Player Watch Player Watch: Giovani Lo Celso

[spursfan77]

Got stick from the FIFA / Football Manager dreamland brigade for suggesting this a a few weeks ago. Looks like the most recent ITK from Ali Z backs it up now

I think it was pretty obvious to those not stuck in dreamland. The big purchase was always Ndombele all along. He's the dembele replacement. Lo Celso the Eriksen one. I agree we need competition for eriksen but we aren't the kind of club to be able to buy a player for £70 million and have him rotating. If we buy a player for that much he's a starter. Ive been saying it since the day we were linked, it makes the most sense.

 

[Primativ]

I think it was pretty obvious to those not stuck in dreamland. The big purchase was always Ndombele all along. He's the dembele replacement. Lo Celso the Eriksen one. I agree we need competition for eriksen but we aren't the kind of club to be able to buy a player for £70 million and have him rotating. If we buy a player for that much he's a starter. Ive been saying it since the day we were linked, it makes the most sense.

I have to disagree with you, and here is why.

Poch said we need to show ambition, and do things differently. Do you honestly think spending 60 million to replace Dembele, which was already a must because we had a huge hole in the side, is showing ambition?

N'Dombele will be a fantastic buy, and it's a start, but seriously? I would be absolutely gobsmacked if that satisfies Poch's ambition.

Now if we were to sign GLC or another first team ready player on top of N'Dombele and all the kids we are going for, that would be a statement of intent for next season, but if all we are doing is looking to replace key players this summer, for example N'Dombele for Dembele, and GLC for Eriksen, sorry but we are being mugged off. Replacing key players isn't moving forward, it's standing still.

We need to strengthen not just replace. If after two windows with no signings, the extent of our transfer business is just buying replacements, that's really quite disappointing.

I don't believe it though, because I can't imagine after all the song and dancing Poch has been making about building a side to win the title, our transfer business will be limited to N'Dombele and some kids.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

I think it was pretty obvious to those not stuck in dreamland. The big purchase was always Ndombele all along. He's the dembele replacement. Lo Celso the Eriksen one. I agree we need competition for eriksen but we aren't the kind of club to be able to buy a player for £70 million and have him rotating. If we buy a player for that much he's a starter. Ive been saying it since the day we were linked, it makes the most sense.

Lots of people will disagree but I have to say I'm with you

 

[Timberwolf]

I think it was pretty obvious to those not stuck in dreamland. The big purchase was always Ndombele all along. He's the dembele replacement. Lo Celso the Eriksen one. I agree we need competition for eriksen but we aren't the kind of club to be able to buy a player for £70 million and have him rotating. If we buy a player for that much he's a starter. Ive been saying it since the day we were linked, it makes the most sense.

I wouldn't be surprised either way. We've been openly linked with GLC for a while and it's not like clubs are knocking our door down to buy Eriksen. Considering we're desperately lacking in creativity in CM/AM, and are giving Poch a big show of support, it's not out of the question that we'd try to bring in GLC for around 50 million and keep Eriksen.

On the other hand, the only other time we've spent comparatively big was when we sold Bale, so it would be pretty unheard of for Levy to spend 150 million (including Clarke, Sess, etc) without some serious outgoings. Bloody hope he does, though.

 

[Timberwolf]

Once upon a time Levy was happy to have 4 top* strikers on our books (Keane, Bent, Defoe, Berba) and about 6000 right backs. Would be nice to have an extra option in midfield for once rather than hoping we can fill a bench.



*We paid top money for Bent but he was a turd.

 

[spursfan77]

I have to disagree with you, and here is why.

Poch said we need to show ambition, and do things differently. Do you honestly think spending 60 million to replace Dembele, which was already a must because we had a huge hole in the side, is showing ambition?

N'Dombele will be a fantastic buy, and it's a start, but seriously? I would be absolutely gobsmacked if that satisfies Poch's ambition.

Now if we were to sign GLC or another first team ready player on top of N'Dombele and all the kids we are going for, that would be a statement of intent for next season, but if all we are doing is looking to replace key players this summer, for example N'Dombele for Dembele, and GLC for Eriksen, sorry but we are being mugged off. Replacing key players isn't moving forward, it's standing still.

