Shaun Wright-Phillips

[WildCard]

SWP at Man City form would be brilliant, he also adds another threat to the team, does anyone rember erly United, where they simly broke on the counter with terrifying pace? That could be us. Oh yeah...

 

[brakefluid]

Ah finally a straight thread.....as in not Bent (I know very sad..very sad)

But on a more serious note, agreed this would be a wonder signing. Can't see it happening though. Moaninho for all his bluster, is a smart cookie. He will not strengthen rivals, eg. Duff. If he is selling SWP, he will move these players to clubs he does not consider as a threat. I mean Duff for 5M, come on.....

 

[sloth]

I think it will be either SWP or Lennon, they just seem too similar to me to. Having them both would mean we'd have a huge amount of capital tied up in essentially the same player.

SWP is the more complete player too. He's fast, a good ball carrier, can cross and shoot. He also seems to have a good head on his shoulders. He's major downside is his size, but we can afford a couple of short-arses I suppose.

In summary then, if SWP then no Lennon with DL cashing in and making a small profit on the deal.

 

[Kendall]

I think it will be either SWP or Lennon, they just seem to similar to me to. Having them both would mean we'd have a huge amount of capital tied up in essentially the same player.

SWP is the more complete player too. He's fast, a good ball carrier, can cross and shoot. He also seems to have a good head on his shoulders. He's major downside is his size, but we can afford a couple of short-arses I suppose.

In summary then, if SWP then no Lennon with DL cashing in and making a small profit on the deal.

I agree SWP is the more complete player now, but he's also touching 6 years older than Lennon.

I wouldn't mind us getting SWP though, because he and Lennon both have the potential to play either wing, so it's not a straight swap, it'll be a versatility thing once again.

 

[sloth]

I've seen very little of Sneijder, so I'm entirely reliant on those who actually watch the Eredivisie. And from what I've read, if we sign him (whch remains a very big 'if'), and if we continue with a 4-4-2, a Jenas-Sneijder CM seems a strong possibility, or at least a stronger one than a Sneijder-Zokora combination. (Awaits howls of protest/outrage from the DZFC).

There's been a fair amount written on Sneijder and his defensive qualities. I think I'm safe in saying that opinion is divided.

There's a majority on here (including people who have lived in Holland in recent years) who think he's a robust and tenacious midfielder but who's main qualities are with the ball, he's creativity and shooting ability - a cross between Tainio and Paul Scholes.

There's a significant minority on here including one Ajax fan, Martin Jol and most importantly, me, who believe the latter to be true but the former to have been over egged. I'm not saying he's a Danny Murphy, but he is small and doesn't relish the tackling/tracking back bit. He can get riled Paul Scholes style, but that imo is a liability not a quality (check how many times he's been sent off and carded.).

Anyway, that's all by way of saying that Sneijder may or may not come, but if he does, in my honest opinion, there is no way in hell that it'll be to play as part of central midfield two. The only way it will happen is if we get in someone with significantly better defensive qualities than either DZ or JJ and that will mean last year's first choice being jettisoned, something I find extremely unlikely too. Perhaps he'll play as part of a three or on the left, but that's it.

 

[thetallaghttiger]

A SWP move back to a Man City with Sven as manager has been ruled out by Ian Wright, SWP and Sven don't get on apparently!

West Ham, Villa, Us, and another 2/3 teams are probably left in the running for him I'd imagine

 

[ossibissa]

That's if he's moving at all of course.

 

[Bruts]

jenas will not leave this summer, jol loves him.

 

[onemorespursfan]

So who plays in the midfield from Lennon, Schneider, Zokora, SWP, MP, Jenas, Hudd, Tainio, Taraabt. People at work find it amusing how many midfielders we have, and there is no sign of a balanced 4 just yet. This is the only thing that worries me about MJ - All positions are sorted except for the middle of the park.

 

[johno]

personally im guessing that we're monitoring SWP mainly because he looks available should the right price comes in, however i cannot see him being our number midfield 1 target.

sneijder and petrov make far more sense to me then us sigbing SWP, unless BMJ feels that lennon and SWP could both work together in a team? maybe playing lennon in a more free role like he did against chelski?

either way i cannot for the life of me see lennon leaving, regardless of if we ever sign SWP which i cannot for the life of me see us doing. chelski wouldnt sell him to us full stop.

 

[mrboombarrakoomba]

not going to happen in a million years.

 

[Knights_of_White]

Gentlemen get real. If SWP does come to us he'll end up with prob no more opportunites than he's currently getting at Chelski, plus he'll no doubt end up having to take a paycut! It's not going to happen.

