Poch: In or Out? - You CAN change your vote

Should Poch stay or go?

  • Stay

    Votes: 657 55.3%
  • Go

    Votes: 532 44.7%

  • Total voters
    1,189
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sausage

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Would be a shit show, did you not see what went on at United?
As far as my observations go, he won the league cup, Europe League, and finish 2nd with a team that is, imo, much worse than ours.

If we want to keep players like Kane, we need to be winning stuff. For all the good Poch has done, even when we reach the odd final we never actually look like a team that can win.
 

robin09

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6,382
Mourinho you sure
Mourinho seems to be the Poch Out brigades first choice for several reasons.

Loves nurturing youth players through to the first team.

Happy to work on a zero net spend transfer window.

Electrifying style of attacking football.

A master of uniting the dressing room.

Humble media presence, let’s his football do the talking.
 

Spurs' Pipe Dreams

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Can't believe it's a discussion tbh.

Mostly because who do we replace him with?

Pochettino will be successful wherever he goes, especially considering how high his stock is atm, Real, PSG, United unlimited funds, we sack him and he will go on to prove that we made a mistake.

Can anyone really tell me that he'll fail at his next club? History at other clubs and our club kinda proves he won't.

So who do we get instead? Mourinho? Simeone? A n other elite football manager?
The problem is we will still have the same squad, wage structure and owners, is there a manager who can get better out of our current players? I very much doubt it.

So sacking him makes no sense if you consider what next...

Maybe we will continue to be sub par with Poch but I doubt it, a solution is normally found and we have a talented squad. I think we will qualify from our CL group and finish top 4. That's where we are atm
 

Procter

Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2004
Messages
236
Go sadly, he seems to of lost the dressing room. And sadly hes beome very easy to play against. Levy must share some of this blame
 

robin09

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If it’s all about the lack of cups under Poch, then how the hell would everyone be reacting if we’d actually won the CL last season?

‘We’re the Champions of this tournament, we shouldn’t be losing to Bayern 7-2!’

if trophies is ALL that’s important, you’re going to be very disappointed even if you get what you want.
 

mrlilywhite

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2,100
Is the 4-2-3-1 people are calling for the same turgid one which lead to a series of 0-1 defeats from teams parking the bus and us not breaking them down? That lead to everyone asking for 4-3-3, which is basically what we played last night...

The way I see it, Poch has been the spring for all the good that has happened at this club the last 5 years. Getting rid of him in the hope that Eriksen might get good again and stay or whatever the hope is for the Poch out gaggle seems wildly optimistic.

For me, It comes down to the fact that Poch seems dismayed at not being able to fully refresh the squad as he hoped. Now we’ve got a bunch of half-arsed players and players not yet up to speed playing together in a disjointed team.

It would be utter suicide and the start of full capitulation as a club if we boot Poch now, IMO.
There are many formations in football and each with their own philosophy. Every manager has a style that is either unique to the clubs needs or their own personal take on how the game should be played. Pep's style, Klopp's style and our own Poch style are examples. In any given formation and system there are fundamental principals that need to be addressed to make them as fluid as possible and ensure a high probability of success.

Formations are a trend that come and go and can be developed and used by any manager to implement their system into it, but there is a sweet spot where formation meets the system and it gels. However, if you have no particular system that works towards a high probability of success, no amount of star players will ever reach their potential and things will regress. Poch has a system and a very successful one at that. It can also be used in quite a few formations to good effect, but how you might ask is Poch not able to seemingly find a home for it? It's simple - he isn't using it and you can argue the toss as to why, but ultimately it's his problem as he doesn't have an alternate option that works and that's why we have so much frustration when it comes to who prefers what formation.

See it isn't so much the formation, it's the system that is developed with the players you have available and your ability to maximise their potential in exercising your system. The formation exists purely for the players you have that fit the generic roles within the formation, a framework if you will. It's what you are asking of the individuals and as a team as a whole that truly defines results and right now Poch has veered so far away from his system that nothing really fits anymore. The counter-press doesn't work or isn't implemented because Poch doesn't have the same players he once had - sure most of them are still the same in name, but they have aged and don't have the necessary ability to play the counter-press.

