Match Threads Aston Villa vs Spurs - Match Thread

[dontcallme]

I have said it before but happy to repeat. At the moment with the players Jose has at his disposal we have a midfield where we can play physical players like Dier and Sissoko to protect the defence or we can play the passers like Lo Celso, Winks and Lamela.

The first option hasn't worked. They don't protect the defence adequately and when we have tried playing Dier or Sissoko with Winks it hasn't worked. They don't protect the defence adequately and Winks has no one to play football with to get good passing moves going.

So Jose has gone with the players who play with some intensity and are good at quick passing moves and transitioning to attack quickly. Add this to a front 3 where no one holds up the ball and all are looking to hit quickly and get a shot in.

This results in us giving up possession all the time. But, as frustrating as they for long periods they do get goals. It wouldn't surprise if we don't have more possession in another PL game this season but we will get a lot of wins. If you look at the possession stats we don't deserve to win, if you look at chances made then we do.

I din't think this is going to work long term. Some teams will successfully shut up shop against us and counter well. But for now, with the available players I think Jose has found a winning formula.

Next season Kane will be back and with a couple more players we can be stronger, dominate possession more and the tempo of the game. But for now, enjoy the excitement. We're winning again, it's not embarrassing.

 

[easley91]

I do wonder if Lloris' hesitancy is down to the arm break he had? That would knock anyone's confidence and decision making.

 

[carpediem991]

I do wonder if Lloris' hesitancy is down to the arm break he had? That would knock anyone's confidence and decision making.

That certainly didn't help but personally I think it is more down to his decisions he made the past two season where he regulary misjudged these moments. He feels super comfortable on the line, and only there...

 

[Japhet]

Can I extrapolate from that info that the Villa takeover enabled them to offer him a desirable enough new contract for him to stay, because he did sign a new contract and that's what put an end to the negotiations and rumours about him joining us?

The underlying fallacy and false-fact all over the thread is that we "missed out" on signing Grealish and, secondarily, that this resulted from offering an inadequate transfer fee.

You can only "miss out" on a signing if the player actually moves. If a player joins another club for a higher fee or a bigger salary, then we "missed out", although often that's justifiable in value for money terms.

If a player chooses to stay put, no one has "missed out". People seem to think Grealish had no say in the matter! It's not as if we could have forced him to join us. He signed a new contract, which may have resulted directly from the takeover.

From what I remember, we had a good opportunity to sign Grealish earlier in the window for 25m (allegedly). That is the point where Levy could have got a deal done but decided to start haggling. At that point Villa received their rescue package and Grealish's price rocketed to over 40m, and at that point Levy walked away, leaving Grealish to sign a new deal with Villa. That's what ITK alluded to at the time and I can only conclude that there was a deal to be had which Levy cocked up. Can't say I'm disappointed though since we ended up with Lo Celso instead.

 

[dontcallme]

From what I remember, we had a good opportunity to sign Grealish earlier in the window for 25m (allegedly). That is the point where Levy could have got a deal done but decided to start haggling. At that point Villa received their rescue package and Grealish's price rocketed to over 40m, and at that point Levy walked away, leaving Grealish to sign a new deal with Villa. That's what ITK alluded to at the time and I can only conclude that there was a deal to be had which Levy cocked up. Can't say I'm disappointed though since we ended up with Lo Celso instead.

I think DM's point was partly that no other club bought Grealish. If he was such a highly rated player and easily obtainable then surely another top 6 club would have shown interest.

My general feeling at the time was Grealish was seen as a first team squad player but not a big signing or guaranteed starter. I have been impressed by him season but if we had a fully fit squad and once Lo Celso and Ndombele are settled in would he start every game? Probably not. So it is not unreasonable for the board to negotiated a fair deal and if his price is too high then we move onto other targets, in this case we got Lo Celso.

If he was seen as a priority signing and we dithered then fine, attack Levy. But buying Lo Celso instead of Grealish hardly seems a huge crime.

 

[shelfboy68]

Every time they got a corner I was terrified, something isn't right as this sort of stuff can be coached and drilled into players.
First goal was a stupid mistake caused by hesitancy by both Toby an Hugo...second goal Toby just got his pants pulled down, they had a couple of other good chances from corners as well.

Agree mate Hugo hesitated against Southampton and we got away with it there is so much panic in the back four, maybe Jose is conscious the he is considered a park the bus coach so has decided not to spend to much time on the defence.

 

[Thenewcat]

I think DM's point was partly that no other club bought Grealish. If he was such a highly rated player and easily obtainable then surely another top 6 club would have shown interest.

My general feeling at the time was Grealish was seen as a first team squad player but not a big signing or guaranteed starter. I have been impressed by him season but if we had a fully fit squad and once Lo Celso and Ndombele are settled in would he start every game? Probably not. So it is not unreasonable for the board to negotiated a fair deal and if his price is too high then we move onto other targets, in this case we got Lo Celso.

If he was seen as a priority signing and we dithered then fine, attack Levy. But buying Lo Celso instead of Grealish hardly seems a huge crime.

We were in for Grealish a year before we got Lo Celso, it was the start of the two empty windows. The two aren’t linked

 

[dontcallme]

We were in for Grealish a year before we got Lo Celso, it was the start of the two empty windows. The two aren’t linked

We were talking about last summer, try to keep up.

Last summer there were negotiations with Grealish and it seemed he might be available on a slightly cut price. Then new owners came in and offered him a bigger contract. We then bought Lo Celso.

 

[Gassin's finest]

Lo Celso will be a far better player than Grealish. Already ready is in my humble opinion. Grealish benefits from being a big fish in a small pond. Same thing happened to Bentley. He was excellent at Blackburn, but couldn't make the step up.