We need to strengthen not just replace. If after two windows with no signings, the extent of our transfer business is just buying replacements, that's really quite disappointing.

I don't believe it though, because I can't imagine after all the song and dancing Poch has been making about building a side to win the title, our transfer business will be limited to N'Dombele and some kids.

I agree thanks for replying with your thoughts rather than just hitting disagree, but what does history tell you? I just have a hard time believing that’s what will happen. I want it to obviously and will be over the moon if things are done differently.

Let’s wait and see. Hopefully people won’t have to be deleting their disagrees.

 

[spursfan77]

Lots of people will disagree but I have to say I'm with you

Neither of us want to be right though obviously.

 

[worcestersauce]

If we buy Lo Celso why would we not start him? I don't quite get the rotation idea as him being a squad player but not first team, surely the point is that we will start different players in different games without dropping the quality which is where we've suffered previously, it's what title challengers do unless of course people think Poch and the the rest of the club don't want to challenge for titles.

 

[fishhhandaricecake]

I have to disagree with you, and here is why.

Poch said we need to show ambition, and do things differently. Do you honestly think spending 60 million to replace Dembele, which was already a must because we had a huge hole in the side, is showing ambition?

N'Dombele will be a fantastic buy, and it's a start, but seriously? I would be absolutely gobsmacked if that satisfies Poch's ambition.

Now if we were to sign GLC or another first team ready player on top of N'Dombele and all the kids we are going for, that would be a statement of intent for next season, but if all we are doing is looking to replace key players this summer, for example N'Dombele for Dembele, and GLC for Eriksen, sorry but we are being mugged off. Replacing key players isn't moving forward, it's standing still.

We need to strengthen not just replace. If after two windows with no signings, the extent of our transfer business is just buying replacements, that's really quite disappointing.

I don't believe it though, because I can't imagine after all the song and dancing Poch has been making about building a side to win the title, our transfer business will be limited to N'Dombele and some kids.

2000% spot on. Brilliant post sir.

 

[KingKay]

I think it was pretty obvious to those not stuck in dreamland. The big purchase was always Ndombele all along. He's the dembele replacement. Lo Celso the Eriksen one. I agree we need competition for eriksen but we aren't the kind of club to be able to buy a player for £70 million and have him rotating. If we buy a player for that much he's a starter. Ive been saying it since the day we were linked, it makes the most sense.

Some people are just saying what they want to see, rather than whats likely to happen.

 

[Timberwolf]

If we buy Lo Celso why would we not start him? I don't quite get the rotation idea as him being a squad player but not first team, surely the point is that we will start different players in different games without dropping the quality which is where we've suffered previously, it's what title challengers do unless of course people think Poch and the the rest of the club don't want to challenge for titles.

I think this is key. The very best teams (Fergie's Utd, current City) have almost always had great options in reserve, along with a few versatile journeymen, who are happy to rotate. Liverpool have started to add to their team in this way and have about 6 midfielders for 3 positions, and City have an embarrassment of riches in every position.

If we truly want to compete we should adopt that same mentality - we need a great first 11 but we also need some serious quality in the squad so we can adapt to our opponents and sustain challenges on multiple fronts. If Lo Celso were to only get 20-25 starts in the league in his first season would that be a disaster? It's probably no less than Bernardo Silva or Keita got in their first seasons and they weren't banging on the door asking to leave. Same goes for other players like Sissoko, Dier, Lucas - all hugely important but will have to accept they won't start every game. (If we go far in cups, each of them will get a shitload of game time regardless).

 

[Klinsmannesque]

If NDombele signs he's been sold on a project. If Poch commits he's been sold on a project. If Eriksen signs he's been sold on a project.

We require more than just the 1 big player (NDombele) as was pointed out that's just a replacement for Dembele (although be nice to have an integral CM that can play more than 60mins a week). I think we'll see 1 more, whether it be GLC or other - probably just waiting for Betis to drop their asking price to something a bit more realistic.

