Weekend Football 18/19 Jan 2014

[theShiznit]

But they didn't really see it. Football rules are always stupid, and I'm sure those same rules would be applied to reviews of dives. The ref saw the player running in the general direction of the incident, therefore the panel is powerless.

They had just changed the rules to apparently stop injustices like this happen due to them not being able to act.

Then a few weeks later this (Torres scratch) happened and they said "we're not able to act"

And everyone was like... "Well what the fuck was that rule change for then!!?"
And calls were made for further rule changes

Basically whether they didn't see it, saw part of it, saw it wrong, completely cocked up their (ref's) decision, they need to just say they're all open to be acted on retrospectively. Too much protection of primadonna refs that don't like to admit mistakes.

Anyway Suarez is due a biting soon... Coz it doesn't look like anyone's used the nail clippers on his teeth in a while so he'll take matters into his own hands.

 

[tony0379]

LFC ashamed of nothing, offended by everything

 

[theShiznit]

every time that weird decrepit looking creature rodgers claims his team can win the title they always drop points

Why does Rodgers always look like he's just come from a hard night compering at the local trany night just popped off his wig but forgot to take his make up off?

 

[Spurger King]

Surprised Liverpool don't get more dodgy decisions at Anfield. Must be an intimidating atmosphere for officials, what with all the stab-happy smack heads skulking about.

 

[tony0379]

Yeah, I can easily see us win 25-0 tomorrow. Just have to make sure to score early

To dare is to do

 

[Syn_13]

Hearing a lot of Liverpool fans trying to defend Suarez. Suarez dived, plain and simple. No way you can justify that.

 

[PG Spurs]

Again - things don't need to be 100% effective to be effective and serve their purpose

Obviously it would be the job of the FA to employ a non bias panel and at the very least it would ensure punishment for the most obvious of dives

More to the point its main objective would be to reduce the number of dives seen in a game (more important than simply punishing offenders) and the threat of a 5 game ban would surely impact upon that

Increased punishment and increased probability of receiving punishment would see a reduction in offenses I have no doubt and that would be to the benefit of the game and justify the introduction of such a panel.

I don't think it would be difficult for a panel of experts to be able to make correct calls >80% of the time when they have time to review footage over and over again like the dubious goals panel can when they want to determine who got the final touch and or if the shot was already going on target before a deflection.

I also don't see your point really - are you suggesting that because a panel might not get every decision correct it would not be worthwhile? because I fundamentally disagree with that for reasons I have just outlined.

But they can't even get malicious fouls right. There are always instances like Charlie Adams getting off scott free. And retrospective action still doesn't change the result. If it happened in the last game of the season, then I'm sure many players would be perfectly happy to take a dive to win their team the championship, or save their team from relegation. Many players will take a ban if their team benefits - Suarez did it in the world cup.

All we can really do is keep highlighting it, and hope that players grow a conscience. And clubs need to take responsibility to actively discourage it. If a player is diving consistently, and it's really obvious, then the FA might take action. But I can never see them doing it for every incident.

 

[theShiznit]

Hearing a lot of Liverpool fans trying to defend Suarez. Suarez dived, plain and simple. No way you can justify that.

It is a true art now diving.

With all the pained faces pulled in mid air and the cries and screams that wouldn't be out of place in a SAW movie.

So much so that I now rank the mid air dive face pull and scream combo above the look the other way pass.

 

[Shea]

But they can't even get malicious fouls right. There are always instances like Charlie Adams getting off scott free. And retrospective action still doesn't change the result. If it happened in the last game of the season, then I'm sure many players would be perfectly happy to take a dive to win their team the championship, or save their team from relegation. Many players will take a ban if their team benefits - Suarez did it in the world cup.

All we can really do is keep highlighting it, and hope that players grow a conscience. And clubs need to take responsibility to actively discourage it. If a player is diving consistently, and it's really obvious, then the FA might take action. But I can never see them doing it for every incident.

It set guidelines were in place for diving to attain a penalty and anyone found guilty of this were handed a 5 match ban it would have an impact of deterring the act.

Dives may be somewhat subjective at times but more often that not it doesn't take more that two or three replays from various angles to determine whether the player has gone down because of a challenge or gone down of his own accord.

