Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[fishhhandaricecake]

Let’s see how we line up pre season formation wise etc.

We’ve heard before that Conte wanted to move us to a 3-5-2 for example but he pretty much stuck with 3-4-3.

Ange’s favoured formation is by far 4-3-3, if we don’t line up that way to begin likely then it’ll be a 4-2-3-1, I hope he rebuilds the squad towards his exciting 4-3-3.

 

[EireYid]

If he isn't playing his preferred formation from the start it means we haven't backed him to be able to do so, in which case, I can see us continuing to go around in circles. Hopefully I'm wrong as I actually have a good feeling about him.

 

[Timberwolf]

If he isn't playing his preferred formation from the start it means we haven't backed him to be able to do so, in which case, I can see us continuing to go around in circles. Hopefully I'm wrong as I actually have a good feeling about him.

He's played quite a few formations over the course of his career, including a back 3 at times with Australia and Yokohama Marinos, so I don't think he's absolutely wedded to a single formation. I think he has very strong principles but is also willing to adapt his formation to the players at his disposal.

I think given our squad making the 4-3-3 work off the bat would be bloody hard as he can't sign like 14 players like he did at Celtic cos we've already got a 30 man squad with a ton of players we need to shift. Think it's natural that he'd try to come up with a formation that suits the strengths of the key players we've got.

Kane alone makes it hard to replicate his Celtic 4-3-3 as he simply can't sprint and press all game as a no.9, so makes sense to come up with a solution to get the best out of your single world class player, I think.

 

[Dillspur]

If he isn't playing his preferred formation from the start it means we haven't backed him to be able to do so, in which case, I can see us continuing to go around in circles. Hopefully I'm wrong as I actually have a good feeling about him.

We are stacked with wings backs and have to be realistic with what we can accomplish in 1 window

 

[thebenjamin]

Having watched The Extra Inch’s analysis and research into Ange’s style of play, I’ve come away from it a little less hopeful.

We already know that he tends to set his teams up in a 4-3-3, with a single pivot and two #8’s further forward in midfield. Out of possession, this tends to drop to a 4-4-2 with the two front men leading the press. At Celtic, he had pacey front men that were able and willing to put in some serious pressing at a high pace. I am concerned that this approach won’t suit our forwards, particularly Kane and Son to a degree. I can’t see Kane pressing at every chance he gets to put pressure on the oppositions defence. I’ll be intrigued to see how Ange adapts the style to suit Kane because intensive high pressing was a huge aspect of the style at Celtic.

Additionally, the analysis picked up that if there’s a lack of effort in the press, opposition teams that play with a two man pivot or even a single highly adept deep laying midfielder, tends to easily beat the press and move up the pitch quickly. Whilst we have committed so many attacking players, therefore leaving us exposed at the back.

A fair few journos and podcasters have predicted that we will perform like Leeds did when they first went up, scoring plenty whilst conceding lots too.

For his system to work, we will need eager players and I’m looking forward to see in the coming weeks if we back him with players that are suited to his style. I’m looking forward to the pre season friendlies to begin to see what his plans are for the squad and how this looks on the pitch.

There's also the possibility that he could adapt his system to reflect his squad and the stronger opposition.

 

[spurs9]

Well, not exactly true. Nathan whose career is in football analytics and whether you agree or disagree with their views, I would consider his analytical breakdown of a football managers style in higher regard than someone who has maybe never watched any of Ange’s teams.

If you watch his video, they’ve broken down multiple clips from different games both in Celtic and during his time at Japan, highlighting a pattern in formation as well as strengths and possible weaknesses that could be exploited by other PL teams.

Yeah, and I'm an Instagram model.

 

[spurs9]

Having watched The Extra Inch’s analysis and research into Ange’s style of play, I’ve come away from it a little less hopeful.

We already know that he tends to set his teams up in a 4-3-3, with a single pivot and two #8’s further forward in midfield. Out of possession, this tends to drop to a 4-4-2 with the two front men leading the press. At Celtic, he had pacey front men that were able and willing to put in some serious pressing at a high pace. I am concerned that this approach won’t suit our forwards, particularly Kane and Son to a degree. I can’t see Kane pressing at every chance he gets to put pressure on the oppositions defence. I’ll be intrigued to see how Ange adapts the style to suit Kane because intensive high pressing was a huge aspect of the style at Celtic.

Additionally, the analysis picked up that if there’s a lack of effort in the press, opposition teams that play with a two man pivot or even a single highly adept deep laying midfielder, tends to easily beat the press and move up the pitch quickly. Whilst we have committed so many attacking players, therefore leaving us exposed at the back.

