The silent backlash continues...

[xtrac]

But I'd argue we played probably as much exciting football under Redknapp as we do under Pochettino. With just as many 'boring' or frustrating games thrown in.

To be honest im struggling to remember, chelsea match possibly last season?! Nothing sticks in my memory like, some of the edge of the seat stuff under H, and those before him, i still have some great memories from those days, today i dont go to matches anymore and if there on sky ill watch it, bt sport i didnt bother, in all honesty id rather take the kids out for the day now..i dunno i just feel disconnected with the club, maybe its my age, guess ive just lost that passion i had for the past 35 years!

 

[hodsgod]

People trying to rewrite history under Redknapp once again. We were widely regarded at that time as the most entertaining team in the premier league. I don't know whether that was. Redknapp or an accident of the accumulation of good players. I just know he was the manager involved.


http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/blogs/blog=blog_talkingpoint/postid=1605369.html


Tottenham Hotspur FC's reputation has grown steadily in the UEFA Champions League this season. Ever since Gareth Bale almost sparked one of the most dramatic comebacks witnessed at San Siro against holders FC Internazionale Milano in October, the north London team have become regarded as one of the competition's most entertaining sides.

Manager Harry Redknapp has been the inspiration behind Tottenham's charge to the quarter-finals, which the Group A winners sealed with a 1-0 aggregate victory over seven-time European champions AC Milan on Wednesday. The Spurs boss is now five games away from joining British predecessors such as Sir Alex Ferguson and Sir Matt Busby (Manchester United FC), Tony Barton (Aston Villa FC), Joe Fagan and Bob Paisley (Liverpool FC) and Brian Clough (Nottingham Forest FC) in lifting European club football's elite trophy.

When the 64-year-old Redknapp took over at White Hart Lane in October 2008, an expensively assembled but underperforming Tottenham squad were bottom of the Premier League with two points from eight games. Yet two and a half years later the former AFC Bournemouth, West Ham United FC, Portsmouth FC and Southampton FC boss has become the first English manager to reach the last eight of the European Champion Clubs' Cup since Terry Venables with FC Barcelona in 1986.

Fourth in the Premier League last term, Tottenham's UEFA Champions League mission was nearly aborted in August. They were 3-0 down to BSC Young Boys after 28 minutes of their play-off, with critics bemoaning Redknapp's bold decision to play 4-4-2 away from home in Europe.

After eventually overcoming the Swiss side, Redknapp – an FA Cup winner with Portsmouth in 2008 – did what all top coaches do: he learned from his mistakes and was not too proud to make changes. Spurs have since used Peter Crouch's aerial prowess in a 4-5-1 formation, with Rafael van der Vaart playing just off the target man. Not only has this enabled Tottenham to pack the centre of midfield with an extra body but it also allows the likes of Gareth Bale and Aaron Lennon to attack full-backs with freedom.

Spurs were the 18-goal leading scorers in the group stage and have become known for their attacking flair under Redknapp. Yet while Bale and Lennon have tormented defences, it was defensive resilience that earned them plaudits against Milan. "It's a great achievement to be in the last eight of the Champions League. It's amazing what the players have done," Redknapp enthused. "Barcelona are the team you don't want to play but, whatever comes, it's great to be in the last eight."

If left-back turned winger Bale stole the headlines for his sensational back-to-back displays against Internazionale, Spurs are far from a one-man band. Luka Modrić and Van der Vaart have also been key players in midfield, making massive contributions to the campaign.

The Dutchman is arguably one of the signings of the season. Van der Vaart arrived from Real Madrid CF on transfer-deadline day last summer and has been an instant hit. Besides scoring in the home victories over Inter and FC Twente, he delivered the perfect cross for Crouch to head in against SV Werder Bremen in Germany. Along with fellow newcomer William Gallas, who played for Chelsea FC and Arsenal FC at this level, the 28-year-old brings much-needed European experience.

As Tottenham continue to flourish under Redknapp, the question is whether the Londoner can join his illustrious British forebears in lifting the ultimate prize. Given Spurs' progress so far, perhaps nothing should be ruled out.

