Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[Albertbarich]

oh yeah i agree he is responsible. Just don't think it's all on him.
For example Ndom is a wrong player to buy, regardless of price, so this is a player-identification problem and it's not on him.

I really hope Munns root and branch review of the club ends up with everyone connected to recruitment being moved on or having at least their job role altered..

So many bad signings..

 

[jpascavitz]

Interesting article from The Athletic on which players might thrive under Ange.

Which Tottenham players will suit Ange Postecoglou’s style? - The Ath…

archived 10 Jun 2023 04:32:54 UTC

archive.is

Good article, thanks for sharing. Would love if they revisit this article after the window to see how we fit again.

 

[TOMSPURS]

Delighted with the appointment of Big Ange, think his character & style of management will be perfect for Spurs. Looking forward to seeing us play for the 1st time in a long time.

One criticism Celtic people had against Big Ange was his lack of use of academy players. He played young players brought into the club or seen as 1st team ready, but he very rarely risked a young academy player. People felt 18/19yr olds like Vata & Summers could have been blooded more, league Cup games, Ange always stuck to his 1st team squad.

Unless a young player is exceptional & stands above senior players in training, I don't expect Big Ange to be giving out any free minutes to young players, no matter what the match. Personally think loaning out young players is the way to go, helped development of Kane, Mason, Rose, Walker, Caulker, Skipp, Livermore etc.......taste men's football elsewhere before starting here.

 

[ultimateloner]

I really hope Munns root and branch review of the club ends up with everyone connected to recruitment being moved on or having at least their job role altered..

So many bad signings..

I hope so too. Over-paying isn't the worst....getting the wrong guy in for a pivotal role is.

 

[mil1lion]

Yes you have a point. My straight thought was Richy-deal because to me this epitomises our recent transfer failures; and Richy's not even a complete flop like Ndom.
In contrast the bigger clubs haven't seem to have made major errors like that, or maybe they are better at absorbing/handling flops?
Bissouma didn't come across my mind....maybe cuz he hasn't really settled with us. But yes, deal-wise Bissouma's a better comparison.

Sancho at Utd springs to mind. There's always examples of players not living up to their cost. To be fair to Richarlison he's had a tough season with injuries. I'd rather judge him on his 2nd season. Even Bissouma hasn't lived up to the hype yet either. It's sort of make or break for some of these players. Some have been here long enough though and shown to not be good enough.

 

[spursgirls]

I also think the embarrassing criticism he’s had from so-called fellow pros will only spur him on.

He does not hide, regardless of his form.

And gives his all when on the pitch. He doesn't stop moving, which Ange will love. He's also been unlucky with several disallowed goals.

 

[dontcallme]

Sancho at Utd springs to mind. There's always examples of players not living up to their cost. To be fair to Richarlison he's had a tough season with injuries. I'd rather judge him on his 2nd season. Even Bissouma hasn't lived up to the hype yet either. It's sort of make or break for some of these players. Some have been here long enough though and shown to not be good enough.

Agree.

I think we have made some potentially good in recent seasons with Kulesevski, Bissouma, Bentancur, Richarlison and Porro. We also have players like Sarr, Gil and Skipp all wanting to make a bigger impact.

We're talking a lot about signings, but if Ange can get the best out of a few of these players, his job becomes much easier. Even good players that appear ready made can take time to settle in.

 

[KingNick]

I really hope Munns root and branch review of the club ends up with everyone connected to recruitment being moved on or having at least their job role altered..

So many bad signings..

That process was already under way with Don Fabio and the results of people he brought in haven’t really been seen yet. Definitely some additions and better structure needed though.

Most of all though, people need clear instructions as to what they need to be looking for. Can’t afford to waste time scouting and analysing players who will never fit our new system. (If anyone spent a second looking at Maguire in detail then there is an immediate fundamental change to be made)

 

[yido_number1]

So funny watching everyone clambering over the academy sound byte. The same people are calling winks and Skipp shit and panning off tanganga.

I love having the academy players come through but we need an environment where they're given time and mistakes aren't hammered.

 

[thekneaf]

I’m all for trusting the academy and having a style that runs through, but what trix is referring too, is our academy isn’t anywhere near where it should be due to years of mid-management, whilst we’ll see a kid bang in a hat trick or score a wonder goal in an u18 match, it’s still a million miles away from being first team ready.
Once a kid signs a scholarship deal (u18), there is still less than a 1% chance that that group will play in the premier league.