A fair few journos and podcasters have predicted that we will perform like Leeds did when they first went up, scoring plenty whilst conceding lots too.

For his system to work, we will need eager players and I’m looking forward to see in the coming weeks if we back him with players that are suited to his style. I’m looking forward to the pre season friendlies to begin to see what his plans are for the squad and how this looks on the pitch.

TBH, I've stopped listening to the analysis from the YouTuber's and Podcaster's. Most of the time the analysis is based off 2-3 games, which tells you nothing. Remember, their job isn't to provide analysis, its to provide content and the more I watch, the more I recognise they are frauds just trying to get views and engagements.

 

[mil1lion]

4231 is probably the formation we look most comfortable in. However with our wingbacks I wonder if he would consider going to a back 3. Rather than play inverted fullbacks he may look to play the centre back each side coming forward and joining up with midfield. If he goes 352 with the wing backs providing the width he could possibly keep his central 3 in midfield. It's reassuring that he's looking to start to our strengths though. Nuno really struggled with his 433 and never had the time for it to develop. Not that he would have of course but every manager needs time. If they get off to a bad start though they may not get that long. Hopefully if the players get comfortable as the season goes on we an start to shift to 433.

 

[g_harry]

If he isn't playing his preferred formation from the start it means we haven't backed him to be able to do so, in which case, I can see us continuing to go around in circles. Hopefully I'm wrong as I actually have a good feeling about him.

Absolutely spot on we hire a forward playing manager and his first job is to change his style that made him so successful elsewhere because the club won't fully back him.

We know how this goes. Honestly what is the point.

 

[g_harry]

From what I've heard today we won't be setting up 4-3-3, not initially at least, as Ange doesn't think our squad is built for it.

Groundhog Day for every manager that comes into this club under ENIC.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

If he isn't playing his preferred formation from the start it means we haven't backed him to be able to do so, in which case, I can see us continuing to go around in circles. Hopefully I'm wrong as I actually have a good feeling about him.

I would not get worked up about positions and formations just yet.

Philosophy is more important - as you can get players in the rights spaces on the pitch from various formations.


I think we are going to struggle a bit this year, as we make the transition, but it won't be because Ange does not have the players to play in a 433.

 

[Impspur1]

Groundhog Day for every manager that comes into this club under ENIC.

Fixing the issues we have after 5 /6/7 managers in just a few seasons is never going to be an overnight job. It’s actually reassuring to know he is willing to work with what he has and slowly build towards what he ideally wants.

 

[spurs9]

From what I've heard today we won't be setting up 4-3-3, not initially at least, as Ange doesn't think our squad is built for it.

Interesting. TBH, I don't think there is a single formation our squad is built for (as in could successfully play without any signings) and we are just as close to 4-3-3 as we are any system IMO.

 

[Albertbarich]

Having watched The Extra Inch’s analysis and research into Ange’s style of play, I’ve come away from it a little less hopeful.

We already know that he tends to set his teams up in a 4-3-3, with a single pivot and two #8’s further forward in midfield. Out of possession, this tends to drop to a 4-4-2 with the two front men leading the press. At Celtic, he had pacey front men that were able and willing to put in some serious pressing at a high pace. I am concerned that this approach won’t suit our forwards, particularly Kane and Son to a degree. I can’t see Kane pressing at every chance he gets to put pressure on the oppositions defence. I’ll be intrigued to see how Ange adapts the style to suit Kane because intensive high pressing was a huge aspect of the style at Celtic.

Additionally, the analysis picked up that if there’s a lack of effort in the press, opposition teams that play with a two man pivot or even a single highly adept deep laying midfielder, tends to easily beat the press and move up the pitch quickly. Whilst we have committed so many attacking players, therefore leaving us exposed at the back.

A fair few journos and podcasters have predicted that we will perform like Leeds did when they first went up, scoring plenty whilst conceding lots too.

For his system to work, we will need eager players and I’m looking forward to see in the coming weeks if we back him with players that are suited to his style. I’m looking forward to the pre season friendlies to begin to see what his plans are for the squad and how this looks on the pitch.

It's important to remember that Ange's Principal is attacking football. He isn't wedded to this specific version of a 433.

They also noticed that Kane's pressing decreased as he kept playing so many games but they rightly point out that if he is properly rested then he should be able to press like he did under Pochettino. One last note on Kane here is that he is extremely intelligent in positioning himself off the ball so for example of it reverts to a 443 and Son is in the two with Kane then the former does press like mad and Kane just has to back him up.

