Dele Alli at Everton

[Deleted member 29446]

It’s really worrying for me that Mourinho seems to build this side around Dele Alli, he is good, but he isn’t a superstar. Like Lo Celso on the right Alli is not a #10 - he doesn’t have the playmakskills that we’d have with Eriksen for the last 6 years, and in the future hopefully with Lo Celso. The front 6 today actually only Kane is a good passer hence the hoof ball stuff.

JM has some options but it’s not with zero ball players in the side.

433 like Liverpool and City with:
New DM
Ndombele - Lo Celso/Alli

 

[Primativ]

It’s really worrying for me that Mourinho seems to build this side around Dele Alli, he is good, but he isn’t a superstar. Like Lo Celso on the right Alli is not a #10 - he doesn’t have the playmakskills that we’d have with Eriksen for the last 6 years, and in the future hopefully with Lo Celso. The front 6 today actually only Kane is a good passer hence the hoof ball stuff.

JM has some options but it’s not with zero ball players in the side.

433 like Liverpool and City with:
New DM
Ndombele - Lo Celso/Alli

Agree. Another issue is unlike City and Liverpool, our wide players like Moura and Son are not good passers. Our play nearly always breakdowns with those two players. They are direct players who like to shoot, and can whip a cross in low and hard but that's about it.

Compared to say Mane and Salah who are excellent passers, Mane in particular is very good at passing between the lines for Salah to run onto.

Like you say, the fact that JM intends to build a side around Alli worries me. I've watched the player for 5 years and he is not the type of player you do that with. My hope was to get a manager in who will phase out the likes of Alli to a squad option and progress our style and system to a modern coherent fluid attack.

JM may still do that, it's early days, but if he is intent to build an attack around Dele, we essentially waste a forward position on having a weird shadow striker type player but who isn't a number 10 and essentially goal hangs, because he can't really contribute much in the creative part of play. I know Alli can create occasionally, but he isn't what I would call a creative player like Eriksen or GLC are. Playing long balls for Alli to run onto is not a sustainable way to play in the PL. It is so easy to counteract, any decent side will suss it out like Chelsea have done, and we will win fuck all playing like this.

Alli has some great talent finishing inside the box instinctively but in my opinion his inclusion in the first 11 introduces more problems than he solves.

 

[Shadydan]

For Dele to function in our side he needs two midfield controllers behind him, I think the problem area in the team lies in the 4-2-3-1 if anything.

 

[punkisback]

For Dele to function in our side he needs two midfield controllers behind him, I think the problem area in the team lies in the 4-2-3-1 if anything.

I think you would need either need a good ball playing holder and an athletic competent box box or a good defensive anchor and an athletic creative CM to get the best out this system.

 

[Primativ]

For Dele to function in our side he needs two midfield controllers behind him, I think the problem area in the team lies in the 4-2-3-1 if anything.

It isn't that simple. That 3 behind Kane, if you have two WF's in the side, where does Alli fit?

He does not work in that No 10 position, he isn't a good enough passer to play that role. He isn't a GLC who has the close control / dribbling/ passing ability / or an Eriksen type player who has the passing game and long shot ability.

Alli neither has the consistent short game creative passing ability nor the long range shooting ability.

Dele doesn't work coming in from wide positions as he isn't a direct pacey wide player who beats players with skills and dribbling ability / explosive pace. He is too easily marked out of the game there as he is slow and doesn't have the physical attributes.

As I keep saying, no way Dele gets into any top side in Europe, I stand by that assertion. Yes he is capable of magical moments but I keep repeating, I don't see how he fits in. Even Ndombele would be a far better option as a no 10 if we were really stuck, as Ndombele can beat players in tight spaces easily plus he has outstanding short passing and he seems like he can strike a ball from range too.

 

[muppetman]

Difficult to judge as yesterday was painful for everyone but he is having to come really deep to get the ball (then loses it in dangerous areas) OR gets it out on the wing with no real options for him other than to pass back to Jan.

I think the issue (as with so much) is the disaster that is our current CM - we need to get Ndombele fit and on the pitch as he can provide quick ball to Dele who then links well with Son and Kane (Moura not so much).

 

[OPModric]

Just look at what players Mourinho have played as #10 in his previous teams. Alli is none of that, Eriksen and Lo Celso are.

 

[Shadydan]

Just look at what players Mourinho have played as #10 in his previous teams. Alli is none of that, Eriksen and Lo Celso are.

He's had Ozil at Real, Deco at Porto and Sneijder at Inter.

 

[ILS]

He can score

It isn't that simple. That 3 behind Kane, if you have two WF's in the side, where does Alli fit?

He does not work in that No 10 position, he isn't a good enough passer to play that role. He isn't a GLC who has the close control / dribbling/ passing ability / or an Eriksen type player who has the passing game and long shot ability.

Alli neither has the consistent short game creative passing ability nor the long range shooting ability.

Dele doesn't work coming in from wide positions as he isn't a direct pacey wide player who beats players with skills and dribbling ability / explosive pace. He is too easily marked out of the game there as he is slow and doesn't have the physical attributes.