I watch academy football week in week out for 8 years, and what it takes to go from a scholar to first team is an incredible amount of hard work, dedication and luck!

focus on the academy to start playing the football we want to see, most definitely, but I wouldn’t expect many breakouts in the very near future as that’s also gotta go through the same process as the first team - which is what I hope he means by it all.

Our u18s and the years below are amongst the most stacked we've ever had. Yes we got relegated from the u23 league but below that team there are gems that with a season or 2 could be first team if we seriously back them like United, Arsenal and Liverpool (and even City with Lewis) do.

Levy's and Postecoglou's statements, to me, are just reiterating a bank to core Spurs values. We play attractive football, be bring players through, and hopefully, from Postecoglou at least, you play to win things.

 

[Gilzeanking]

And gives his all when on the pitch. He doesn't stop moving, which Ange will love. He's also been unlucky with several disallowed goals.

Yes and lack of forward line movement has been our curse since mid Poch. Can't see Kane/Son changing their ways myself. Kulu at least is young enough to improve.

 

[robotsonic]

Yes and lack of forward line movement has been our curse since mid Poch. Can't see Kane/Son changing their ways myself. Kulu at least is young enough to improve.

In fairness, they were playing how they were asked to play. To take up specific positions so that they're there for a specific pass, so that they can play the particular next pass.

Sonny in particular has plenty of movement in him, as was shown by the number of times a game he made runs back into his own half to receive the ball with his back to goal, by Conte design.

Imo they haven't been lacking movement or hiding from the ball, they're just putting the trust in the manager and playing how they're told to play, which is not to try and do anything they've not been asked to do.

 

[only1waddle]

Agree.

I think we have made some potentially good in recent seasons with Kulesevski, Bissouma, Bentancur, Richarlison and Porro. We also have players like Sarr, Gil and Skipp all wanting to make a bigger impact.

We're talking a lot about signings, but if Ange can get the best out of a few of these players, his job becomes much easier. Even good players that appear ready made can take time to settle in.

I think you can add Emerson in that list also, he's got the mentality and is useful defensively, couple that with a positive manager and I reckon he steps up.

 

[arunspurs]

Easy saying "trust the academy" but the older age group is not great because the academy has been neglected for quite a while, and under who's watch may add.

When you constantly change the direction of the club by employing managers with completely different philosophies you end up with a fucked up squad full of mismatched players, again under who's watch.

This is just lip service imo because he knows the hardcore want to see more home grown players but the fact is that's not going to solve our problems in the short term. Only spending money will!

He's just trying to push the blame away from himself once more.

Since everyone is so caught upon 'Trust the academy' phrase here....

Levy did not say it , Fabrizio manufactured it himself...

What Levy said :

“We made a conscious decision that we wanted a coach who would understand what we really wanted as a Club, which was to play attacking football, to enable everyone to enjoy coming to a match and be entertained, and also someone who understood the importance of the Academy.”
On the subject of player recruitment, Daniel said: “The notion that Tottenham haven’t backed certain managers is incorrect. We’re currently paying the price, perhaps, where some of the acquisitions have not turned out to be as we hoped.”

What Fabrizio quoted :

“The notion that Tottenham haven’t backed certain managers is incorrect” “We’re currently paying the price where some of the acquisitions have not turned out to be as we hoped”. “We wanted Ange Postecoglou to play attacking football & trust the Academy”.

Both IMO have huge difference.
Levy isnt saying, Ange has to trust academy & make selections from it. He is simply saying, have academy in your thoughts on everything you do..whether its showing up for academy games regularly & interacting with players and staff. Be more engaged, like Poch used to do.

And for the record, I am not pro-Levy

 

[kitchen]

Interesting article from The Athletic on which players might thrive under Ange.

Which Tottenham players will suit Ange Postecoglou’s style? - The Ath…

archived 10 Jun 2023 04:32:54 UTC

archive.is

Romero is not as fast as stated in that article, and his recovery game is not his main strength. He is an excellent pressing/agressive centre back that wins the ball on the front foot. But usually when an opponent is in behind him they're gone...

With a high press system like Ange employs we will clearly need some more top tier centre halves with either excellent positional sense and/or recovery. Currently nobody else is a good as romero and we need them to be. Either that or we adapt to include a player that can cover the ball in behind like walker does for city. Emerson could be an option?

With our current batch of centre halves we'll be very vulnerable to pace and counter attacks.

 

[Frozen_Waffles]

I really hope Munns root and branch review of the club ends up with everyone connected to recruitment being moved on or having at least their job role altered..

So many bad signings..

It still wrangles me that we kept going out and signing physically and mentally weak players for huge money.

Richarlison, Bissouma and Bentancur were all the right signings. In their prime, excellent in PL or in various top leagues, a history of adapting to a new culture and club and a strong mentality.