Lots and lots of issues but we don't even know if he wants to have a carbon copy of that system. Look at the way Man City have tweaked to get the best out of/make up for Harland. They're were always a 433 team but now they have created that box which enables more players higher up the pitch. The best coaches adapt and I think Ange along with Mason who is really good tactically will find solutions whilst keeping our attacking intent.

My personal opinion is that Kane will be used as a false 9 with the 4 behind him making lots of runs beyond. This would let those 4 do lots of the pressing aswell.

 

[rossdapep]

Look at the size of football clubs backroom staff or have a look at their job advertisements. They are all recruiting heavily into data and match analysts.

The difference between staying in a league, competing for trophies or just playing catch up with improved standards could just be that extra work behind the scenes and analysis of footage.

That very true but a lot of the data analysts have studied for it, coached, played or spent time around a club.

You need to join the data with what goes on in the club/coaching etc day in day out.

Someone who just pops on fbref or sofascore and then takes a few select clips and gives analysis is not going to be accurate when assessing a coach's methods.

Jose said it best a few years back.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and they may see some specific things correctly. Dont get why this Nathan guy has been held up as some sort of oracle though. Giving your analysis online is significantly different to doing it inside a club.

 

[rossdapep]

TBH, I've stopped listening to the analysis from the YouTuber's and Podcaster's. Most of the time the analysis is based off 2-3 games, which tells you nothing. Remember, their job isn't to provide analysis, its to provide content and the more I watch, the more I recognise they are frauds just trying to get views and engagements.

If everyone could see that itd be great.

 

[robotsonic]

My personal opinion is that Kane will be used as a false 9 with the 4 behind him making lots of runs beyond. This would let those 4 do lots of the pressing aswell.

I feel that when all are fit this is probably the best setup for the squad as is, with Porro the right winger and Kulusevski inside as a no.10. Will be interesting as to who we bring in that could enable a change in shape beyond this rather than just upgrading GK, CB and adding someone more creative in midfield, which are the three glaring areas always talked about.

Raya
Emerson Romero LCB Udogie
Bissouma Bentancur
Porro Kulusevski Son
Kane

is a tasty lineup with just two signings that we're going to be targeting anyway. Still believe that this squad is not as shit as the rap that it gets based on the wank football we've been playing.

 

[Trix]

Interesting. TBH, I don't think there is a single formation our squad is built for (as in could successfully play without any signings) and we are just as close to 4-3-3 as we are any system IMO.

Just for example on a 4-2-3-1

Royal Romero new CB Udogie

Bissouma..Bentancur

Porro....Kulu.....Son

Kane

Only requires a LCB and keeper. I know it's a subtle difference to a 4-3-3 but we are better covered in midfield with 6's that can drive forward from deep than we are with marauding 8's. Would also mean Kulu could take up some of the pressing slack that Kane won't be able to do. This is only my take on it and it's possible we shift some out and bring in enough but I doubt it personally.

 

[spurs9]

Just for example on a 4-2-3-1

Royal Romero new CB Udogie

Bissouma..Bentancur

Porro....Kulu.....Son

Kane

Only requires a LCB and keeper. I know it's a subtle difference to a 4-3-3 but we are better covered in midfield with 6's that can drive forward from deep than we are with marauding 8's. Would also mean Kulu could take up some of the pressing slack that Kane won't be able to do. This is only my take on it and it's possible we shift some out and bring in enough but I doubt it personally.

Are we any more suited to that then 4-3-3 though? Bissouma's best games were as a deeper 6 in a 3 at Brighton, Bentancur's best season was as a marauding 8 in Sarri's system, PEH plays better as a marauding 8 for Denmark. We also have Lo Celso (when not injured) and Ndombele (doubt he will ever work hard enough though) that are 8's, where as we only have Kulu and maybe Devine (not a creative 10) that can play 10.

Royal Romero new CB Udogie
..................Bissouma
...Bentancur....PEH (or Kulu or Sarr or Devine)
Kulu (or Porro).......................Son
........................Kane

 

[seanyboy]

A fair few journos and podcasters have predicted that we will perform like Leeds did when they first went up, scoring plenty whilst conceding lots too.

Ange himself said in an interview that he'd rather win 4-3 than 1-0, so I'm not sure he disagrees. The difference is do you concede more than you score / your win rate; and I'm sure he believes we'll do better than Leeds in that regard.