Player loyalty

[Kingellesar]

So, we all agree 4-5-1/4-4-1-1/4-2-3-1 whatever is our best formation yeah?

Now, I know Defoe has done fantastic this season and has chipped in with some important goals but how does he fit into this system going forward? It is evident that we do not look comfortable playing 4-4-2 anymore but can Defoe play as a lone striker? No, well he did ok leading the line against Man City away but it is not something I would like to see again.

King has looked shakey in several games this season, which is a shock to us all because I would never have thought we would see the day Ledley King walks off the pitch as one of the worst performers. As much as I love him, I feel he has done his service for us and would be better at maybe coaching or playing cup games alongside youngsters in the future, we can't afford to be giving him important games if he can't perform 100%, yesterday was like a horror show watching him against Holt.

Friedel again, some of his performances this season have been below par, he is a great keeper but I can't help but feel Harry is only playing him because of his amazing record of not missing a PL game since 2004, yeah fantastic but come on, if Cudicini is performing well in the cup and training then should he not get a game or two? Friedels distribution has been abysmal in the past few games.

So does Harry show too much loyalty? Is it killing us? Do the players know that even if they have a bad game they are still going to get a game? I guess this also ties in with squad rotation and our lack of.

For me, in the summer Defoe needs to be sold whilst we can still get good money for him, for the simple reason that if we are to carry on using our lone striker system, Defoe IS NOT a lone striker. Why was he kept if Harry knew this was our best formation, I know he can get us goals but he has hardly had any faith to play him from the start anyway?

Anyway, 6 more wins this season and we will be in the Champions League and F.A Cup Winners (I am allowing for a poor result against Bolton, we seem to hate going to the Reebok ;p).

 

[shaqTHFC]

So, we all agree 4-5-1/4-4-1-1/4-2-3-1 whatever is our best formation yeah?

Now, I know Defoe has done fantastic this season and has chipped in with some important goals but how does he fit into this system going forward? It is evident that we do not look comfortable playing 4-4-2 anymore but can Defoe play as a lone striker? No, well he did ok leading the line against Man City away but it is not something I would like to see again.

King has looked shakey in several games this season, which is a shock to us all because I would never have thought we would see the day Ledley King walks off the pitch as one of the worst performers. As much as I love him, I feel he has done his service for us and would be better at maybe coaching or playing cup games alongside youngsters in the future, we can't afford to be giving him important games if he can't perform 100%, yesterday was like a horror show watching him against Holt.

Friedel again, some of his performances this season have been below par, he is a great keeper but I can't help but feel Harry is only playing him because of his amazing record of not missing a PL game since 2004, yeah fantastic but come on, if Cudicini is performing well in the cup and training then should he not get a game or two? Friedels distribution has been abysmal in the past few games.

So does Harry show too much loyalty? Is it killing us? Do the players know that even if they have a bad game they are still going to get a game? I guess this also ties in with squad rotation and our lack of.

For me, in the summer Defoe needs to be sold whilst we can still get good money for him, for the simple reason that if we are to carry on using our lone striker system, Defoe IS NOT a lone striker. Why was he kept if Harry knew this was our best formation, I know he can get us goals but he has hardly had any faith to play him from the start anyway?

Anyway, 6 more wins this season and we will be in the Champions League and F.A Cup Winners (I am allowing for a poor result against Bolton, we seem to hate going to the Reebok ;p).

Agree with Defoe needing to be sold. Not that I think he's a bad player, but he just doesn't suit us and the way we want to play now. For him to play we have to change our whole system (to an inferior one) to suit him and he isn't worth that. Huntelaar seems to be a more well rounded player now, but I've only watched him a few times and I'm not sure if he can play lone striker but he'd surely be better at it than Defoe (does anyone know how Holland set up at Wembley second half?)

 

[jonathanhotspur]

A work colleague said to me that watching Ledders grappling with Holt left him wondering if he was watching Strictly Come Dancing.

A lot of people are being brutally honest in their assessments round here. So I have a confession I'd like to make. I can't stand Defoe as a player. I despair when we're labouring somewhat and our fans start calling for his introduction-even before we've reached half time. When he scores, I still curse him under my breath. I hate his mouthing off to the media about how he needs first team football to get in the England squad. I am bewildered by his awful off the ball movement. I am annoyed that we have to turn our team and tactics upside down when he plays. I cannot wait- genuinely cannot wait- to see the back of him.

 

[Kingstheman]

I presume that Ledley King struggled with Grant Holt because he can't push hard due to his knee.

Not being able to push from his lower half means he has a lot less overall strength (I recall Ledley King mixing it with some of the biggest strikers out there before we knew of his knee injury).

