Player Watch Player Watch: Giovani Lo Celso

bbunc · Jun 4, 2019

Flashspur said:
This is all well and good but this player went for 22m only a little while ago. Where were our scouts and Poch then? We are seeminlgy always late to the party. N'Dombele is the other one.

When Poch refused to buy in the last two windows both the Argentinian and the Frenchman were much much cheaper!!

Now we are getting rogered for a princely sum.

How many similar players are out there now that we could get at reasonable prices before they break out and are the Lo Celsco and N'Dombele of next season or the season after? Or is our coaching set up so piss poor that the scouts can only spot the bleeding fucking obvious. Maybe they should spend some time indoors playing FIFA 19.

Fucks sake, 85% of this board have been talking about Tanguy for a year or more.

When I look at our youth set up and the crap coming up through there, I think it would be better if Levy went out and bought the scouting team from Betis, Ajax or Benefica. That would be a better transfer window then the last three put together.

I think you raise a pretty darn good point. We’re kind of in a place where we have to spend huge to fill gaps and progress because we haven’t done what was needed to progress incrementally and with those types of buys.

Hopefully if we have big summer to get the huge stuff done, the scouting system can get some major investment and those are the types of moves we can focus on going forward. We may have money this window, but we won’t be able to compete with the top teams generally, so we have to find and land these guys before they become no brainers.

It does seem like building a world class scouting team would be one of the cheapest ways to get a massive bang for the buck.

SpartanSpur · Jun 4, 2019

Joely said:
Can't say I've watched much of him but from his clips he looks very left footed. Not another Lamela I hope in that when the ball is there to be struck/passed with the right he looks to shift it to his left?

He does heavily favour the left but he has scored a few with his right so I don't think it's a standing foot/swinger scenario. He just seems very adept at working it to his left. You could argue Messi favours his left greatly too and he's alright!

Flashspur · Jun 4, 2019

THFCSPURS19 said:
Lo Celso went for 22m because of a permanent option as part of a loan deal.

JJ said Aulas wanted 75m for Ndombele last summer.

And who gives a fuck how much they cost? We've spent nothing since Jan 2018 and we still have people moaning.

Well i give a fuck you muppet because this club is carrying a huge debt from the stadium and I dont want us getting ripped off again. I dont think we can sustain a net 185m quid transfer cost which is what it will cost us to get this guy, the Frenchie and Sess. Thats bonkers money. And thats even before we start talking FB's.

Thats more then your fricken pocket money danger mouse.

Plus you can just see us getting ripped off with our dead wood and Eriksen running down his contract.

BuckeyeSpurs11 · Jun 4, 2019

Around £8m apart according to the John Cross article- suspect the major hold up is the sell on fee to PSG but seems very likely to get done, wouldn’t many of you agree?

CrouchPotato · Jun 4, 2019

Flashspur said:
Well i give a fuck you muppet because this club is carrying a huge debt from the stadium and I dont want us getting ripped off again. I dont think we can sustain a net 185m quid transfer cost which is what it will cost us to get this guy, the Frenchie and Sess. Thats bonkers money. And thats even before we start talking FB's.

Thats more then your fricken pocket money danger mouse.

Well I can guarantee you Levy is the best person to work that all out. If he pays that for players this summer we can afford it.

U.S. Spurs Fan · Jun 4, 2019

I think someone compared him to Bernardo Silva and based on the clips I have watched, that seems valid. More like him or Isco than like Eriksen IMO, which means we may change the way we setup and play. Seems much more direct as a dribbler with pace.

Flashspur · Jun 4, 2019

A well run club has a good scouting set up and can spot the good ones well in advance. We seem do be doing sweet fuck all in that area.

I dont mind the player. I think he is a brilliant up and coming talent. It just pisses me off that we are now over a barrel and have to stump up big time.

SpartanSpur · Jun 4, 2019

bbunc said:
I think you raise a pretty darn good point. We’re kind of in a place where we have to spend huge to fill gaps and progress because we haven’t done what was needed to progress incrementally and with those types of buys.