Who's fault is it? Levy? Yes perhaps, rotation of playing staff for Poch's system depends on keeping the side fresh and energetic - something older players don't have or lose, therefore one could argue that Levy should have been more proactive in selling and buying. Is it the players? Yep once again a case can be made for quite a few, but if they don't believe in the current philosophy and are ignoring the manager, then the manager has to change and that brings me onto Poch. Without using the Poch counter-press there are big suggestions that point to Poch as a limited manager - no defined alternate course of action and no plan B and honestly that is where we are, right now with a manager out in the wilderness and somewhat lost
 

Spurs' Pipe Dreams

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16,152
I actually can’t believe 55% of people want him to stay.

I love a bit of deluded, misplaced and baseless optimism but fuck me.

Our last three league finishes have been 2nd, 3rd and 4th.

This season, I imagine 5th or below as things stand.

He had a two year honeymoon period when he joined the club and the steady decline has been happening ever since, with the last 12 months being complete and utter dross.

Any notion that he’s the man to turn this around is a delusion you’ve come up with yourself because there is zero evidence to back it.
A Champions League final is pretty good evidence, is it not?
 

Led's Zeppelin

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I've been a strong defender of Levy's strategy so far, and I believe it's worked in getting us to be CL regulars and in a new stadium.

Now the situation has changed, or at least it's moved on.. We the supporters want to see us improve from there, to actually win the big trophies. Fuck the small ones, they don't mean much really, a CL final means more in global terms than a League Cup win for example, and always will. We know in our hearts that to be a truly big club isn't a matter of winning the FA Cup anymore, lovely though it would be to do it.

So the question is whether Levy's strategy is suited to the next phase of our transformation, into League Champions or at the very least, serious contenders like, sadly, Liverpool have become.. If Levy's strategy is not up to the next stage, it won't matter who's the manager.

IfLevy is up to it, and prepared and able to truly back a Title winning squad, then we can ask whether Pochettino is the right man for the job.

But asking about Pochettino first, or in isolation, is back to front.
 

fishhhandaricecake

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Mourinho seems to be the Poch Out brigades first choice for several reasons.

Loves nurturing youth players through to the first team.

Happy to work on a zero net spend transfer window.

Electrifying style of attacking football.

A master of uniting the dressing room.

Humble media presence, let’s his football do the talking.
Brilliant 🤣🤣👋👋
 

fishhhandaricecake

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Joined
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Messages
1,655
I've been a strong defender of Levy's strategy so far, and I believe it's worked in getting us to be CL regulars and in a new stadium.

Now the situation has changed, or at least it's moved on.. We the supporters want to see us improve from there, to actually win the big trophies. Fuck the small ones, they don't mean much really, a CL final means more in global terms than a League Cup win for example, and always will. We know in our hearts that to be a truly big club isn't a matter of winning the FA Cup anymore, lovely though it would be to do it.

So the question is whether Levy's strategy is suited to the next phase of our transformation, into League Champions or at the very least, serious contenders like, sadly, Liverpool have become.. If Levy's strategy is not up to the next stage, it won't matter who's the manager.

IfLevy is up to it, and prepared and able to truly back a Title winning squad, then we can ask whether Pochettino is the right man for the job.

But asking about Pochettino first, or in isolation, is back to front.
Agree this is also an issue.
 

Swalien

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700
I want to see him turn it around with wins in our next 2 PL games, and home win in CL. If not then we have an ISSUE!

From a commercial POV, and how our sponsorships work, ie NIKE, we can’t afford to be underperforming miserably, and out the T4. We would then need to consider a proven winner manager, who knows the PL. And I know names have been discussed on this thread. From a corporate standpoint, I see only one available, and that is Mourinho. That is not me suggesting we go for him. But if it was a choice between him and let’s say Eddie Howe, I know who I would prefer.

Add to that Mr Daniel Levy is not going to change his modus operandi in the way he deals. And the CE, TA’s situation lays plainly at his feet. And I said 3 years ago in certain quarters, he would not be signing another contract beyond that one.

So if it goes worst with Poch, very quick decisions needs to be made. Hence, why I want him to turn it around. Unfortunately I am not that confident, simply due to his blind stubbornness with the diamond, and blind friggin loyalty to certain players.
sorry just a bit of misinterpretation as i read this do you say the TA and CE situation lays at Poch feet and also that Poch will not be signing a new contract beyond the one you spoke of 3 years ago ?
 

Led's Zeppelin

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Messages
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Mourinho seems to be the Poch Out brigades first choice for several reasons.

Loves nurturing youth players through to the first team.

Happy to work on a zero net spend transfer window.

Electrifying style of attacking football.

