The ousting of Daniel (COYS)

[For the love of Spurs]

Exactly this. Very few people here believe that Levy has some overarching footballing vision for the club.

It's more likely he'll take another punt on the latest name to take his fancy.

Our current overarching vision appears to be grabbing managers, spending a bit and hoping for top 4. It’s really backwards.

Clubs like Brighton and Brentford who are much much smaller than us are far better run than we are. Their scouting and management appear to have a plan for every eventuality and a laid out path for long term growth on the pitch.

We have looked since Poch like a club be driven by a drunk, it’s quite embarrassing at times. I don’t get how ENIC can be so visionary off the pitch and so clueless on it and I don’t get why they don’t seem to understand not only is it breaking the relationship with fans but it’s probably costing them a lot of money in the long run.

 

[bigfrooj]

I've got it!! A way that we can finally get Levy out once and for all. It's a 9 point plan but if we really want to force this money grabbing fraudster out of our club it's something we simply have to do. We all know that Levy only cares about the money so we have to hit him in the pocket as it's the only way things will change. I think any fan that's really wants Levy out should follow this plan.

1. Do not renew your season tickets. There are over 20,000 season tickets and if you give Levy all this money before the season has even kicked off then you don't have any power to withhold money from the club for the rest of the season.

2. Do not buy tickets or go to matches. An empty stadium will humiliate Levy and the club will miss out on all the match day revenue.

3. With no fans in the stadium commercial partners will withdraw as there won't be any fans to see the adverts, costing the club extra revenue.

4. Don't purchase any club merchandise so Levy doesn't get any money from that either.

5. It's one thing to take revenue away from Levy, and reducing the money the club makes is one thing, but we can compound Levy's misery further by not only reducing the money the club makes but by also increasing the money our rivals make.

6. We should buy as much merchandise from rival clubs as possible. Buy home and away kits, Training wear, pajamas. Why not get your whole bedroom kitted out. Thereby increasing revenue for Levy's competitors.

7. Buy tickets to other clubs games. Hell, if you really want Levy out, buy a season ticket. The increase in match revenue at other clubs when Levy's match revenue is going through the floor will really hurt him.

8. Now buying tickets to games is good, but imagine how pissed off he'll be when, his baby, the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium is empty and other clubs stadiums are full. So make sure you go to the games and go often.

9. Repeat points 1 to 8 for as long as it takes for Levy to get the message.

There you go. A foolproof plan to get Levy out that simply can't fail. Who's with me?

You already have the choice about which club you support and how you spend your income, and how you spend your time, we all do. None of us need a nine point plan because we’re not going to stop being Spurs fans in a synchronised manner for anyone, even Daniel Levy. There is a myth that football supporters are an organised group of people, we’re all a type and we all think the same which couldn’t be more untrue. I’m not going tomorrow and at the next game i go to I won’t be buying any food or beverage, that’s my protest. Not everyone will be doing that and I’m not going to ask them to, although a drop in revenue is the language he understands as you rightly illustrate.
I now think Daniel Levy needs to move on for the good of the club and I also now think that he is getting that but only because his media team are picking up on all platforms that Spurs fans are threatening to withhold their money until there is a fundamental change at the top. The songs and the abuse probably have little effect on a guy like Levy, he’ll always think he can ride it out, and I think most Spurs fans I know have the class not to get more aggressive than that.

 

[Drink!Drink!]

Of course a big cultural problem, a long, shadow over our club is its Latin motto

Audere est Facere

Widely translated from Latin as meaning: "be careful what you wish for"

Although some prefer the alternative translation of: "better the devil you know"

 

[DiVaio]

Maybe instead we could do a LIverpool....or an Arsenal

we certainly aren't going to do those last two with Levy in charge

The only difference of what Levy is doing and what FSG or Kroenke are doing is which club's manager at the moment is doing really good job.
Liverpool fans wants their owners out as club is underperforming because their midfield is poor, which was well reported it was Klopp decision to extend contract with Henderson, Milner etc and not because FSG are greedy and doesn't want to invest in their squad.

 

[jurgen]

I really don't agree with that.

A key difference between us and Chelsea / Liverpool is that our periods of good recruitment have been from a weaker starting position (mid-table, not top 4 regulars) and with lesser means to recruit with (lower turnover + not such a big draw to the most sought after players). For that reason, I would say it's naïve and overly simplistic to judge the recruitment success of each club by their trophies. Our recruitment had to be far better than that of the teams we caught / closed the gap on, because we had to catch up with their squad strength while spending significantly less (due to our far inferior revenue). A comparison of trophies would be more representative of our recruitment success if you were comparing us to clubs who were of a more similar stature at the starting point (i.e. if looking at recruitment since ENIC bought the club, compare our trophy haul to clubs like Everton, Villa, West Ham & Southampton).