 

[dontcallme]

Lo Celso will be a far better player than Grealish. Already ready is in my humble opinion. Grealish benefits from being a big fish in a small pond. Same thing happened to Bentley. He was excellent at Blackburn, but couldn't make the step up.

Maybe, I think Bentley's problem was more that he didn't really want to put in the effort and make the social sacrifices required to get to the top.

Grealish seems to have that work rate and desire to take responsibility. Interested to see how he plays at a better club with better players around him.

 

[Thenewcat]

We were talking about last summer, try to keep up.

Last summer there were negotiations with Grealish and it seemed he might be available on a slightly cut price. Then new owners came in and offered him a bigger contract. We then bought Lo Celso.

The new owners came in in July 2018

 

[dontcallme]

The new owners came in in July 2018

Aston Villa owners buy out Tony Xia in debt financing play - SportsPro

Edens and Sawiris pay UK£30m promotion clause payment to up stake. [...]Read More...

www.sportspromedia.com

Yeah but they weren't the complete owners. The power shifted last summer when Tony Xia was bought out which led to Grealish signing a new contract.

 

[C0YS]

I have said it before but happy to repeat. At the moment with the players Jose has at his disposal we have a midfield where we can play physical players like Dier and Sissoko to protect the defence or we can play the passers like Lo Celso, Winks and Lamela.

The first option hasn't worked. They don't protect the defence adequately and when we have tried playing Dier or Sissoko with Winks it hasn't worked. They don't protect the defence adequately and Winks has no one to play football with to get good passing moves going.

So Jose has gone with the players who play with some intensity and are good at quick passing moves and transitioning to attack quickly. Add this to a front 3 where no one holds up the ball and all are looking to hit quickly and get a shot in.

This results in us giving up possession all the time. But, as frustrating as they for long periods they do get goals. It wouldn't surprise if we don't have more possession in another PL game this season but we will get a lot of wins. If you look at the possession stats we don't deserve to win, if you look at chances made then we do.

I din't think this is going to work long term. Some teams will successfully shut up shop against us and counter well. But for now, with the available players I think Jose has found a winning formula.

Next season Kane will be back and with a couple more players we can be stronger, dominate possession more and the tempo of the game. But for now, enjoy the excitement. We're winning again, it's not embarrassing.

This is a misunderstanding of Sissoko's role. He is the more attacking player out of Winks and him. His role is to roam around fill in gaps and to bring the ball out from deep. He is not a defensive midfielder. Winks is normally played as a defensive midfielder. But he is not always that consistent there. Today he had more license to attack and was decent. Against Man city he was playing very much as a classic DM as was great.

Yeh Jose has never particularly cared for possession, and has always liked quick transitions. I think his tactics have been pretty consistent since coming in. Just building up on things.

 

[daryl hannah]

Watching the game again - Pepe Reina had a worldy, didn't he?

Very good GK display.

 

[dontcallme]

This is a misunderstanding of Sissoko's role. He is the more attacking player out of Winks and him. His role is to roam around fill in gaps and to bring the ball out from deep. He is not a defensive midfielder. Winks is normally played as a defensive midfielder. But he is not always that consistent there. Today he had more license to attack and was decent. Against Man city he was playing very much as a classic DM as was great.

Yeh Jose has never particularly cared for possession, and has always liked quick transitions. I think his tactics have been pretty consistent since coming in. Just building up on things.

I didn't say Sissoko was a defensive midfielder. I said he is physical, very strange if you disagree with that. Your post has valid points but nothing at all to do with my post so I have no idea why you quoted me

 

[C0YS]

That certainly didn't help but personally I think it is more down to his decisions he made the past two season where he regulary misjudged these moments. He feels super comfortable on the line, and only there...

Not sure about that. He has made a lot of mistakes but almost always plays in the same way regardless. I think he is still feeling himself into the team and it's natural that he isn't quite as confident. He hasn't played football in a long time. I also felt that in the second half it seemed like he was told to stay on his line in corners. I mean Villa were trying to block him from getting the ball at the corners. So I suspect we wished to minimise the risk.

Lo Celso will be a far better player than Grealish. Already ready is in my humble opinion. Grealish benefits from being a big fish in a small pond. Same thing happened to Bentley. He was excellent at Blackburn, but couldn't make the step up.

Different players. Would take Grealish any day. Also bentley is a strange case for many reasons. He gave up on football as soon as things started turning against him. Very different players. I mean it might not work, but everything says that Grealish would be a hit.

 

[C0YS]

I didn't say Sissoko was a defesnive midfielder. I said he is physical, very strange if you disagree with that. Your post has valid points but nothing at all to do with my post so I have no idea why you quoted me

Yeh I largely agree with what you said. But I think Lo Celso is also very very physical like, I'm not sure I would create the distinctions in the way you do is all.

 

[carpediem991]

Watching the game again - Pepe Reina had a worldy, didn't he?

Very good GK display.

He had a very good game, probably an 8.
But I haven't seen some unreal saves. He was helped a lot by our weak finishing.

 

[dontcallme]

Yeh I largely agree with what you said. But I think Lo Celso is also very very physical like, I'm not sure I would create the distinctions in the way you do is all.

I didn't say anything about Lo Celso's physicality. I said he is good at pass and move which is why he links well with Winks. Winks plays better with other midfielders who can pass and move. Winks has never successfully played with Dier and/or Sissoko as these players cannot play short, quick passes and one twos.

 

[isaac94]

Imagine him playing well and not scoring?

I prefer him scoring and not play well.

i agree, not saying its a bad thing