A master of uniting the dressing room.

Humble media presence, let’s his football do the talking.

Brilliant.

He also has a great record when it comes to working with his medical team.
 

mrlilywhite

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Joined
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Messages
2,100
It was 4 years before Fergie won any trophy and 7 years before he won the league. He got the time.
Granted but Fergie had already had big success with Aberdeen, notwithstanding his domestic success (3 league titles and 5 cups), he also went on to win the European cup winners cup. Now compare that to Poch coming here with the grand total of zero trophies. Fergie got time because he had earned it far more than Poch currently does.
 

WalkerboyUK

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Jun 8, 2009
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17,874
Can't believe it's a discussion tbh.

Mostly because who do we replace him with?

Pochettino will be successful wherever he goes, especially considering how high his stock is atm, Real, PSG, United unlimited funds, we sack him and he will go on to prove that we made a mistake.

Can anyone really tell me that he'll fail at his next club? History at other clubs and our club kinda proves he won't.

So who do we get instead? Mourinho? Simeone? A n other elite football manager?
The problem is we will still have the same squad, wage structure and owners, is there a manager who can get better out of our current players? I very much doubt it.

So sacking him makes no sense if you consider what next...

Maybe we will continue to be sub par with Poch but I doubt it, a solution is normally found and we have a talented squad. I think we will qualify from our CL group and finish top 4. That's where we are atm
I get what you're saying, but at the same time, things have gone incredibly stale at the club.
Playing staff has barely changed, and when you have a manager around for 4/5 years, unless players also change, it becomes repetitive and people don't develop.
That therefore leaves three options:
a) Stay as we are
b) Hope for the mother of all clear outs and purchases in the next two windows
c) Bring in someone that the existing playing staff will believe can take them on to win trophies
 

oskathegobshite

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Messages
1,646
I voted go. I would LOVE him to turn it around and I have loved his personality and the way he has had us playing for most of his time here but I cannot see how he turns this around.

If there weren't so many issues, including his own bizarre comments and demeanor, then I would say give him more time but we cannot not be in the Champions League and I only see things getting worse currently.

If we lose at Brighton I think he is gone. Having said that we could win the next three well and go into the Liverpool game with a chance to make a statement. This is the outcome I want but I just can't see it at the moment. More likely we get something at Brighton then drop points home to Watford. For what it's worth I still think we will get out of the CL group no problem.

If I could see any sign of him turning it around I would say give him the next four games but as I can't I voted go. Feel awful but the evidence is out there on the pitch unfortunately

Another big worry is there is no obvious replacement out there.
 

Hakkz

Svensk hetsporre
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Jul 6, 2012
Messages
6,098
If it’s all about the lack of cups under Poch, then how the hell would everyone be reacting if we’d actually won the CL last season?

‘We’re the Champions of this tournament, we shouldn’t be losing to Bayern 7-2!’

if trophies is ALL that’s important, you’re going to be very disappointed even if you get what you want.
I prefer good entertaining football, something we haven't had for almost a year on a consistent basis.
 

spursfan77

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Aug 13, 2005
Messages
23,917
I’d take it as well as I’d like us to be bastards and win stuff now, if Jose is the man to do that then fine just not sure that many of our fans will see if that way.
I suspect quite a lot would enjoy seeing him and in turn levy fail. Long way to go before that. I’m not even sure Mourinho would be interested. Are we big enough for him. I’m not sure.
 

BringBack_leGin

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21,367
Fwiw, I want to give him till the end of the month before any decisions are made. We win the next three matches in all competitions then we’ve got a very good platform to push on and have a good season, top that off with a strong showing away to the dippers (irrespective of result) and Pochettino will have earned a stay of execution. However, even one dropped point in the next three (I know this sounds fickle but bear with me) and I think Pochettino is done. He has three eminently winnable matches ahead, he now has to show that he’s able to take advantage of it to stop the rot, because if he can’t, someone else has to.

Oh, and @yankspurs , have a word with yourself, your stance on Levy is ridiculous. Even if we accept that he’s not given the manager enough banking, (I believe he has, but fully understand why you and others don’t), it’s nonsense to say that Pochettino has anything but a varied, deep, high quality squad to work with, and it’s his failing alone if he’s not getting the best out of it. To put another angle on it, Lampard, Emery, Rodgers, Pelligrini, Hodgson and Howe are all currently getting the same or more out of this inferior squads, and first teams, across almost every position.
 
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