Liverpool had 2-3 years of very good recruitment, which resulted in their PL & CL trophies, but either side of this have had some pretty terrible periods of recruitment. Before Klopp, Liverpool squandered a lot of money, struggled to adequately replace key departures (e.g. Alonso & Mascherano replaced with Aquillani & Shelvey! - which must have been a significant factor in Benitez's demise) and went from being an ever-present part of an unbreachable "big four" to struggling to qualify for the Europa League. Even during their title-winning campaign, pundits were already questioning their recruitment (or lack of it), and their drop in performances since then has been very predictable. The last time they clearly upgraded on there starting XI was Alisson in 2018 (half a decade ago!). Jota, Thiago, Diaz, Nunez etc. are not terrible players by any means, but they are downgrades on what the declining / departing players they were brought in to replace had been contributing to the team during their prime years.
Despite a 4(?) fantastic years under Klopp (underpinned by 2-3 years of very good recruitment), they have finished below us in 8 of the last 13 seasons, which contradicts your assertion that their recruitment has been better than ours over a long period.
Their good patch under Klopp lasted about the same duration as our good patch under Poch. If Klopp is now given time to attempt recover from his current struggles, that's time no other "big" club has given a manager in recent history (Poch certainly wasn't in 2019).

Chelsea were regularly challenging for / winning the PL as a result of £2billion of financial doping, which meant it didn't matter if 2/3 of their expensive signings flopped. A lot of their recruitment has been very questionable, even during Mourinho's two title-winning reigns (they signed players like Shevchenko, Salah & de Bruyne, even though they weren't in the manager's plans, then practically gave them away). Obviously, they assembled some very good teams, but they had 30-40 failed signings out on loan at any given time...who they could afford to replace without selling because FFP hadn't impacted them yet. Their success rate in the transfer market didn't need to be good, as their financial means allowed them to sign more players than they could register. FFP actually seemed to bring their spending under control, with their success on the pitch becoming far less consistent as a result. The restriction on loans is an issue for them too.
Last time they won the league, we finished 2nd and our recent recruitment had been very good. Since then, both teams have had poor recruitment and both teams have been on a downward trajectory, but Chelsea is currently a worse team and has plenty of their own issues to resolve. We wasted our limited funds on Ndombele & Lo Celso. Chelsea splurged £200m on Bakayoko, Morata, Drinkwater & Zappacosta, without their owner even noticing the money leave his account. Like us, they are currently trying to dig themselves out of an eight-year rut of being nothing more than a team challenging for top 4 (and sometimes missing out), but they've fallen from a higher peak than us and their current rut is even deeper than ours.
Chelsea has recently spent over half a billion on signings, but this has somehow made their team far worse and they're currently not even in the top half of the league table. Unless their impending new manager miraculously turns their performances around without overhauling the squad, this will be a strong contender for the worst year of recruitment for any team ever. They've squandered so much money (without any clear strategy) that they will be left to carefully navigate FFP for at least half a decade.

Like Liverpool and Chelsea, we've also had both good and bad periods for recruitment. Under Jol & Arnesen, we went from being a mid-table team to challenging for the top 4, while simultaneously assembling the youngest team in the league - that was fantastic recruitment. We then had a bad patch in the transfer market, but that was more about player retention than recruitment, and quite a few of Comolli's signings came good once they'd had time to settle / develop (e.g. Modric & Bale)…followed by the "Bale money" / "magnificent seven". Under Poch, good business (e.g. Alderweireld, Wanyama, Dele, Dier, Son) resulted in our three highest ever PL finishes (3rd/2nd/3rd in the league) and qualifying for the CL in consecutive seasons for the first time.
Several of our key players during our peak under Poch were actually signed during what at the time was perceived as a period of poor recruitment (e.g. Eriksen, Dembele, Vertonghen, Lloris, Lamela). For this reason, I'm not going to be too quick to judge our recruitment under Paratici. Any of Romero, Bentancur, Kulusevski, Richarlison, Emerson, Porro & Udogie could go on to be a big player for us for years to come, so I will be interested to see how they fit in (or not) under our new manager.

We were shit in the 90s, no mistake about that, but in terms of your comparison we weren't similar stature to West Ham or Southampton, that's for damn sure. If we look at the 'Money League' in the years immediately before ENIC, we were still 5-6th richest club in the country, like we are now, and richer than Everton or Villa. We can all agree that Levy has, present situation excepted, moved the club far beyond the hilarious level of mismanagement of the 90s - which is still referred to regularly 20 years on - but let's not pretend he's taken some minnow club into the big time.