 

[Doctor Dinkey]

But I'd argue we played probably as much exciting football under Redknapp as we do under Pochettino. With just as many 'boring' or frustrating games thrown in.

Oh no no no have to dispute this. There's really no comparison. Although Harry's team was far from perfect- and we did lose the odd stupid game at home- the intention was always to be expansive, ambitious and exciting. OK, we don't have the players now, I'll concede that, but the team is now much more geared to a conservative approach which more often than not leads to pretty turgid outcomes. We played well- what, six, seven games last season? You can't level that at Harry's teams. Lot of annoying redknapp revisionism going on here.

 

[nicdic]

Oh no no no have to dispute this. There's really no comparison. Although Harry's team was far from perfect- and we did lose the odd stupid game at home- the intention was always to be expansive, ambitious and exciting. OK, we don't have the players now, I'll concede that, but the team is now much more geared to a conservative approach which more often than not leads to pretty turgid outcomes. We played well- what, six, seven games last season? You can't level that at Harry's teams. Lot of annoying redknapp revisionism going on here.

People take 3 years of Harry in charge, and conveniently wipe out all of the bad games, and there were some very very bad games, and just remember the good ones. We did play some lovely football under Harry at times, but we were still very often struggling to break teams down at home. We didn't always seek to be expansive, ambitious and exciting, we were very often devoid of ideas, and incredibly poor. Harry's team was great against a team that came and tried to actually play against us. He was no better against those who sat back than what we have now.

 

[TottenhamMattSpur]

People take 3 years of Harry in charge, and conveniently wipe out all of the bad games, and there were some very very bad games, and just remember the good ones. We did play some lovely football under Harry at times, but we were still very often struggling to break teams down at home. We didn't always seek to be expansive, ambitious and exciting, we were very often devoid of ideas, and incredibly poor. Harry's team was great against a team that came and tried to actually play against us. He was no better against those who sat back than what we have now.

No one is wiping all the bad games out.


You seem to be wiping the considerable amount of good games out though. And ignoring the fact that MOST games since he went have been boring fucking shite including many wins.

 

[fedupyid]

Redknapp gave us our only year of champions league football so no one can argue with the job he did. The fact is we have now moved on and Redknapp is the past so we have to move on and only remember his time with fond memories because he bought us some success.

 

[hodsgod]

Redknapp gave us our only year of champions league football so no one can argue with the job he did. The fact is we have now moved on and Redknapp is the past so we have to move on and only remember his time with fond memories because he bought us some success.

That's it exactly.

 

[0-Tibsy-0]

Is anyone else pissed off that 90 minutes into the season that some have decided there is no reason for optimism, or to back the team, or get behind the young players-or even just be a supporter and enjoy football and cheer the team on regardless of complete success. 1 game in and less than 90 minutes played by some and players are being completely torn apart because of pre conceived opinions, based on nothing new.

The football might not always be great, supporting Spurs certainly isn't a highlight reel of triumphs, the modern game has many flaws.

The attitude of a lot of fans is one of the biggest. Whether that is a by-product of other factors or has helped cause some of the other factors that we don't like about modern football is not the point in this instance. (albeit in certain discussion it is a key point).

Supporting our football team and enjoying it is one of the only things we have direct control over, it is our choice. I don't mind going to a game where we lose (as long as there is effort), but the atmosphere has been great- I enjoy it. I enjoy being part of something. I enjoy supporting the team. Even when we have played awfully, if there is fun in the stands then it is still a good day and if that atmosphere helps lead to a last minute Eriksen goal then fucking brilliant and things are great. (one of the things I agree with AVB on was his opinion of the crowd...)

Our fans on social media whose opinions i feel have infiltrated WHL are eroding this enjoyment a bit, for me anyway.

Sorry, rambling disjointed post that probably isn't that interesting or agreed with- just getting it off my chest a little

 

[spurs mental]

No one is wiping all the bad games out.


You seem to be wiping the considerable amount of good games out though. And ignoring the fact that MOST games since he went have been boring fucking shite including many wins.