It's not a difficult thing to enforce

Remove issues such as action not being able to be taken if an official has already made a decision on an incident and allow the panel to review and take action on any and all potential incidents regardless.

I am sure you're right that it would not be 100% effective and some players would still risk the ban assuming they could get away with it - but the increased punishment and increased probability of getting punished would still have a positive impact on the game.

How difficult could it really be to assemble a panel capable of enforcing these laws if they were introduced and unobstructed by red tape?

As with anything it may not be fool proof and could take time to integrate effectively - as with goal line technology but football should be evolving for the better and in my opinion panels like these (and ones for incidents like you highlight with regards to Charlie Adam's challenges) should be in place and should become more effective

I'm saying the FA SHOULD have a panel that does these things effectively just as they SHOULD be able to dish out punishment for these two footed leg breaker challenges.

No way will highlighting the incidents ever discourage a player from doing it

The FA just needs to change their stance and give more power to such panels - place more emphasis on punishing offenders and take a harder line.

 

[nightgoat]

"It was a clear penalty. When you watch it closely, the goalkeeper's left arm made contact with Luis Suarez's foot. I thought we were unlucky not to get another penalty when Leandro Bacuna handballed it."

As usual, whenever Liverpool don't win Brendan Rodgers finds some way to blame the referee for it. Even though they only managed a point thanks to the ref buying Suarez' blatant dive.

 

[Mr Pink]

They were fortunate to get a point tonight, very actually.

Rodgers couldn't resist the temptation to cram all their attacking players into a 4-4-2 and he got it horribly wrong. Coutinho out on the left was stupid to...all though he moved him inside, I think, after half an hour. But they were imbalanced with too many cooks spoiling the broth.

Doubt he'll make the same mistake again, but here's to hoping.

Massive chance to go equal on points with them tomorrow.

Who'd of thought after the 5-0 a month ago.

 

[PG Spurs]

It set guidelines were in place for diving to attain a penalty and anyone found guilty of this were handed a 5 match ban it would have an impact of deterring the act.

Dives may be somewhat subjective at times but more often that not it doesn't take more that two or three replays from various angles to determine whether the player has gone down because of a challenge or gone down of his own accord.

It's not a difficult thing to enforce

Remove issues such as action not being able to be taken if an official has already made a decision on an incident and allow the panel to review and take action on any and all potential incidents regardless.

I am sure you're right that it would not be 100% effective and some players would still risk the ban assuming they could get away with it - but the increased punishment and increased probability of getting punished would still have a positive impact on the game.

How difficult could it really be to assemble a panel capable of enforcing these laws if they were introduced and unobstructed by red tape?

As with anything it may not be fool proof and could take time to integrate effectively - as with goal line technology but football should be evolving for the better and in my opinion panels like these (and ones for incidents like you highlight with regards to Charlie Adam's challenges) should be in place and should become more effective

I'm saying the FA SHOULD have a panel that does these things effectively just as they SHOULD be able to dish out punishment for these two footed leg breaker challenges.

No way will highlighting the incidents ever discourage a player from doing it

The FA just needs to change their stance and give more power to such panels - place more emphasis on punishing offenders and take a harder line.

I just think it's too muddy an area. A panel may eliminate some diving, but it probably wouldn't be able to act in a lot of instances. They'll slow it down and zoom in 4000%, and if there is the slightest contact then they will say "no dive". The FA can try to do something, but I think it will lead to arguments a lot of the time.

Players have to take responsibility, and if they don't like diving then they need to get together and make a stand.

 

[Spurger King]

I just think it's too muddy an area. A panel may eliminate some diving, but it probably wouldn't be able to act in a lot of instances. They'll slow it down and zoom in 4000%, and if there is the slightest contact then they will say "no dive". The FA can try to do something, but I think it will lead to arguments a lot of the time.

Players have to take responsibility, and if they don't like diving then they need to get together and make a stand.

They did a trial run of it on Football Focus a few years ago, with a panel of refs reviewing contentious decisions. As you suggest, a lot of them were inconclusive, with the panel saying that even if they were given an hour to reach a decision they wouldn't be able to.

