chavs have Cech and Courtois. I can't see any other clubs paying a record fee for him though if City don't go for him.
All that said I think Levy would hold out for decent fees for any of them and may push their values above £20 mill but when players have pushed to leave he invariably sells. I can't help but think we will see at least one leave this summer

Now if those players go for that money I don't see us having a big net spend but if they stay I think there will be. But I do see us going for more expensive targets as Levy has stated he doesn't want to spend money on several and instead wants to buy 3 or 4 players strengthening key areas.

I don't see us spending big money on any one player, I tend to think we'll be buying two or three in the £15 mill range and two or three in the £10 mill or lower range and to be fair I'd be pretty happy with that because I think our big needs are in areas where generally prices are cheaper. We could use a quality striker but we have Soldado who I think will come good next season so I think we can add a younger striker of promise than a more proven one. I have a feeling Ade might be off and that might change the thinking a bit about having a more PL experienced player but Ade won't move if he doesn't want.
I think we'll pretty much have another flat net spend but Levy is the only one who really knows what he's planning. I think he is right in suggesting that he'll focus on key positions but I can see half a dozen players coming in and probably more going out
Time will tell I guess, I only hope we have a clear plan, defined targets and a new coach lined up

 

[Danners9]

Remember when Clubcall would have teletext ads saying 'Spurs to sign international wonderkid?' and the story would be something like this for 1.99 a minute? Yeah, that, except without the charge.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

I wouldn't have cited common sense, because in this debate it unfortunately implies that you're lacking. Off the bat you used your comparison of the acquisition of Fischer to Eriksen, which isn't even remotely similar aside from their clubs and nationalities, to suggest ideal targets. This displays a fundamental lack of the understanding the varying levels of reality and expectation, and then yet you go on to say others aren't being realistic and are making up fantasies? Come on man. @Barry Mead's been very patient and civil in this discussion, and then you repay him with an insult like that.

When did I say Fischer was an "ideal target", don't misquote me. My point was, Barry commented that Fischer is better off staying at Ajax to aid his development, whilst saying in the same post that he thought Fischer had great potential. Whilst that's a fair argument, my argument to that is that this is the type of player we should be going for, if we leave players like that at their Clubs and just mess about, we run the risk of another Club coming in for him.

Also, you need to chill out a bit, nobody is "insulting Barry" , man up ffs, its a forum for debate.

 

[Ghost Hardware]

Stopped reading after this sentence...

The North London club are rumoured to be planning a huge rebuild of the squad following an inconsistent season in the Premier League

The club have already stated they would look to focus on one or two positions, there will be no "huge rebuild" regardless who comes in.

 

[beats1]

Stopped reading after this sentence...

The North London club are rumoured to be planning a huge rebuild of the squad following an inconsistent season in the Premier League

The club have already stated they would look to focus on one or two positions, there will be no "huge rebuild" regardless who comes in.

It all depends on who we sell. We have to strengthen GK(gomes and Friedel are leaving), CB, LB and either LW or CM. However if Vertonghen, Dawson and Kaboul go with LLoris.

That is replacing another 3 or 4 players imo

 

[DaSpurs]

When did I say Fischer was an "ideal target", don't misquote me. My point was, Barry commented that Fischer is better off staying at Ajax to aid his development, whilst saying in the same post that he thought Fischer had great potential. Whilst that's a fair argument, my argument to that is that this is the type of player we should be going for, if we leave players like that at their Clubs and just mess about, we run the risk of another Club coming in for him.

Also, you need to chill out a bit, nobody is "insulting Barry" , man up ffs, its a forum for debate.

Oh I can assure you I was and am as chill as you could ever want. But why should I need to "man up" after asking me to "chill out?" You just have crap debate manners guy, on top of incorrect and unfounded opinions. It is for this that I called you out, and initially in a "chill" manner.