 

[Trix]

it’s more the motivations. Are we not bringing Poch back becuase we have identified the next Pep and have a clear long term plan to support him to grow us into something special with a completely revamped football administration. If so that makes sense.

Or is it because we want a new flavour of the month or some of the baord members don’t get on with Poch.

If the reasons for not bringing someone who is loved by most of the fanbase back are very good I can accept that but I have over the past few years become very cynical about how this club operates. As I am not privy to the reasons hard to draw conclusions but this is a huge gamble by Levy so you would hope he knows what he is doing.

I think the motivations are irrelevant. What happens next has to be in the best interests of the club and bringing back a manager the board doesn't want can only be detrimental to us moving forward, as they will not give the support required.

 

[Drink!Drink!]

We were shit in the 90s, no mistake about that, but in terms of your comparison we weren't similar stature to West Ham or Southampton, that's for damn sure. If we look at the 'Money League' in the years immediately before ENIC, we were still 5-6th richest club in the country, like we are now, and richer than Everton or Villa. We can all agree that Levy has, present situation excepted, moved the club far beyond the hilarious level of mismanagement of the 90s - which is still referred to regularly 20 years on - but let's not pretend he's taken some minnow club into the big time.

Yes indeed, and many remarked at the time, look at Spurs, terrible on the pitch but still one of the richest clubs in the country.

Sugar was an ignorant clown and his time at the club an unmitigated disaster. So it's an incredibly low bar to use to judge #COYS Daniel and ENIC. It's like saying, yeah Dier is flawed but remember we once used to have Nethercott at CB so be grateful for Dier (rather than comparing him to Mike England or Ledley King etc you get the picture)

ENIC have lucked out to own one of the biggest and richest football assets during a period that has seen an incredible explosion of money coming into the EPL. There have been undoubted improvements to the finances of the club. No denial that is welcome, But we absolutely should be comparing ENIC's performance relative to the other "Big 5" clubs in English football when they took over., and aside from Everton, that comparison isn't a favourable one.

Of course the big similarity between Sugar and ENIC is that they didn't want to own THFC to pursue football glory, they both saw/see owning a top football club as helping grow their other business ventures. That has been the true tragedy, the root cause of the decline in THFC as a big, trophy winning football club.

 

[NEVILLEB]

Fair point. Worth a shot. ENIC's only really move left to play imo to keep any chance of having the fan base on side. Other clubs have also made terrible decisions in recent years, it's almost as if self sabotage is an addiction amongst them, doesn't mean we should accept it at spurs though just because some other clubs are equally badly run. Kane has kept this from being an Everton type situation imo.

I don't agree. It's been ENIC's decision to keep Levy in charge the last 20 years.

They are as much to blame as him and need to go too.

 

[NEVILLEB]

We were shit in the 90s, no mistake about that, but in terms of your comparison we weren't similar stature to West Ham or Southampton, that's for damn sure. If we look at the 'Money League' in the years immediately before ENIC, we were still 5-6th richest club in the country, like we are now, and richer than Everton or Villa. We can all agree that Levy has, present situation excepted, moved the club far beyond the hilarious level of mismanagement of the 90s - which is still referred to regularly 20 years on - but let's not pretend he's taken some minnow club into the big time.

If Levy was Chief Finance Officer and we had some level or above him as Chairman who understood human beings and football then we'd be successful.

But that's not going to happen.

 

[jimbo]

The only difference of what Levy is doing and what FSG or Kroenke are doing is which club's manager at the moment is doing really good job.

That's not true at all, it's much more than just the Head Coach - it's the strategy and structure, having an Edwards, Eales, Edu, Barber. Having a vision, a direction and a plan.

That's where we fall down. Repeatedly.

 

[Albertbarich]

That's not true at all, it's much more than just the Head Coach - it's the strategy and structure, having an Edwards, Eales, Edu, Barber. Having a vision, a direction and a plan.

That's where we fall down. Repeatedly.

I'm pretty sure we all moaned just as much when Eales and Barber were here. Not sure bringing these people will stop the chairman interfering. It hasnt before.

 

[Cinemattis]

Multiple people reporting this now. Unbelievable

"The Lord giveth, the Lord taketh.

COYS, Danny"

 

[Albertbarich]

Multiple people reporting this now. Unbelievable

Whilst we have this and it's now been resolved I think it's worth mentioning this guy Billy and others have pledged their refund to the Tottenham food bank

 

[longtimespur]

They probably thought, who the fuck is going to want to buy tickets today, we’re probably safe from having to announce anything about loyalty points. That or they didn’t know it would happen.

