Interesting Article on AVBs 'Failure' at Chelsea

[StartingPrice]

AVB was not the right man for Chelsea, too young, too inexperienced
though he had had great success with an established team
that just needed pointing in the same direction as they were already facing.
At Chelsea he was brought in to reorganise and re-direct
and lacked the authority and ultimately the backing to do it.

Much more suited to Spurs who are a younger 1) quad
with 2) much more amenable older pro's and not too many of them either.
3) I believe that VDV was sacrificed to enable the manager to stamp his authority on the team
and the key players now are young or new (Sandro, Caulker, Vertonghen, Dembele, Sigurdsson,
Walker, Bale, Lennon) all keen to make their mark under a young, positive and creative manager.
The older players are 'nice guys' and unlikely to challenge his authority, Dawson, Friedel, or are out injured,
Parker, Adabeyor and Benny.

4) Defoe is so desperate to play that he would play naked if the manager ordered it,
and if the FA would allow it.

Imagine a young manager coming in and meeting up with Terry, Lampard, and Cole.

Jimmy, lyrical as ever

1)

2)And older pros who haven't had a great deal of top level success, by and large.

3) Maybe.

4) Especially if there were boschable women in the crowd (allegedly)

 

[JimmyG2]

There's one exception to the above: William Gallas. Older player (older than AVB), history of being very difficult and (I think) was at Chelsea during AVB's first stint there as scout. Yet he seems very happy and motivated at the moment.

Shrewdly made captain by AVB ( along with several others at various times of course).
He is also not a long term Tottenham player having been at Arsenal and Chelsea itself of course.
He is at the very end of his career and probably grateful to be picked ahead of younger candidates..
AVB has dealt well with the individuals in the squad having learn't some vital lessons at Chelsea.

 

[BK007]

The clown players at Chelsea are classless jokes. If things go south with di Matteo, Lampard, Terry and Cole are still there to cause havoc even with the fucking disgrace gone to collect his payday in China.

Hope we deflate their egos in the next couple of weeks.

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

I think it is very difficult in any form of life to go from a relatively junior role within an organisation, leave and come back as the boss in such a short period of time like AVB did at Chelsea. It obviously doesn't work in football and I'd like to think this would be the same at any other high profile business.
AVB "so called" failure was down to circumstance more than lack of ability. Hopefully he'll go on to prove doubters wrong at Spurs and be a unmittigated success.

 

[StartingPrice]

I think it is very difficult in any form of life to go from a relatively junior role within an organisation, leave and come back as the boss in such a short period of time like AVB did at Chelsea. It obviously doesn't work in football and I'd like to think this would be the same at any other high profile business.
AVB "so called" failure was down to circumstance more than lack of ability. Hopefully he'll go on to prove doubters wrong at Spurs and be a unmittigated success.

I think that is one of the most important aspects of the whole thing. if he had done it after a decade of sustained managerial success, when all of the playing staff, more-or-less, had changed, I don't think there would have been the same problem at all. I mean, these players, used to winning trophies, looked upon the guy as Mourinho's gopher...adn we all know how close their relationship with hose-A was.

If I was going to be concerned about anything, it would be that AVB showed a certain lack of judgement in taking the job - but I can also understand why he did.

 

[WestBelfast Spurs]

the press hate us a club and with a mangaer that "failed" at the scum people are gonna hate us more, i say bring it the fuck on bitches

 

[SNAFU_Clarke]

villas boas failed at chelsea. there is no need for a debate about it. he was appointed just over 15 months ago. if he hadn't failed he would still be there.

 

[Blackcanary]

villas boas failed at chelsea. there is no need for a debate about it. he was appointed just over 15 months ago. if he hadn't failed he would still be there.

I think you're missing out on the 'discussion' element of a forum there!

I don't any of us are saying he didn't fail at Chelsea - but what's interesting and relevant to us is WHY he did and what he's changed thus far at Spurs to stop history repeating itself.

 

[SNAFU_Clarke]

I don't any of us are saying he didn't fail at Chelsea

a few have posted "failed" and "so called failure" in regards to villas boas at chelsea. a brief scroll up the thread indicates 2 people who are seemingly quite happy to call into question the notion of villas boas failure at chelsea.

 

[brasil_spur]

a few have posted "failed" and "so called failure" in regards to villas boas at chelsea. a brief scroll up the thread indicates 2 people who are seemingly quite happy to call into question the notion of villas boas failure at chelsea.

But in many peoples eyes he wasn't given the chance to succeed, that's different to failing.

