The beginning of the end...

dudu · Aug 27, 2019

Matthew said:
whats your point? the point we are making is we are levels away from that over the past year, why do people just assume everyone is basing it on the opening 3 games for fuck sake.

Because our form at the end of last year has its own set of circumstances that can be attributed to it. Fair enough if you want to see it as the same thing.

I was responding to people dreaming of it being 2016/2017 again. Our form was not that great over the first 10 or so matches that season and we seriously struggled consistently to break down teams like Villa and Newcastle.

danielneeds · Aug 27, 2019

I understand why everyone’s grumpy but we have to remember that they always start the season slowly after Poch’s preseasons. It’s been the same every year pretty much. We then click around November and come on like a train at Xmas and the New Year.

Last season was a one-off conditioning-wise. The squad was on its knees by March-April.

thebenjamin · Aug 27, 2019

People need to remember that in the last couple of months, Poch has been sitting down with Ndombele and GLC, selling him them on his vision going forward for the club and developing them as players. He obviously did it well enough to convince them to put their careers in his hands.

wadewill · Aug 27, 2019

Good Doctor M said:
For months?

What did I miss? I can't remember a more positive summer on here in years.

Probably in the hope that the signings would reinvented the team, they haven’t.

The problem isn’t 4 games. It’s the last 7/8 months.

People that are harping back to the CL final are so deluded. We were lucky not to be 2/3 down away at Dortmund at HT there.
If Aguero scores that pen we go out with a whimper against City.
Ajax had numerous attempts to finish us off, mainly the one that hit the post in the first leg.

We were outplayed in all those games and got through with loads of luck.

Then in the final we were pathetic

This is a long decline. If this was Sherwood he would be on his way out, if this was AVB he would be on his way out.

We are poor and it won’t change against Arsenal, it’s going to be embarrassing if we play like we have been.

Poch does have more in the bank but at some point (probably 4/5 games) Levy will know that the season is still saveable

When was the last time you watched us and thought “yeah, we are looking good here”

Huddersfield? That doesn’t count.

Apart from that I really can’t think

People ignoring the performances over the last 15 games are blind IMO.

wadewill · Aug 27, 2019

Dougal said:
Without doubt the short highlight of the league season was a few games in December. People won’t like to hear it but there were well documented reasons for that too. No World Cup this summer so hopefully the smaller issues will be put to bed quicker. Along with this thread.

I really hope so, but I don’t think it will

$hoguN · Aug 27, 2019

Dougal said:
Without doubt the short highlight of the league season was a few games in December. People won’t like to hear it but there were well documented reasons for that too. No World Cup this summer so hopefully the smaller issues will be put to bed quicker. Along with this thread.

Yet Liverpool and City also had players go deep into the World Cup and managed not to crumble

dagraham · Aug 27, 2019

NickHSpurs said:
This. The minute DL thinks we're starting to drift from Top 4 he will not hesitate in pulling the trigger. We have to finish there, we need the cash and the profile it's that simple.

If we have to finish there I’d ask the question of why we didn’t replace Dembele when it was clear he was already on the decline, instead waiting until after he was long gone? And why haven’t we planned for Eriksen’s possible departure ( or to simply remedy the fact that he may have played way too much)? It’s not like we haven’t had multiple transfer windows to do so.

Our succession planning has been piss poor, whereas we could have had a far smoother transition instead of sitting on our hands.

Now I’m obviously not privy to all the facts, so for all I know the answer to those questions maybe that Poch was largely driving this strategy.

All I’m saying is despite what I believe are justified concerns about how Poch has been setting us up in games and the nature of the performances for quite a long period of time, I think we should be very reticent of just throwing the best manager we’ve had in years under the bus. At least not without appreciating that there maybe others culpable of blame.

Blackrat1299 · Aug 27, 2019

yankspurs said:
Lock this thread. Throw away the key. Burn it with fire. And we'll pretend this never happened.

Until next Sunday!

guiltyparty · Aug 27, 2019

danielneeds said:
I understand why everyone’s grumpy but we have to remember that they always start the season slowly after Poch’s preseasons. It’s been the same every year pretty much. We then click around November and come on like a train at Xmas and the New Year.

Last season was a one-off conditioning-wise. The squad was on its knees by March-April.

We didn’t win any of our last four games in the league in 15/16. We won 2 of our last 5 in 14/15, lost four, drew 2 of our last 10.

It’s not a one-off, we finished 16/17 strongly, that was the one/off. Every other season under Pochettino we’ve faded dramatically in the league. You can’t couple that with a bad start and expect to get better

Coco-1101 · Aug 27, 2019

wadewill said:
Probably in the hope that the signings would reinvented the team, they haven’t.

The problem isn’t 4 games. It’s the last 7/8 months.

People that are harping back to the CL final are so deluded. We were lucky not to be 2/3 down away at Dortmund at HT there.
If Aguero scores that pen we go out with a whimper against City.
Ajax had numerous attempts to finish us off, mainly the one that hit the post in the first leg.

We were outplayed in all those games and got through with loads of luck.

Then in the final we were pathetic

This is a long decline. If this was Sherwood he would be on his way out, if this was AVB he would be on his way out.

We are poor and it won’t change against Arsenal, it’s going to be embarrassing if we play like we have been.