I also think that he has been overplayed this season given his knee. He is a 10 -15 games over a 4 competition season player, not a '20 league games to earn a contract' player now.

Next season, he will be a 10 games a season max player (let's face it, as age creeps up on him, his powers of recovery will compound the knee injury and lack of training).

Teams will target him, if they haven't been already. They won't not score or play more politely due to his well publicised injury.

Re-think needed.

 

[pablo73]

A work colleague said to me that watching Ledders grappling with Holt left him wondering if he was watching Strictly Come Dancing.

A lot of people are being brutally honest in their assessments round here. So I have a confession I'd like to make. I can't stand Defoe as a player. I despair when we're labouring somewhat and our fans start calling for his introduction-even before we've reached half time. When he scores, I still curse him under my breath. I hate his mouthing off to the media about how he needs first team football to get in the England squad. I am bewildered by his awful off the ball movement. I am annoyed that we have to turn our team and tactics upside down when he plays. I cannot wait- genuinely cannot wait- to see the back of him.

I am with you all the way on this

 

[mpickard2087]

I find myself agreeing with pretty much everything said so far in this thread.

- Defoe can go, doesnt really fit into the formation going forward (4-3-3/4-2-3-1), its like playing with ten men at times when he plays and time is running out to cash in on him. Like JH his song greatly irritates me.W

Whilst on the strikers Saha has scored a few goals since he has been here but considering he played in a 4-5-1 at Everton for so long he now looks alien to the formation since joining us. Think his short spell with us should end in the summer.

- Friedel I dont have any massive criticisms of, but I have said all season that Cudicini is our best keeper IMO so I'm all for getting him in the team.

- King, well any more games like Monday and he is off. Injuries do look like they have finally beaten him which to his credit could of been the case about 4 years ago but he has managed to battle on until now. I think he needs to be brutally honest with himself (as G.Neville was last season) and if he isnt up to it anymore retire.

-Modric is another one that concerns me right now. The last few games he looks disinterested. Im becoming tempted to cash in on him in the summer because to me he doesnt look like he wants to be here.

 

[Kingellesar]

I am probably going to get a reputation round here of disliking Modric but I agree. Both me and my dad turned round to each other and said if we could get sensible money for him in the summer, we should think of cashing in. £35m would get us a striker and replacement for him, ok he is hard to replace and I doubt we will ever see someone on the ball like him any time soon but we could get a MC in who could perform well for us. People say Modric is a special talent and we would look lost without him but I don't buy that, there are special players out there who could come in and do a job for us I feel, perhaps we might have to do another Modric and spend big on a talent who clubs are scared to take the risk on but I am confident we could play just as well as we have with Modric if he was not in the team.

Having said that, if he really wanted to stay this summer it would show that perhaps he has matured and has realised we are going in the right direction but he needs to up his performances. I am sure it would be a huge boost going into next season if Modric signed a new conract with us and we managed to buy Adebayor, a full pre season with Modric tied up, Parker, Adebayor and get the likes of Dawson, Huddlestone and Jenas back in the squad would be a huge advantage for us.

I have my doubts though, CL qualification is vital, without it and the club could start going backwards, Modric would want out, we would struggle to get Adebayor in due to lack of CL money and our transfer targets would potentially be ruined. Plus the whole Harry situation, it is going to be very hard to attract a manager without CL football, I feel it is too soon for Lambert/Rodgers to manage us.

 

[Dare!]

A work colleague said to me that watching Ledders grappling with Holt left him wondering if he was watching Strictly Come Dancing.

A lot of people are being brutally honest in their assessments round here. So I have a confession I'd like to make. I can't stand Defoe as a player. I despair when we're labouring somewhat and our fans start calling for his introduction-even before we've reached half time. When he scores, I still curse him under my breath. I hate his mouthing off to the media about how he needs first team football to get in the England squad. I am bewildered by his awful off the ball movement. I am annoyed that we have to turn our team and tactics upside down when he plays. I cannot wait- genuinely cannot wait- to see the back of him.

What the fuck?

 

[jonathanhotspur]

Yes, Dare. When he scores, it's like I can hear what's going on in his head-"Look at me; I've scored, I'm a natural born goalscorer, I've just justified my inclusion, I should start every game, please notice me, Mr England manager. I will be gutted if I'm not on that plane."

Even when he scores, I don't think it justifies his inclusion. I think what he takes away from us as a team outweighs any benefits, generally speaking.

As for Saha, I can't make head nor tail of him. He had me purring after the Toon game but ever since I've been unable to figure out what sort of striker he's supposed to be. I thought he was up to playing as a lone front man but he was atrocious against Stoke and I haven't seen a whole pile from him since.