I think next season we'll a lot lot more of a young Mr Taarabt... As Joey pointed out there are around 100 wing opportunites next season, Lennon, Steed and Tainio will fill a lot of those ad the rest will be divided out to Taarabt and Bale....

I dont think it's implausible to expect a midfiled of : (L -> R)

Lennon - Sneider ray: - Zokora - Jenas

For some of the games next season, with lennon cutting in off the left for Sneider to do an Akon and "Smack that..."

All those who honestly believe SWP will sign are pure mugs... in my omnipotant opinion of course! :wink:

 

[onemorespursfan]

And who doe Taraabt replace in your line up... Not Schneider!

 

[Knights_of_White]

And who doe Taraabt replace in your line up... Not Schneider!

Why not? Not in our European games obviously, but in carling cup games etc why not let Taarabt play CM.. or even have him wide???

We've now got a massive squad and only need a couple of additions to make it complete...(at least for the coming season that is!)
We have a great balance of Youth/Experience & Skill/Tenacity there will be plenty of opportunites for the whole squad in a multitute of positions.... Have a static team anymore will not win you anything! Flexibility and adaptability is now paramount.

I think we'll all be supprised next season with formations and the players that contriubte to those formations.

 

[joey55]

I don't have a problem with your maths at all. And I don't particularly want Lennon to go either, but I just have a feeling that Jol thinks he may be a bit of a cocky twat, and doesn't necessarily want a bad apple floating around the dressing room under minding his authority. This is complete conjecture, but I noticed Lennon's negative body language at times last season, forinstance one occassion I remember him getting arsy with Berbatov.

If I'm wrong and he wants SWP and lennon, it could be that he's earmarked Lennon for a slightly different roll, as this is something else that Jol has hinted at previously, with maybe Bent (unfortunately) coming in maybe Defoe leaving, perhaps Jol fancies Lennon playing in the hole or as a keane back up ??

What do you think ?

I get the same impression about the Jol/Lennon relationship as you, but it is largelly fueled by ITK stuff, which is usually bullshit. But, there is something about Lennon that just makes me think he'd be a bit of a shit to manage. As for the different role I think it is a possibility. As you say Jol definitley hinted he could play in the hole. However, at the moment I'd personally see it as a waste of time, as his striking of the ball and passing aren't upto it. To play in the hole you need to be able to pick a pass for the strikers or at least have a decent shot on you.


I think all in all Lennon is a difficult player to know what to do with. He has undoubted ability, but at the same time is plain shit in important areas of his game. He is fantastic (probably the best in the world) at beating players and getting to the line to pull the ball back. This will mean he will always create goals and his assist recored will be top notch. But, for long periods of games, his is next to useless. To be honest i think he'd get as many assists each season if he came of for 25 minutes at the end of the game, rather than started each game. When he comes on as a sub his pace is even more of a weapon as he is playing tired defenders. At the moment I don't see him as a 90 minute footballer, but as an impact sub. As a sub I think he could arguably be one of the best in the world. He is worth a place on the bench at every single club side in the world and very few players can say that. He is a tired fullbacks worst nightmare.

 

[eViL]

I half agree with you Joey.

(Disagree) Lennon CAN pass.

(Agree) But CANNOT strike a ball to cross or shoot.

SWP can do both and everything else that Lennon can do.

 

[double0]

Talk about writing a player off before time.

Lennon's still developing his game in the same fashion players such as Ronaldo, Rooney, Fabregas are still not quite the finished article.

Lennon has tremendous skill and pace, his very intelligent on the ball (not given enough credit IMO) and his vision in seeing a pass is very good. Yes I'd agree he needs to improve with his striking of the ball and more practice is needed on the final delivery. Other than that people have to be patient with him because he has great talent. IMO Lennon's (forgetting D Beckham) the best English winger followed very closely by SWP. The others in random order: A Young, Downing, Bentley, Pennant, Millner. I personally wouldn't choose over Aaron Lennon.

Bottom line we need a specialised left winger to have more balance within the squad.

 

[joey55]

I half agree with you Joey.

(Disagree) Lennon CAN pass.

(Agree) But CANNOT strike a ball to cross or shoot.

SWP can do both and everything else that Lennon can do.

There is passing and there is passing that is good enough for a player in the hole. Look at the players who play in that position and they will all be top passers of the ball. Lennon has a very limited passing range and I can't remember him ever showing any signs of having good vision Players who succeed in the hole tend to be those like Totti, Scholes, Bergkamp, Riquelme etc.

What people often ingore with lennon is that he is poor deffensively and that he doesn't involve himself in games enough. These are the 2 reason why at the moment I don't see him as a player I'd want to start games for us. I know there are a lot of people who aren't fans of stats, but some just can't be ignored. If you look at how many times Lennon touches the ball per game, compared to the other players who have played in wide positions for us, it shows he really isn't getting involved enough.