Hopefully if we have big summer to get the huge stuff done, the scouting system can get some major investment and those are the types of moves we can focus on going forward. We may have money this window, but we won’t be able to compete with the top teams generally, so we have to find and land these guys before they become no brainers.

It does seem like building a world class scouting team would be one of the cheapest ways to get a massive bang for the buck.

The problem is that the closer you get to the top of the pyramid, the harder it is to make this work. Chelsea have one of the most successful youth setups in Europe and massively struggle to integrate players, City too.

A lot of the reason these stars appear in foreign leagues is because they get quality game time in a real competition, playing in title challenges in a top 6 style. If you loan out a PL youth player to a lesser PL side, they tend to play survival football. The problem is you can't just loan youth players to Benfica, Ajax, Roma or Porto and let them develop them for you, it's their whole business model so they need to play their own players.

Liverpool have shown how it's done once you get to a certain point. You're best chance on taking that last step is scouting a top quality option and paying what it takes to get them. You can keep scattergun searching for bargains like a Roma or Sevilla but that probably just leaves you in a perpetual loop of being nearly men.

Poch has been talking up Liverpool's transfer business all season, and it ended up paying dividends at our expense sadly. Plus the stadium was built to let us compete with the big boys on wages and transfer fees, it was the whole point.

pablo73 · Jun 4, 2019

Flashspur said:
This is all well and good but this player went for 22m only a little while ago. Where were our scouts and Poch then? We are seeminlgy always late to the party. N'Dombele is the other one.

When Poch refused to buy in the last two windows both the Argentinian and the Frenchman were much much cheaper!!

Now we are getting rogered for a princely sum.

How many similar players are out there now that we could get at reasonable prices before they break out and are the Lo Celsco and N'Dombele of next season or the season after? Or is our coaching set up so piss poor that the scouts can only spot the bleeding fucking obvious. Maybe they should spend some time indoors playing FIFA 19.

Fucks sake, 85% of this board have been talking about Tanguy for a year or more.

When I look at our youth set up and the crap coming up through there, I think it would be better if Levy went out and bought the scouting team from Betis, Ajax or Benefica. That would be a better transfer window then the last three put together.

This is such a simplistic take on it and is something that could be directed at every decent sized club in the world. Given that we've had pretty much zero net spend for the last 7 or 8 years and still regularly qualify for the champions league and came within 90 minutes of winning it I think it's fair to say we do better than most. It's all about risk management, the reason that the like of N'Dombele and Lo Celso are going for such big money is that they have proved themselves over a certain period of time at a certain standard of competition.

The likes of Ajax, Benfica & Betis can afford to take more risks on young, untested players because they play in less competitive leagues and/or don't have the same pressures. None of this is to say that our scouting set up cannot be improved, I'm sure it can, but to moan about not signing superstars before they become superstars just shows completely unrealistic expectations. If it was that easy everyone would be doing it. When you are signing unproven players for lower fees, for every Dele Alli there is an Adel Taraabt.

hellava_tough · Jun 4, 2019

If it genuinely is £8m holding this deal up, just pay up and get the player.

I know every season we say "Well, we can't just be splashing cash around left and right", but you know what...this summer, of all summers, let's just do it.

It's hardly going to bankrupt the club!

CrouchPotato · Jun 4, 2019

Flashspur said:
A well run club has a good scouting set up and can spot the good ones well in advance. We seem do be doing sweet fuck all in that area.

I dont mind the player. I think he is a brilliant up and coming talent. It just pisses me off that we are now over a barrel and have to stump up big time.

Well apparently we had a bid turned down/failed to convince De Jong last summer before the whole world wanted him.

Clearly we have been identifying players that suit Poch’s system yet have failed to either convince them , or fork out large amounts. We now have the funds from the new stadium and consistent champs league football, as well as increased prestige from the final to finally attract players that are good enough to improve a very talented squad.