For people to think it was maliciously done is just bollocks though, sorry. Be as outraged as you want but you have to occasionally step back and have proper look at these things.

Whilst I agree with you Levy has made it sooooooooo easy for fans to blame him.
If he hadn't made so many cock-ups in the past maybe people wouldn't jump to this conclusion.
I for one wouldn't put it past him to do such a thing.

 

[Russ1201]

Another master stroke in terms of planning lol

Wouldn't be suprised if Levy said lets deduct the loyalty points see if anyone notices it. They really do think we are stupid!

 

[longtimespur]

Why would he do that if he isn't thought to be the best person for the job?

You don't appoint someone on a long term contract you don't believe in just because a few supporters are getting a bit weapy. If he doesn't believe in him he's not going to financially get behind him, and if he doesn't back him it's going to end badly sooner rather than later. I'm very much pissed off with Levy at the moment because of how he's been doing things, but if he backed down and bowed to peer pressure over this I'd have even less respect for him than I currently do.

I agree with this apart from your first line.
Personally I don't consider him capable of making the right decision in the manager stakes. He's made a few mistakes recently let alone in the past.
I would prefer he had no say at all in anything regarding the football side of the club.
He's done wonders for us structurally but footballing decisions don't seem to be his thing.

 

[Ribble]

Wouldn't be suprised if Levy said lets deduct the loyalty points see if anyone notices it. They really do think we are stupid!

It'll be a big automated system and this situation won't be built in, that's all. They're probably going to have to edit every refunded member's account to put the points back, which will mean some poor schlub doing it by hand in a spreadsheet over the next week or so.

 

[Trix]

I agree with this apart from your first line.
Personally I don't consider him capable of making the right decision in the manager stakes. He's made a few mistakes recently let alone in the past.
I would prefer he had no say at all in anything regarding the football side of the club.
He's done wonders for us structurally but footballing decisions don't seem to be his thing.

Oh I agree, fact is though he is going to make the decision so it might as well be a manager he actually wants.

 

[Duke of Northumberland]

Of course a big cultural problem, a long, shadow over the culture of our club is its Latin motto

Audere est Facere

Widley translated from Latin as meaning: "be careful what you wish for"

Although some prefer the alternative translation of: "better the devil you know"

would you prefer:
Accipies Sheikh

Take a Sheikh!

 

[jimbo]

I'm pretty sure we all moaned just as much when Eales and Barber were here. Not sure bringing these people will stop the chairman interfering. It hasnt before.

I'm not saying it would, but that's on us - or more accurately, our chairman. The point is, it can be done - as there are a number of examples. The barrier to us being able to do it appears to be Daniel.

It just seems odd to me to use the ingratitude and entitlement of Liverpool fans as an excuse to suggest FSG aren't better owners. I reckon as close to 100% of Spurs fans as you're ever going to get would take the season Liverpool are having if it meant we'd won a title, a Champions League and domestic cups in seasons prior. Don't you? Some might say that's all down to Klopp, but who appointed him, who backed him? Would Levy have done that?
Similarly at Newcastle, they have not spent or recruited at a level beyond our means (yet) but they look set to achieve the goal of Champions League qualification after 1 year - the same feat that took ENIC 10 years.

My main issue with Daniel is not about how much we have or haven't spent, it's the absence of any clear vision, any coherent strategy. That's been hurting us in terms of recruitment for years now - both with players and managers. It's staggering that he doesn't seem to have learned anything in 20+ years - we can point to the same repeated mistakes as evidence for this.

Two years ago we sacked Mourinho, appointed an interim, and took our time to get the next appointment right - with all that guff about DNA. We took all summer, flitted around aimlessly and ended up with a baffling appointment. Then we binned that off when the error was impossible to ignore anymore and panic appointed Conte. Now we've sacked Conte, appointed an interim, and are taking our time to get the next appointment right...

It's shambolic, and totally avoidable - if you have an actual plan rather than playing the football manager equivalent of pin the tail on the Nuno.

We haven't finished the season with the same manager who started it for 4 years - our chairman and board keep getting it wrong because they clearly have no idea what right looks like. That is abject.

It may be that the appointment of Munn will help, but because of the latency in strategic roles like his we're not going to see signs of it for a while - Daniel's best hope to quell the unrest right now is that he gets lucky with the next manager. Luck is not a strategy, but it's all we've got - I'm sorry, that's not good enough, at any level or in any industry.