Best XI under Redknapp

Gomes
Corluka
Dawson/Gallas
King
Assou Ekotto
Lennon
Parker
Modric
Van der Vaart
Bale
Crouch

Best XI now

Lloris
Walker
Vertonghen
Alderweireld
Rose
Bentaleb
Mason
Eriksen
Chadli
Dembele/Lamela
Kane

There's a reason our football is no where near as good. Look at the difference in those teams. Now tell me the current set up should be playing better football like we did under Redknapp. No? Thought so.

 

[Maske2g]

Does the author of the OP, @Maske2g realise it's August and some people are on holiday? And also that they may also not want to profit from their ticket, hence the below (probably 1/18th of their season ticket though) value pricing.

It is this type of relentless pessimism that sucks the atmosphere from a stadium.

I was at the Crystal Palace 0-0 last year. It was painful. But I waited in hope that we would nick a goal. I did not spend the lions share of the second half considering the traffic on the north circular.

Did we beat Chelsea 5-3? I couldn't get a ticket for that...that was probably fun though, wasn't it?

Were they on holiday from Dec to May as well? Lucky bastards!!

Chelsea was 1 of 3 or 4 enjoyable homes performances in the entire season. Is that how we measure ourselves now? 5-3 in our cup final........

When I made the often late decision to not bother, I still watched at home. We were fucking shit far more often than not in our home games. A common phone call from my old man became a running joke. "Dodged another bullet" Funny, except the joke is on us....

 

[TottenhamMattSpur]

Best XI under Redknapp

Gomes
Corluka
Dawson/Gallas
King
Assou Ekotto
Lennon
Parker
Modric
Van der Vaart
Bale
Crouch

Best XI now

Lloris
Walker
Vertonghen
Alderweireld
Rose
Bentaleb
Mason
Eriksen
Chadli
Dembele/Lamela
Kane

There's a reason our football is no where near as good. Look at the difference in those teams. Now tell me the current set up should be playing better football like we did under Redknapp. No? Thought so.

Maybe, just maybe, AVB and poch should grow some bollocks and ask for decent players then. Part of being a half decent manager/coach is recruitment. Regardless as the the roles of Baldini and Mitchell, the first team coach should be authorative enough to get what he wants.

One of the problems I have with both AVB and Poch is that they're just yes men.
You can also look towards levy for repeatedly looking for this kind of set up too. He wants all the player recruitment done by one department and then the coach to somehow make it work in another.
That's ridiculous.

 

[thekneaf]

@Maske2g you really do come across as a malcontent. I thought part of being a football fan was taking the rough with the smooth? Sure there are bad games, but then you get a Chelsea or Arsenal win and it's all the sweeter.

If you want to win all the time with good football, take a time machine to turn of the century Manchester and lap it up. This is Tottenham, and we're struggling, but struggling upwards.

 

[Maske2g]

Best XI under Redknapp

Gomes
Corluka
Dawson/Gallas
King
Assou Ekotto
Lennon
Parker
Modric
Van der Vaart
Bale
Crouch

Best XI now

Lloris
Walker
Vertonghen
Alderweireld
Rose
Bentaleb
Mason
Eriksen
Chadli
Dembele/Lamela
Kane

There's a reason our football is no where near as good. Look at the difference in those teams. Now tell me the current set up should be playing better football like we did under Redknapp. No? Thought so.

You are 100% right. But why should the supporters, who are paying the more for their tickets than nearly every team in world football, tolerate the club not making genuine attempts to correct this?

As I said before, if you make signings, you have optimism that things could change. Everyone here has eyes. We all know the current set of players are not going to make going to Spurs enjoyable on a regular basis.

Dembele. Beats a man. Dawdles. Shields the Ball. plays it backwards.

Eriksen. Doesn't get on it enough. Doesn't take risks. Can't take a corner. Not up for a fight. (the very least you need to get average fans worked up)

Lamela. Colour blind. Scared to run with the ball.

Townsend. Put your head down son, and don't look up until you've got at least 3 defenders around you, or an improbable shooting chance.

Chadli. Just chill out. you play when you feel like it.

How can anyone in the ground get excited about the above?

