The Mauricio Pochettino thread

sausage

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he literally splashed 60 million on ndombele, 25 mill on sess, and whatever on lo celso, in not his biggest fan by any stretch but that argument is boring.
Plus however much on Davinson (£40m+?) and some £50m combined on Lucas and Serge, and that was all well before the stadium was finished.
 

Cambridge Spur

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I’ve had a chance to calm down and reflect since the Brighton game, however I’ve never been more sure that it’s over, Poch needs to go now. I’ve read lots of comments over the past week, both from our fans and pundits, and the overwhelming opinion is that Poch needs a complete rebuild with younger players coming in that will follow his regiment. It’s also been said that our senior players have stopped playing for him. If this is the case then why persist with him? We will never win things under him, in order to build a successful team you need a blend of youth and experience. Are we really willing to let him clear out and start again only to end up in the exact same position 4 or 5 years down the line. If I’ve learnt anything over the years, it is to live for the moment. Of course you need an eye on the future but I still believe in this squad as it is and think with the right man at the helm we can challenge for big things.
 

Primativ

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I’ve had a chance to calm down and reflect since the Brighton game, however I’ve never been more sure that it’s over, Poch needs to go now. I’ve read lots of comments over the past week, both from our fans and pundits, and the overwhelming opinion is that Poch needs a complete rebuild with younger players coming in that will follow his regiment. It’s also been said that our senior players have stopped playing for him. If this is the case then why persist with him? We will never win things under him, in order to build a successful team you need a blend of youth and experience. Are we really willing to let him clear out and start again only to end up in the exact same position 4 or 5 years down the line. If I’ve learnt anything over the years, it is to live for the moment. Of course you need an eye on the future but I still believe in this squad as it is and think with the right man at the helm we can challenge for big things.
Spot on!
 

kungfugrip

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I'm concerned everyone is pinning their hopes on changing things in the January window. I don't think there will be enough time and staff resources to sort out all the outgoings never mind all the incomings that some people imagine will happen. Even if we are seeking to recruit two or three big players in the Jan window, clubs will know we are utterly desperate to get them and put their price up even more as a result. Levy rarely plays ball with that sort of situation so I just can't see how the January window will be a turning point. We need to turn things round long before that anyway!
 

dudu

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I’ve had a chance to calm down and reflect since the Brighton game, however I’ve never been more sure that it’s over, Poch needs to go now. I’ve read lots of comments over the past week, both from our fans and pundits, and the overwhelming opinion is that Poch needs a complete rebuild with younger players coming in that will follow his regiment. It’s also been said that our senior players have stopped playing for him. If this is the case then why persist with him? We will never win things under him, in order to build a successful team you need a blend of youth and experience. Are we really willing to let him clear out and start again only to end up in the exact same position 4 or 5 years down the line. If I’ve learnt anything over the years, it is to live for the moment. Of course you need an eye on the future but I still believe in this squad as it is and think with the right man at the helm we can challenge for big things.
1) Surely the rebuild has already started
2) Name a scenario where we don't need to do that every 5 years anyway no matter who the coach is.

Poch has managed us through an immensely unique period of our clubs history, I personally think he deserves a shot at doing it during a time where we have more money to spend on players and have less unrest due to stadium move etc.

If he can't shake things up over the next few months and we are really in the shit then fair enough, we probably need to get someone else in.
 

sausage

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I’ve had a chance to calm down and reflect since the Brighton game, however I’ve never been more sure that it’s over, Poch needs to go now. I’ve read lots of comments over the past week, both from our fans and pundits, and the overwhelming opinion is that Poch needs a complete rebuild with younger players coming in that will follow his regiment. It’s also been said that our senior players have stopped playing for him. If this is the case then why persist with him? We will never win things under him, in order to build a successful team you need a blend of youth and experience. Are we really willing to let him clear out and start again only to end up in the exact same position 4 or 5 years down the line. If I’ve learnt anything over the years, it is to live for the moment. Of course you need an eye on the future but I still believe in this squad as it is and think with the right man at the helm we can challenge for big things.
It reminds me of something quite different, but yet it has similarities.

One of my parents used to work with horses a lot, and they happened to work for a guy who had all the talent in the word as a jockey, but he never actually made it at the highest level. He, instead, found his success training up young horses until they got to Badminton-challenging level, then he'd sell them on. He didn't have the ability to compete on the very best of horses. It was very much rinse and repeat, with the cusp of winning being the limit. Eventually one of them killed him in competition, which was sad because he was a lovely bloke.


Anyway, here's our squad ages:

32 - Lloris, Vertonghen
30 - Alderweireld, Sissoko
29 - Rose
28 - Wanyama (permacrocked, we assumed, at a young age)
------
27 - Lamela, Eriksen, Son, Moura, Gazzaniga
26 - Kane, Davies, Aurier
25 - Dier
23 - Dele, Winks, GLC, Sanchez
22 - Ndombele, KWP
21 - Foyth
19 - Skipp, Sessegnon


It seems to me that once you take out Vertonghen and Alderwiereld, who look like they are leaving anyway, our squad isn't that old at all.