 

[spursfan77]

I think this is key. The very best teams (Fergie's Utd, current City) have almost always had great options in reserve, along with a few versatile journeymen, who are happy to rotate. Liverpool have started to add to their team in this way and have about 6 midfielders for 3 positions, and City have an embarrassment of riches in every position.

If we truly want to compete we should adopt that same mentality - we need a great first 11 but we also need some serious quality in the squad so we can adapt to our opponents and sustain challenges on multiple fronts. If Lo Celso were to only get 20-25 starts in the league in his first season would that be a disaster? It's probably no less than Bernardo Silva or Keita got in their first seasons and they weren't banging on the door asking to leave. Same goes for other players like Sissoko, Dier, Lucas - all hugely important but will have to accept they won't start every game. (If we go far in cups, each of them will get a shitload of game time regardless).

Definitely and it’s what any manager would want. Let’s hope poch is given what he wants, else I suspect he won’t be here in 12 months time.

 

[Timberwolf]

If NDombele signs he's been sold on a project. If Poch commits he's been sold on a project. If Eriksen signs he's been sold on a project.

We require more than just the 1 big player (NDombele) as was pointed out that's just a replacement for Dembele (although be nice to have an integral CM that can play more than 60mins a week). I think we'll see 1 more, whether it be GLC or other - probably just waiting for Betis to drop their asking price to something a bit more realistic.

Hopefully it's a deal where the ol' Levy brinksmanship pays off. The money Betis want at the moment is ridiculous, but the most they have ever received for a player (by some distance) is 27 million, so you'd imagine they'd want to get a deal done. If he went off the boil or got a serious injury they'd be throwing away one hell of a pay cheque.

 

[worcestersauce]

The fact that the club has gone balls deep for the calibre of a player like Ndombele whilst also trying to buy Lo Celso shows that something is different, this isn't the old Spurs, actually it's more like the very old Spurs.

 

[Dillspur]

Hopefully it's a deal where the ol' Levy brinksmanship pays off. The money Betis want at the moment is ridiculous, but the most they have ever received for a player (by some distance) is 27 million, so you'd imagine they'd want to get a deal done. If he went off the boil or got a serious injury they'd be throwing away one hell of a pay cheque.

Why do people keep using this as some sort of argument? It makes zero sense

 

[Timberwolf]

Why do people keep using this as some sort of argument? It makes zero sense

Admittedly it's an inflated market, but mid table Spanish clubs make far less than their English equivalents. Turning down a potential offer of 50 million+ could have massive ramifications for them if Lo Celso got injured or had an awful season. I used the 27 million sale as an example of how rare these opportunities might be for a club like Betis.

They might see if differently but I think it's a fair argument.

 

[amathews3416]

Admittedly it's an inflated market, but mid table Spanish clubs make far less than their English equivalents. Turning down a potential offer of 50 million+ could have massive ramifications for them if Lo Celso got injured or had an awful season. I used the 27 million sale as an example of how rare these opportunities might be for a club like Betis.

They might see if differently but I think it's a fair argument.

Say they accept a bid of say 60 million euros.

They bought the player for 25 million total. PSG has 20% of next sale.
60 million - 25 million - 12 million (20% of 60) for a profit of 23 million.

That is less than their record transfer and not nearly enough for a club viewing this potential transfer as a way to rebuild their squad.

Just don’t see them budging on price like you think.

 

[The Lion]

I think it was pretty obvious to those not stuck in dreamland. The big purchase was always Ndombele all along. He's the dembele replacement. Lo Celso the Eriksen one. I agree we need competition for eriksen but we aren't the kind of club to be able to buy a player for £70 million and have him rotating. If we buy a player for that much he's a starter. Ive been saying it since the day we were linked, it makes the most sense.

Our current record signing isn't our first choice CB. Not every purchase has to translate to instant and automatic starter in every match.

 

[stewartd]

Say they accept a bid of say 60 million euros.

They bought the player for 25 million total. PSG has 20% of next sale.
60 million - 25 million - 12 million (20% of 60) for a profit of 23 million.

That is less than their record transfer and not nearly enough for a club viewing this potential transfer as a way to rebuild their squad.

Just don’t see them budging on price like you think.