Who knows, he could have concievably done what RdM in the final weeks of the season, there's no way of knowing for sure.

I think it's hard to call it a failure when the whole season hasn't been played out. There are too many 'ifs' and 'buts' - i agree that if they hadn't qualified for the CL under a full AVB season then he would have been a failure, but he wasn't given the chance to show whether that would have been the case or not.

 

[SNAFU_Clarke]

i genuinely cannot see how anyone could really deem his time at chelsea as anything other than a failure. there again there are plenty that claim redknapp failed last season in finishing fourth so i dare say i shouldn't really be surprised.

villas boas failing at chelsea doesn't mean he will fail with us by the way. i can isolate and compartmentalise the two separate managerial stints. i'm just of the belief that if a club pays off another club's contract for their manager to the tune of several million pounds and then sacks that manager 9 months later, you can be pretty sure he's going down in history as having failed.

 

[brasil_spur]

i genuinely cannot see how anyone could really deem his time at chelsea as anything other than a failure. there again there are plenty that claim redknapp failed last season in finishing fourth so i dare say i shouldn't really be surprised.

villas boas failing at chelsea doesn't mean he will fail with us by the way. i can isolate and compartmentalise the two separate managerial stints. i'm just of the belief that if a club pays off another club's contract for their manager to the tune of several million pounds and then sacks that manager 9 months later, you can be pretty sure he's going down in history as having failed.

That's far too simplistic a look at things though.

Ramos gets touted as one of our biggest managerial failures ever and yet he's the only manager to have won us any silverware in more than a decade. In fact he is one of only 4 managers to have achieved European qualification with us in 20 years.

Things aren't so black and white, yes AVB didn't succeed at Chelsea, but he wasn't given the opportunity to succeed, or to fail for that matter.

 

[SNAFU_Clarke]

That's far too simplistic a look at things though.

it really isn't.

juande ramos' performance as spurs manager has no bearing/relevance to the discussion at hand. i'm not interested in expanding the parameters of the discussion for obvious reasons. the thread is about villas boas' period as chelsea manager.

 

[nightgoat]

i genuinely cannot see how anyone could really deem his time at chelsea as anything other than a failure. there again there are plenty that claim redknapp failed last season in finishing fourth so i dare say i shouldn't really be surprised.

That depends on whether the target at the start of the season was to finish fourth in the league or to qualify for the Champions League.

 

[SNAFU_Clarke]

do you think villas boas failed at chelsea? for the sake of argument, let's suggest that success/failure is binary. you either succeed or you fail.

 

[nightgoat]

do you think villas boas failed at chelsea? for the sake of argument, let's suggest that success/failure is binary. you either succeed or you fail.

It's not, though.

 

[SNAFU_Clarke]

ok. i think he failed at chelsea. i also think it's pretty cut and dried and no amount of revisionism can really change it. i also think if he'd gone back to portugal or off to italy and not pitched up at whl, quite a lot of those people claiming caveats and grey areas would be saying, 'yeah, he failed in england though', when asked about him. just my view of course.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

It's not, though.

This is the point.

You have to judge based on a multitude of criteria and that criteria will alter slightly (or loads) for everyone from Abramovich to media to fans.

Massively over symplistic to put it into binary terms. DiMateo took them down the league compared to AVB and had a worse ppg than AVB. What does that suggest, that AVB was a success ? It suggests to me that AVB certainly didn't get everything right but he had some difficult circumstances to over come (an ageing squad whose ego had surpassed it's footballing ability being the biggest, along with trying to change a regime and methodology) and was not given the realistic time to be judged earnestly.

AVB had and probably still has failings. Redknapp is out of a job because of his, but I wouldn't call his tenure a failure or say he "failed at Spurs" simply because he got sacked.

 

[brasil_spur]

it really isn't.

juande ramos' performance as spurs manager has no bearing/relevance to the discussion at hand. i'm not interested in expanding the parameters of the discussion for obvious reasons. the thread is about villas boas' period as chelsea manager.

Oh dear, what a great debater you are.....

I could pick dozens of other managerial examples, just Ramos is one that most people here know a lot about and so seemed sensible.

But my point is very valid. You want to label AVB with a cleart cut black and white definition, that's just not possible, for the reasons i've laid out.

But yes if you want a very simplistic one word description of AVB's level of success at Chelsea then you could use the word failure and not be incorrect in what you are saying.

 

[brasil_spur]

do you think villas boas failed at chelsea? for the sake of argument, let's suggest that success/failure is binary. you either succeed or you fail.

You have a LOT to learn in life my friend. There are so many in between possibilities.