Maybe a panel should have 30 seconds to reach a decision. If it's not clear cut then the original decision of the ref should stand.

 

[PG Spurs]

They did a trial run of it on Football Focus a few years ago, with a panel of refs reviewing contentious decisions. As you suggest, a lot of them were inconclusive, with the panel saying that even if they were given an hour to reach a decision they wouldn't be able to.

Maybe a panel should have 30 seconds to reach a decision. If it's not clear cut then the original decision of the ref should stand.

I wouldn't be against that idea. They probably wouldn't have ruled against Suarez today though, unfortunately.

 

[Shea]

I just think it's too muddy an area. A panel may eliminate some diving, but it probably wouldn't be able to act in a lot of instances. They'll slow it down and zoom in 4000%, and if there is the slightest contact then they will say "no dive". The FA can try to do something, but I think it will lead to arguments a lot of the time.

Players have to take responsibility, and if they don't like diving then they need to get together and make a stand.

The FA just have to take a hard stance - currently it's really not on their agenda to stamp these things out and I think it should be.

If they took a hard line it would have the desired effect

It's not a difficult thing to do really - there are numerous occasions where anyone with any common sense can make a decision about a dive.

Not just contact - whether the contact was enough to send the player down - is it really that hard to determine if a panel of experts use common sense?

If a decision can't be made then fine - there would obviously be some incidents that were inconclusive and benefit of the doubt would have to be given but very often often there are incidents that are too fast in real time for the ref to spot but are actually very easy to prove on replay with the right camera angle

If the only thing that was achieved was the most obvious of offenses that fool referees were punished in the future and players became less likely to dive and therefore less games were affected by dodgy penalties then it would be for the benefit of the beautiful game.

It seems like something that's impossible to enforce perhaps currently but I am sure there was a time when people thought no way would there ever be a no pass back law (which also changed the game for the better)

 

[WiganSpur]

If we win tomorrow and beat City then we've got a good chance of the top 4. But that's a very tough ask.

We've just got to keep plugging away and making sure we get those 3 points and we can make it difficult for the Scousers and Utd.

 

[PG Spurs]

The FA just have to take a hard stance - currently it's really not on their agenda to stamp these things out and I think it should be.

If they took a hard line it would have the desired effect

It's not a difficult thing to do really - there are numerous occasions where anyone with any common sense can make a decision about a dive.

Not just contact - whether the contact was enough to send the player down - is it really that hard to determine if a panel of experts use common sense?

If a decision can't be made then fine - there would obviously be some incidents that were inconclusive and benefit of the doubt would have to be given but very often often there are incidents that are too fast in real time for the ref to spot but are actually very easy to prove on replay with the right camera angle

If the only thing that was achieved was the most obvious of offenses that fool referees were punished in the future and players became less likely to dive and therefore less games were affected by dodgy penalties then it would be for the benefit of the beautiful game.

It seems like something that's impossible to enforce perhaps currently but I am sure there was a time when people thought no way would there ever be a no pass back law (which also changed the game for the better)

They can try. What about players who are accused of diving by the ref, but replays show that they were fouled? And it happens so often that they are suspended, like Mr Bale. Should they review those incidents too?

 

[Shea]

They can try. What about players who are accused of diving by the ref, but replays show that they were fouled? And it happens so often that they are suspended, like Mr Bale. Should they review those incidents too?

Yes - bans should be rescinded if they were unfairly awarded

 

[PG Spurs]

Yes - bans should be rescinded if they were unfairly awarded

It's nice ideologically, but I think the FA will need to change dramatically for anything like it to ever be enforced.

 

[Mr Pink]

If we win tomorrow and beat City then we've got a good chance of the top 4. But that's a very tough ask.

We've just got to keep plugging away and making sure we get those 3 points and we can make it difficult for the Scousers and Utd.

We don't absolutely need to beat City. But we'll need to win at least one of the City/Everton games.....four points from those two would set us up nicely IMO.

Personally I think tomorrow is a big one. We really need to win it, as we've some very tricky games coming up. Swansea just don't impress me, too much possession with not enough punch where it counts. We play well and we'll win it convincingly IMO. Seen all their home games this season and they've been poor.