TT 58.6
Ghaly 55.9
Steed 55.7
Lennon 41.3

In terms of tracking back and tackling there is also clear evidence he isn't pulling his weight. Ball winning stats again show a big difference between him and the other 3.

TT 9.8
Steed 9.2
Ghaly 8.6
Lennon 5.4

I think we often forget that he is only 20 and still so inexperienced. We see him doing great things attacking wise and kind of forget that in many ways he is still well short of being ready for the Prem. Lets face it, the players he's been compared to are very average (by top 6 standards), yet in terms of getting involved with games and working for the team, they are miles ahead of Lennon. I think in many ways the signing of SWP could do wonders for Lennon. Mourinho simply wouldn't pick SWP until, like Joe Cole before him, he started to pull his weight for the team. I think competiton from a player who has a more developed allround game, could be just what Lennon needs. At the moment, he is our only real attacking threat down the flanks, so his place is pretty safe. Competition could be just what is needed to encourage him to take his game up a notch. People keep saying he's young and he'll learn, but i bet he'll learn a hell of a lot quicker when he has to fight for his place.

 

[soup]

I get the same impression about the Jol/Lennon relationship as you, but it is largelly fueled by ITK stuff, which is usually bullshit. But, there is something about Lennon that just makes me think he'd be a bit of a shit to manage. As for the different role I think it is a possibility. As you say Jol definitley hinted he could play in the hole. However, at the moment I'd personally see it as a waste of time, as his striking of the ball and passing aren't upto it. To play in the hole you need to be able to pick a pass for the strikers or at least have a decent shot on you.


I think all in all Lennon is a difficult player to know what to do with. He has undoubted ability, but at the same time is plain shit in important areas of his game. He is fantastic (probably the best in the world) at beating players and getting to the line to pull the ball back. This will mean he will always create goals and his assist recored will be top notch. But, for long periods of games, his is next to useless. To be honest i think he'd get as many assists each season if he came of for 25 minutes at the end of the game, rather than started each game. When he comes on as a sub his pace is even more of a weapon as he is playing tired defenders. At the moment I don't see him as a 90 minute footballer, but as an impact sub. As a sub I think he could arguably be one of the best in the world. He is worth a place on the bench at every single club side in the world and very few players can say that. He is a tired fullbacks worst nightmare.

The same. After seeing those pictures of him on nights out with his pout on you imagine he walks around Spurs like that too.

You can hardly blame him really though, he went from a young prospect to the replacement for the England captain and the answer to us winning the world cup in a year. If that was me I'd probably have to clamp my head a bit too.

SWP or Lennon? Well, we've got Lennon, but if we didn't who would you rather we went out and bought? SWP for 10 million or Lennon for 15-20 million? It's a very tricky one.

For the time being I'm still well happy we do have Lennon and this will be the season to judge him on in my eyes, he's got the measure of most players now and has got used to being doubled/tripled up on and should be working on his game over the summer accordingly. And to be fair, it was probably quite a change to get used to Chimbonda backing you up on the wing as opposed to Salty too.

He's also getting better players around him year on year and now will be the time to see if he can be a bit more consistent in his overall game. If the players we're buying these days start outperforming him week-in and week-out then we should start asking questions but if he keeps up with the progress and mentality of the current team and club in general then we've got no worries whatsoever.

I do get the feeling that SWP would seamlessly blend in
to most teams - including ours, a lot more than probably Lennon would but that in no way means he will be the better player eventually.

We really do just have to have both and just let dear old MJ worry about the man managment.

 

[Legend10]

i think that lenny is a better player than some people on here credit him for and i would take him over SWP any and every day.

Your stats are very interesting Joey especially the first ones about how many touches a player has and this to me highlights the problem not so much that Lenny has but one that we have as a team.

We simply do not get the ball to Lenny quickly enough or effectively enough. I find it no coincidence that lenny was far more productive for us when he played with Carrick. MC being a deep lying midfield player who has the range of passing to find Lenny accurately and more importantly early. Unfortunately last year we didn't have a player playing in that role who can pick these offensive passes and certainly not early enough. As a result of this lennon last season had to operate in far more confined areas. I sat right above the RW position and Lennons frustration at the slowness of his service was clear for everybody to see.

lennon is an out and out winger who works with pace as such the key to him is his supply and frankly last season the supply line to him was poor. If this area of our team could be rectified lennon would once again become a massive threat. If we play similarly in midfield to last season SWP is probably a better option but better still would be to find a defensive midfield player who has a good range of passing and let Lennon thrive.