Are you really going to argue a difference between referring to a player as an "ideal target for our need" vs "the type of player we should be going for?" Paraphrase maybe, but it is not an incorrect assumption. I wasn't arguing with your main point as on that you're right on, but to compare Fischer to Eriksen and then proceed to insinuate others weren't "being realistic" or "having fantasies" or that you were the only one using common sense is just outright hypocritical.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

Oh I can assure you I was and am as chill as you could ever want. But why should I need to "man up" after asking me to "chill out?" You just have crap debate manners guy, on top of incorrect and unfounded opinions. It is for this that I called you out, and initially in a "chill" manner.

Are you really going to argue a difference between referring to a player as an "ideal target for our need" vs "the type of player we should be going for?" Paraphrase maybe, but it is not an incorrect assumption. I wasn't arguing with your main point as on that you're right on, but to compare Fischer to Eriksen and then proceed to insinuate others weren't "being realistic" or "having fantasies" or that you were the only one using common sense is just outright hypocritical.

Crap manners?, go back and read your previous post, you actually insulted me because you interpreted(falsely) something I said as an insult to Barry. Your way too sensitive, and you like to put words in peoples mouths, to the point where I cant even be bothered to reply to each point you've made that is complete bollocks. So, going to end this conversation here because, well, it's quite boring.

 

[Lufti]

Also, you need to chill out a bit, nobody is "insulting Barry" , man up ffs, its a forum for debate.

Of course those names were on my mind, and if you asked me sensibly instead of insults maybe those names would have come out.

 

[Lufti]

Crap manners?,

That's what the man said

Wow epic fail, Molby was a superb passer, clearly you don't really know much. Just checked your profile and realized you're to young to have even seen him, or Gazza play at their peak (or even at all), says it all really. Football didn't begin when you were 10 you know.

Oh Dear.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

Which was in response to

Lufti said: ↑
Lol.

An acceptable answer would have been Pirlo, who is on the same level as Scholes in terms of passing, but Scholes was the superior all round player. But Jan Molby. You've just joined a special list on here alongside SpursManChris and SpursKing

 

[Lufti]

Which was in response to

You got something you want to say to @SpursManChris and @Spursking ?

And FYI, you opened the discussion with me with a two letter post reading 'Oh Dear'. What did you expect?

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

You got something you want to say to @SpursManChris and @Spursking ?

No, but I think you have.

 

[Lufti]

No, but I think you have.

Not really. I get along well with both of them. They are on a special list for me, they have a vast wealth of knowledge of players and often put forward players I would never have thought of. Spurs King often comes up with African players I haven't heard of as potential stars, and SpursManChris picked out Jovetic as a potential signing in the summer, who could do very well for us. Your citing of the oft forgotten Jan Molby means you too join that special list of SC members. If you're embarrassed to be named along side them then clearly you've got something to say.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

Not really. I get along well with both of them. They are on a special list for me, they have a vast wealth of knowledge of players and often put forward players I would never have thought of. Spurs King often comes up with African players I haven't heard of as potential stars, and SpursManChris picked out Jovetic as a potential signing in the summer, who could do very well for us. Your citing of the oft forgotten Jan Molby means you too join that special list of SC members. If you're embarrassed to be named along side them then clearly you've got something to say.

Nice try, maybe you should take up creative writing.

 

[Lufti]

Nice try, maybe you should take up creative writing.

See what you did there, creative writing, creative rating.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

See what you did there, creative writing, creative rating.

Don't miss much do you

 

[DaSpurs]

Crap manners?, go back and read your previous post, you actually insulted me because you interpreted(falsely) something I said as an insult to Barry. Your way too sensitive, and you like to put words in peoples mouths, to the point where I cant even be bothered to reply to each point you've made that is complete bollocks. So, going to end this conversation here because, well, it's quite boring.

Sensitive? No, I can assure you I'm not phased by any of this. I just called you out for blindly making yourself look ridiculous, which in anything would hopefully help you in any debates in the future since you seem to be a bit naive as to the common decencies and rhetoric of it. And again, I didn't misquote you, I made a perfectly logical paraphrase.