The atmosphere against Arsenal last season was electric. The best for years, even at 1- 0 down. The players showed they cared, fought first, and played the quick football with it.

2 weeks later, they turned up and dawdled around the pitch for 80 minutes against West Ham and nicked a draw. If you don't come out at home with intent, and take risks in the final 3rd, the fans won't be up for it, and the performance suffers. Our tactics are great away. We must take more risks at home.

People say "would you want to win 4-3, then lose 3-2 the next week?" Well yes. Because at the moment we are winning 2-1 and losing 1-0. So its the same result, but with a coma inducing method.

 

[0-Tibsy-0]

The atmosphere against Arsenal last season was electric. The best for years, even at 1- 0 down. The players showed they cared, fought first, and played the quick football with it.

2 weeks later, they turned up and dawdled around the pitch for 80 minutes against West Ham and nicked a draw. If you don't come out at home with intent, and take risks in the final 3rd, the fans won't be up for it, and the performance suffers. Our tactics are great away. We must take more risks at home.
.

I'm not saying it's true or even a good reason.But- Do you think the differing atmosphere generated by the fans at the beginning of the match could have played a part in the resulting start to the performance, could have perhaps influenced the application of the intent (because the intent to perform will always be there for the majority of pros)?

 

[evoid]

Maske - You epitomise what I hate in the modern football/Spurs fan. Neither Levy, Poch or any of the employees of Spurs owe you anything. There isn't an obligation to spend X amount each season nor is there a requirement to play a certain brand of football. When you buy a ticket or season ticket the only thing your £50/60/70 spend guarantees you is that you will get to watch 90 minutes of football from an allocated seat. Everything else is a bonus. Stop thinking Spurs owes you something for your loyalty or the money you've spent and then you may be able to enjoy the games more.

Old Trafford on Saturday is a great example of this. I spent £46 on a ticket, £40 on fuel, £20 on food/drink etc and I knew full well that we could go and get spanked 4-0 with none of our players being bothered to turn up, but that's the risk I'm willing to take.

There's a whole host of reasons why less people are attending matches; ticket prices, travel prices or the reason I don't go to home matches anymore, people like you. I generally do one home match a season (Arsenal) but why would I want to go and sit next to people who have nothing better to do than moan and criticise for 90 minutes? Where's the enjoyment in that?

Away matches are great in comparison and if travel was cheaper I would be at every single away game this season. There was a great 5 minute period in the 2nd half on Saturday where our fans just went mental at getting behind the team. It cost us nothing, so why can't we do it at home games? There's an obvious answer but I'll let you figure that out..

Literally agree with all of this. I love going to football, we could play the shittest football and be in league 2 and I would still go home or away. Football to me isn't just about the 90 minutes on the pitch, but the whole day (couple of days in Europe). I love going up to football with my old man, meeting up with mine and his mates, having a few beers before the game, watching the match and then a few beers after before heading home. Last season one of my favourite days was Stoke away despite losing 3-0. I agree with you that the only thing that really puts me off attending home matches is the self-entitled fans that do nothing but moan and shout abuse at our players for 90 minutes.

I can understand to some extent that some people who pay upwards of £50 a game want to be entertained, but at the end of the day you know how we're playing at the moment if you don't enjoy it don't go. Let someone else have the ticket, who might actually back the team. You know when you buy the tickets there's a risk we could lose, there's no guarantees in football. Some on here would like us to play as Arsenal do, they still lost at home to West Ham on the weekend, the Premier League Champions Chelsea could only manage a draw at home to Swansea. There's no guarantees that if you pay good money you'll get good football.

When I spend money on tickets I know full well that we could get spanked that day, however I also know I'll have a quality day with my Dad and my mates supporting the club I love. I just love going to football.

 

[Maske2g]

@Maske2g you really do come across as a malcontent. I thought part of being a football fan was taking the rough with the smooth? Sure there are bad games, but then you get a Chelsea or Arsenal win and it's all the sweeter.

If you want to win all the time with good football, take a time machine to turn of the century Manchester and lap it up. This is Tottenham, and we're struggling, but struggling upwards.