Poch does have more in the bank but at some point (probably 4/5 games) Levy will know that the season is still saveable

When was the last time you watched us and thought “yeah, we are looking good here”

Huddersfield? That doesn’t count.

Apart from that I really can’t think

People ignoring the performances over the last 15 games are blind IMO.

In 3 games? Not all of them available yet? I have seen it all.

$hoguN · Aug 27, 2019

danielneeds said:
I understand why everyone’s grumpy but we have to remember that they always start the season slowly after Poch’s preseasons. It’s been the same every year pretty much. We then click around November and come on like a train at Xmas and the New Year.

Last season was a one-off conditioning-wise. The squad was on its knees by March-April.

That’s such a shite excuse though. City and Liverpool are both as fit as us and aren’t playing like they have never met each other

Shadydan · Aug 27, 2019

wadewill said:
Probably in the hope that the signings would reinvented the team, they haven’t.

The problem isn’t 4 games. It’s the last 7/8 months.

People that are harping back to the CL final are so deluded. We were lucky not to be 2/3 down away at Dortmund at HT there.
If Aguero scores that pen we go out with a whimper against City.
Ajax had numerous attempts to finish us off, mainly the one that hit the post in the first leg.

We were outplayed in all those games and got through with loads of luck.

Then in the final we were pathetic

This is a long decline. If this was Sherwood he would be on his way out, if this was AVB he would be on his way out.

We are poor and it won’t change against Arsenal, it’s going to be embarrassing if we play like we have been.

Poch does have more in the bank but at some point (probably 4/5 games) Levy will know that the season is still saveable

When was the last time you watched us and thought “yeah, we are looking good here”

Huddersfield? That doesn’t count.

Apart from that I really can’t think

People ignoring the performances over the last 15 games are blind IMO.

Not disagreeing with the fact that we haven't put in good performances in a long time but the narrative that we only got through the CL final is purely down to luck is irritating beyond belief and does a massive disservice to our team.

wadewill · Aug 27, 2019

Shadydan said:
Not disagreeing with the fact that we haven't put in good performances in a long time but the narrative that we only got through the CL final is purely down to luck is irritating beyond belief and does a massive disservice to our team.

I get what you are saying, against Dortmund we were superb at home.

But City and Ajax would have both beaten us 9/10 times

I said it at the time, it was great but we were not the better team in either of those ties, not by a long way

guiltyparty · Aug 27, 2019

$hoguN said:
That’s such a shite excuse though. City and Liverpool are both as fit as us and aren’t playing like they have never met each other

It’s also not true. If you start every season badly and finish every season badly (which we have done every season bar one under Poch), you’re not going to improve enough.

Yes we’re great end of the year into the new year. Alas that’s not when things are won.

shelfboy68 · Aug 27, 2019

$hoguN said:
Yet Liverpool and City also had players go deep into the World Cup and managed not to crumble

That's because their not Tottenham players but there is no point in debating this because there are those who have been saying for a while that we are not playing well as the stats clearly prove, and then there are those who simply refuse to accept that there are issues even a 5-0 thrashing from the gooners will probably ellicit a response such as "the player's had a difficult coach ride to the stadium" and all will be covered up again.

John48 · Aug 27, 2019

Well it's got the pundits talking with a good article by Henry Winter & the Mail highlighting that only Brighton have won few games in the last 15 games & if that's not an indication that there's something awry I don't know what is.

Everlasting Seconds · Aug 27, 2019

guiltyparty said:
It’s also not true. If you start every season badly and finish every season badly (which we have done every season bar one under Poch), you’re not going to improve enough.

Yes we’re great end of the year into the new year. Alas that’s not when things are won.

You are absolutely correct. Every spring a Pochettino team messes up. Before us, Southampton dropped considerably in the spring, too.

Shadydan · Aug 27, 2019

wadewill said:
I get what you are saying, against Dortmund we were superb at home.

But City and Ajax would have both beaten us 9/10 times

I said it at the time, it was great but we were not the better team in either of those ties, not by a long way

But they didn't, you're arguing in ifs and buts and focusing on key moments whilst ignoring that those games were played over 180 mins and what actually did happen. Why is Aguero missing a penalty seen as a negative for example and not seeing as an excellent Lloris save for example, that's nothing to do with luck?

We had a nailed on penalty turned down on Sunday which had Kane converted we would probably have gone onto win, if I said that and used that win as an excuse to cover up our form I doubt many would have agreed with me, you can't have it both ways.

shelfboy68 · Aug 27, 2019

John48 said:
Well it's got the pundits talking with a good article by Henry Winter & the Mail highlighting that only Brighton have won few games in the last 15 games & if that's not an indication that there's something awry I don't know what is.

There is clearly something wrong that is relegation form but not to worry because poch has got this and we are all making it up.

yawa · Aug 27, 2019

John48 said:
Well it's got the pundits talking with a good article by Henry Winter & the Mail highlighting that only Brighton have won few games in the last 15 games & if that's not an indication that there's something awry I don't know what is.

But it’s because the European transfer window ends after ours and so the squad is not settled.

Well that’s the bs some would like you to believe.

Personally I think Poch needs to mix up some of his coaching staff. Bring in some fresh faces.

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