ExpatFan · Jun 4, 2019

hellava_tough said:
Has PSG turned into the biggest second-hand player dealership in European football?

Great quality to be had there, but blimey, they're experts at buying high and selling low

More money than sense.... like most Qataris.

Clive Wilson · Jun 4, 2019

Another thing, for every Lo Celso there are 10 N'Jies. He went to Betis relatively unproven after being bit part for PSG and has kicked on. If you want to be a top top level club you can't be picking up the N'Jies and Lo Celso's until they are tested at a higher level. It doesn't matter how good they look as a sub, in the reserves or in ligue 2 even the best scouts can't tell how a player will cope at the next level. Elite clubs don't take the cheaper risks, they pay a premium for guaranteed quality and overall it isn't really much more expensive.

Insomnia · Jun 4, 2019

I hate these threads sometimes

punkisback · Jun 4, 2019

Looks like he has the potential to be our next Modric! Sign him up!

Flashspur · Jun 4, 2019

Clive Wilson said:
Another thing, for every Lo Celso there are 10 N'Jies. He went to Betis relatively unproven after being bit part for PSG and has kicked on. If you want to be a top top level club you can't be picking up the N'Jies and Lo Celso's until they are tested at a higher level. It doesn't matter how good they look as a sub, in the reserves or in ligue 2 even the best scouts can't tell how a player will cope at the next level. Elite clubs don't take the cheaper risks, they pay a premium for guaranteed quality and overall it isn't really much more expensive.

Mate, your the voice of reason and all that but thats not how I run my household budget. I look for the bargains first

You must be the bloke that walks in the sales room and has the salesman rubbing his hands in anticipation with a gleam in his eye.

S17PUR · Jun 4, 2019

eddiev14 said:
Agreed but it’s now the going rate. We need to spend big this summer.

I agree with the need to spend completely, but I think it's extremely optimistic to think that we'll sign Ndombele and Lo Celso, keep Eriksen and do the other business that we need to do, and that's what slightly worries me. We could end up with a strong central midfield, but still weak in the full back positions.

If we did sign these two, plus do what else we arguably need to that'd end up looking something like:

Ndombele: £70m
Lo Celso: £70m
Sessegnon: £30m
A bloody good right back: £35m+?
A wide/central forward: £40m+?
Clarke/young up and coming: £10-15m?

There's no way on earth we're going to end the summer with a net spend of £200+ million. It's just not going to happen, and if we keep Eriksen, the other potential outgoings would surely only total £60-70m at the most.

rawhide · Jun 4, 2019

Insomnia said:
I hate these threads sometimes

I hate all of the transfer threads at some point.

Incoming:
Not good enough
Too expensive
Doesn’t fit our style
Should’ve identified them earlier
Too good, won’t come
Won’t pay wages
We will get gazumped

Outgoing:
Overpaid
Lost interest
Won’t want to leave
No replacement
Shit
Been shit for a while
Didn’t fit our system

Ugh, just ugh.

hakano · Jun 4, 2019

Flashspur said:
A well run club has a good scouting set up and can spot the good ones well in advance. We seem do be doing sweet fuck all in that area.

I dont mind the player. I think he is a brilliant up and coming talent. It just pisses me off that we are now over a barrel and have to stump up big time.

I agree, our scouting is literally non existent. These players are well known now - if you look at our transfer strategy over the last years it is shocking. Steve Hitchen supposed to be shit hot but we haven't seen anything yet.

THFCSPURS19 · Jun 4, 2019

Flashspur said:
Well i give a fuck you muppet because this club is carrying a huge debt from the stadium and I dont want us getting ripped off again. I dont think we can sustain a net 185m quid transfer cost which is what it will cost us to get this guy, the Frenchie and Sess. Thats bonkers money. And thats even before we start talking FB's.

Thats more then your fricken pocket money danger mouse.

Plus you can just see us getting ripped off with our dead wood and Eriksen running down his contract.

I think you should calm down pal.

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