So just how old do you have to get to to be as good as redundant in a Pochettino team? 26? Are we at risk of constantly living between "a young team that will learn to win" and "too old and stale to win"?
 

spursfan77

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It reminds me of something quite different, but yet it has similarities.

One of my parents used to work with horses a lot, and they happened to work for a guy who had all the talent in the word as a jockey, but he never actually made it at the highest level. He, instead, found his success training up young horses until they got to Badminton-challenging level, then he'd sell them on. He didn't have the ability to compete on the very best of horses. It was very much rinse and repeat, with the cusp of winning being the limit. Eventually one of them killed him in competition, which was sad because he was a lovely bloke.


Anyway, here's our squad ages:

32 - Lloris, Vertonghen
30 - Alderweireld, Sissoko
29 - Rose
28 - Wanyama (permacrocked, we assumed, at a young age)
------
27 - Lamela, Eriksen, Son, Moura, Gazzaniga
26 - Kane, Davies, Aurier
25 - Dier
23 - Dele, Winks, GLC, Sanchez
22 - Ndombele, KWP
21 - Foyth
19 - Skipp, Sessegnon


It seems to me that once you take out Vertonghen and Alderwiereld, who look like they are leaving anyway, our squad isn't that old at all.

So just how old do you have to get to to be as good as redundant in a Pochettino team? 26? Are we at risk of constantly living between "a young team that will learn to win" and "too old and stale to win"?
Exactly. It’s just an excuse. The majority of them are coming into their prime footballing years looking at that.
 

sausage

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Exactly. It’s just an excuse. The majority of them are coming into their prime footballing years looking at that.
It would seem so. My anecdote (as it seems a least one person so far - not you - hasn't been able to grasp it) is that the mentality is a possible flag with these scenarios. It's much easier to gain respect and control over people who are beholden to you, or that you have been able to mould in a particular way. Once those people (or horses, in the comparison) gain confidence in themselves, that contract of respect starts to get a bit less reliable. The point where the "students" start questioning the teacher is quite a delicate tipping point in the whole process, and so this is likely to be an important stage for Pochettino.

I don't think the answer is to simply chuck away all the players, as that's avoiding the issue.

Riding a horse is only similar in the fact that they always say that they can sense confidence - if you aren't confident and able to feel and convey that you're the one in control, a big established horse will simply throw you into the first fence. Part of why I guess being good at that sport is about more than just sitting down and holding on. Swap out the "riding a horse" for "managing established players" I guess.
 

Gb160

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It would seem so. My anecdote (as it seems a least one person so far - not you - hasn't been able to grasp it) is that the mentality is a possible flag with these scenarios.
Im just staggered that horses can be taught play badminton.
Mental.
 

FeilSpurs

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Mar 18, 2014
Messages
70
This excites me, i love Poch and Levy! And even though i am struggling to see how anyone,
not even Poch can turn this around as it seems like something that never happens anywhere.
I will not stop living in the hope, not before Levy makes the call. Might sound naive to some,
but the BSODL is strong with this one (y)😊:bag:

ENIC might have its flaws, but every other owner i have experienced during the 80 and up
until this point can't even reach up to the knees of what we have to day ☝

All in my opinion of course ✌


January will be fun :)
Screen Shot 2019-10-09 at 8.01.36 AM.png
 

dudu

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Jan 28, 2011
Messages
2,796
This excites me, i love Poch and Levy! And even though i am struggling to see how anyone,
not even Poch can turn this around as it seems like something that never happens anywhere.
I will not stop living in the hope, not before Levy makes the call. Might sound naive to some,
but the BSODL is strong with this one (y)😊:bag:

ENIC might have its flaws, but every other owner i have experienced during the 80 and up
until this point can't even reach up to the knees of what we have to day ☝

All in my opinion of course ✌




View attachment 56593
Said it before, I'll say it again. Hugs needed by everyone.
 

JCRD

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Joined
Aug 10, 2018
Messages
4,944
I’ve had a chance to calm down and reflect since the Brighton game, however I’ve never been more sure that it’s over, Poch needs to go now. I’ve read lots of comments over the past week, both from our fans and pundits, and the overwhelming opinion is that Poch needs a complete rebuild with younger players coming in that will follow his regiment. It’s also been said that our senior players have stopped playing for him. If this is the case then why persist with him? We will never win things under him, in order to build a successful team you need a blend of youth and experience. Are we really willing to let him clear out and start again only to end up in the exact same position 4 or 5 years down the line. If I’ve learnt anything over the years, it is to live for the moment. Of course you need an eye on the future but I still believe in this squad as it is and think with the right man at the helm we can challenge for big things.
I see where you are coming from and the thought has crossed my mind. He does say and has said some really shitty stuff in the past and the smokes and mirrors etc is annoyng HOWEVER I think he is still best placed to change things. That has really annoyed me but im willing to look past that IF he is up for the challenge.

We should never have been in a position to tear it up and rebuild - this should have been about evolutiona nd evolving not about rebuilding but it is what it is. We can sit here and have our opinions on whose fault it is but I imagine he hasnt had the sufficient funds to eviolve the team.

Do you really think he wanted to get rid of Tripps without bringing anyone else in? Or Dembele without having someone signed up already? We had a threadbare squad last year, no manager would want that.
 
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