I am also not against signing younger and older players, but not at obscene prices. Just manage the risk. Paratici on the whole was excellent at this. Pre Paratici it was an absolute car crash.

Trust the academy is such an interesting statement. You can take it many ways and there is an argument that we have left the academy to rot for years.

However I think Levy gets annoyed that Walker Peters is doing well at Southampton or Madueke or Edwards etc.. They all could have had a pathway but Poch didn't play them. Infact Poch after the first batch didn't support the youth that much at all. From memory I actually think Jose was the one who gave youth more of a chance and mainly because he had no choice.

We have been so messed up for years, but signing players like Raya, Laporte and Maddison is again on the right lines. If we continue like this and give youth a chance as well, we will be ok.

 

[Trix]

Since everyone is so caught upon 'Trust the academy' phrase here....

Levy did not say it , Fabrizio manufactured it himself...

What Levy said :

“We made a conscious decision that we wanted a coach who would understand what we really wanted as a Club, which was to play attacking football, to enable everyone to enjoy coming to a match and be entertained, and also someone who understood the importance of the Academy.”
On the subject of player recruitment, Daniel said: “The notion that Tottenham haven’t backed certain managers is incorrect. We’re currently paying the price, perhaps, where some of the acquisitions have not turned out to be as we hoped.”

What Fabrizio quoted :

“The notion that Tottenham haven’t backed certain managers is incorrect” “We’re currently paying the price where some of the acquisitions have not turned out to be as we hoped”. “We wanted Ange Postecoglou to play attacking football & trust the Academy”.

Both IMO are huge difference.
Levy isnt saying, Ange has to trust academy & make selections from it. He is simply saying, have academy in your thoughts on everything you do..whether its showing up for academy games regularly & interacting with players and staff. Be more engaged, like Poch used to do.

And for the record, I am not pro-Levy

Don't get you point mate.

The academy at the top end is pretty poor. I don't care if he said "trust" or if he said "understand the importance of". If he practiced what he preached the academy wouldn't have got into the mess it has. For about 5 years it was completely neglected. All the best young players choosing all the other London clubs over us despite us having the best facilities. Chelsea, West Ham, Arsenal, Palace have been streets ahead. It's ok saying we need to use the Academy but we are a few years away from being able to actually do that properly. If he wants to focus on that then that's fine, but it won't happen over night, and we need to run it far better than we have.

My big concern now is that it was FP that was turning it around and it was a real pet project of his. He spent a lot of time working on it and it was starting to pay dividends in the 14-17 bracket. I do hope we build on what he was doing and don't bring someone in who wants to rip the playbook up and start all over again on their own image.

 

[KingNick]

Poch also stifled the development of many by refusing to allow them out on loan because he claimed it was better for them to be immersed in his ways. From experience, that’s often just a way of making sure you have enough bodies in the building to act as cannon fodder for first team training (shadowing the system of forthcoming opponents for example),

 

[kent brockman]

Trust the academy is such an interesting statement. You can take it many ways and there is an argument that we have left the academy to rot for years.

However I think Levy gets annoyed that Walker Peters is doing well at Southampton or Madueke or Edwards etc.. They all could have had a pathway but Poch didn't play them. Infact Poch after the first batch didn't support the youth that much at all. From memory I actually think Jose was the one who gave youth more of a chance and mainly because he had no choice.

We have been so messed up for years, but signing players like Raya, Laporte and Maddison is again on the right lines. If we continue like this and give youth a chance as well, we will be ok.

Agreed. Also did not help that Poch refused to send our youngsters on loan.

Regular first team footie is key for their development, which they very rarely can get at a club like Spurs.

Edit: KingNick beat me to it.

 

[mil1lion]

You have to think with no European football we need to be loaning players out though.
In defence of Poch he didn't have a huge senior squad for a European season. Although maybe that's what he wanted, a small squad of senior players and a handful of academy ones. I think when Poch arrived it was a bit of luck for us really where things really aligned. We had a squad with lots of potential for his system and his methods. We have plenty of players in the squad now so you have to hope we get that again with enough players to fit Ange. There were plenty of question marks over our squad under Poch but the likes of Dier, Walker and Rose were moulded while Dembele and Vertonghen elevated their games. Alderweireld and Wanyama were key signings who followed and Kane broke through at a level totally unexpected. I do feel we have enough of those young players to be moulded by Ange so just need a few key signings this summer. It will take time but next season we need to be patient and keep the atmosphere positive so Levy doesn't get an itchy finger when things aren't going well.