As I keep saying, no way Dele gets into any top side in Europe, I stand by that assertion. Yes he is capable of magical moments but I keep repeating, I don't see how he fits in. Even Ndombele would be a far better option as a no 10 if we were really stuck, as Ndombele can beat players in tight spaces easily plus he has outstanding short passing and he seems like he can strike a ball from range too.

No he doesn't get in to any top side in Europe and also the England side. If people think he is walking back into the England side then they are seriously deluded. Southgate is building a team around Sterling, Kane, Sancho/Rashford and he knows that playing a front three of either of those requires a midfield 3. I can't see how Alli gets infront of Maddison, Mount or Grealish who are all far more comfortable in possession of the football in those areas of the pitch.

 

[Primativ]

He's had Ozil at Real, Deco at Porto and Sneijder at Inter.

Nothing like Dele then.

 

[Primativ]

He can score

No he doesn't get in to any top side in Europe and also the England side. If people think he is walking back into the England side then they are seriously deluded. Southgate is building a team around Sterling, Kane, Sancho/Rashford and he knows that playing a front three of either of those requires a midfield 3. I can't see how Alli gets infront of Maddison, Mount or Grealish who are all far more comfortable in possession of the football in those areas of the pitch.

I was going to mention England. He simply doesn't fit into the England side either, as you say Southgate is playing a modern system with Kane flanked by Rashford/Sancho and Sterling.

Alli again does not fit into the side, and is unable to play deeper as he dallies on the ball and is too slow in possession.

 

[Shadydan]

Nothing like Dele then.

Also put Lingard and Oscar as no10s who are a lot more like Alli.

 

[Primativ]

Also put Lingard and Oscar as no10s who are a lot more like Alli.

Lingard to be fair he did manage his best season under JM but he's gash.

Oscar is nothing like Alli.

 

[Shadydan]

Lingard to be fair he did manage his best season under JM but he's gash.

Oscar is nothing like Alli.

Oscar is a lot more like Alli than the aforementioned, didn't he sell Mata who is exactly the type of player I mentioned and keep Oscar who is a more functional no10 and I must have imagined United finishing 2nd whilst picking up a couple of pots under Jose or are we gonna totally ignore that because you know...agendas and all that.

 

[Primativ]

Oscar is a lot more like Alli than the aforementioned, didn't he sell Mata who is exactly the type of player I mentioned and keep Oscar who is a more functional no10 and I must have imagined United finishing 2nd whilst picking up a couple of pots under Jose or are we gonna totally ignore that because you know...agendas and all that.

"Oscar is a lot more like Alli than the aformentioned" means nothing whatsoever. Oscar is nothing like Alli as a footballer, I can't believe you are even debating that. And you mention agenda's?!

The fact is Alli possesses almost none of the required attributes you'd want in a no 10. He can't shoot from range, he is a very inconsistent creative passer, he dallies on the ball, can slow down play, not great awareness, he does not have great close control, dribbling ability and skill (other than a nutmeg).

He is a player who comes alive in the 6 yard box, is an instinctive finisher capable of the odd moment of magic in the box and making good runs off the ball. He does conjure up the occasional brilliant bit of skill when he doesn't have time to think about it, but he isn't an effective number 10, end of story. If he was he'd walk into the England side. England had the same problem and what did Southgate do? he dropped him. England have been a far more fluid attacking system since Alli was removed from the attack.

Alli can be a matchwinner no doubt but so can Moura and Son but Alli isn't a number 10 and just because he is a very occasional match winner, it still doesn't means he fits into the side.

 

[OPModric]

Also put Lingard and Oscar as no10s who are a lot more like Alli.

Oscar was much more similiar to Deco

 

[Shadydan]

Oscar was much more similiar to Deco

He was a better counter presser which is why I suspect he likes Dele

 

[OPModric]

He was a better counter presser which is why I suspect he likes Dele

Agree with that. I think thats the reason behind Poch playing him as well.

 

[dtxspurs]

Scarily enough I think the diamond is the best formation to work around Dele... you could fit in Ndombele and Lo Celso behind him and a holding midfielder behind them.

 

[Danny1]

I said it in another thread that we need to change to a 4-3-3. Buy a competent DM and play Ndombele & Lo Celso in the middle. You can then have Kane, Son & Alli up top. When we had DESK firing Alli wasn't playing as a number 10, that was Eriksen and we were far more dangerous going forward as we had Eriksens creativity. With both Lo Celso & Ndombele we have two players who can create something and both Kane & Alli would benefit.

Yesterday we were totally confused with the ball when we got to final third. That's because we had zero creativity in the side. Alli creates something every now & then, Lucas (for me) just isn't good enough to be a starter & we had Sissoko & Dier who offer nothing at all going forward. Add Aurier who was terrible and Verts who is a CB into the mix & it's pretty obvious why we are struggling. Kane had nothing at all to play with yesterday, even the passes into him were terrible from all players, it is no coincidence that when Ndombele came on within 5 minutes he played a pass down the side of the defender for Kane, something that none of our other players in the starting 11 can do.