3 years ago, I said things, that I now disagree with. I said I'd sacrifice good football for results. And that is pretty much what we got with AVB. The players were worse, the results still decent, the defence better, the football diabolical.

I was wrong. Give me 62 pts from enjoyable football any day of the week over 65 from scrapping out results.

This team are not going to finish 4th in a million years playing this way with these players. The only way we can do it is by making a couple of daring signings, going for it on the pitch, and maybe hitting a run where confidence goes through the roof. We would need to break our PL points record, with maybe another side slipping up.

Our current cagey, "defense first" method of football doesn't breed confidence or a winning mentality in my opinion, it's more a fear of losing.

On the flip side to the above, we could lose a few more games and finish 8th or 9th, but if its more fun to watch, who cares??That is what football is all about, not money, not profit, not scraping your way to an irrelevant 5th placed finish, it's about.....well, you know all our club motto's don't you?

 

[Maske2g]

I'm not saying it's true or even a good reason.But- Do you think the differing atmosphere generated by the fans at the beginning of the match could have played a part in the resulting start to the performance, could have perhaps influenced the application of the intent (because the intent to perform will always be there for the majority of pros)?

No I do not. Fans need something to cheer. Just being there is not going to generate that. People just aren't as easily pleased nowadays. Start with pace, like Jol's teams use to, set the tempo, and it will get the crowd on your side from the off.

" intent to perform will always be there for the majority of pros" This is naive at best

They are humans. Some days you just aren't switched on. Bentaleb a classic case on Saturday. If you are playing poorly (5-6 poor short passes), go out your way to get fired up. He hid instead and got hauled off, leaving Dier on in CM. Bit embarrassing for him really.

 

[ERO]

Were they on holiday from Dec to May as well? Lucky bastards!!

Chelsea was 1 of 3 or 4 enjoyable homes performances in the entire season. Is that how we measure ourselves now? 5-3 in our cup final........

When I made the often late decision to not bother, I still watched at home. We were fucking shit far more often than not in our home games. A common phone call from my old man became a running joke. "Dodged another bullet" Funny, except the joke is on us....

Our cup final? Chelsea in the league is supposed to be our cup final? That's something I'd might expect to read on a Chelsea site, not on here.

Maybe you're confusing it with our actual cup final, where we incidentially played Chelsea too.

 

[Maske2g]

Our cup final? Chelsea in the league is supposed to be our cup final? That's something I'd might expect to read on a Chelsea site, not on here.

Maybe you're confusing it with our actual cup final, where we incidentially played Chelsea too.

Maybe you are confusing a clearly sarcastic comment.........

 

[Nocando]

Literally agree with all of this. I love going to football, we could play the shittest football and be in league 2 and I would still go home or away. Football to me isn't just about the 90 minutes on the pitch, but the whole day (couple of days in Europe). I love going up to football with my old man, meeting up with mine and his mates, having a few beers before the game, watching the match and then a few beers after before heading home. Last season one of my favourite days was Stoke away despite losing 3-0. I agree with you that the only thing that really puts me off attending home matches is the self-entitled fans that do nothing but moan and shout abuse at our players for 90 minutes.

I can understand to some extent that some people who pay upwards of £50 a game want to be entertained, but at the end of the day you know how we're playing at the moment if you don't enjoy it don't go. Let someone else have the ticket, who might actually back the team. You know when you buy the tickets there's a risk we could lose, there's no guarantees in football. Some on here would like us to play as Arsenal do, they still lost at home to West Ham on the weekend, the Premier League Champions Chelsea could only manage a draw at home to Swansea. There's no guarantees that if you pay good money you'll get good football.

When I spend money on tickets I know full well that we could get spanked that day, however I also know I'll have a quality day with my Dad and my mates supporting the club I love. I just love going to football.

Unfortunately I think you're one of the good few. Like you, I love the occasion, and even as a season ticket holder I care more about having a good time than the actual result, that's why the atmosphere is so important to me.

Sadly I can no longer enjoy watching football with my Dad, which again made following football so much more than just the result (even if we did sulk afterwards). Without being too soppy those moments are special, cherish them.