Tanguy Ndombele - The £63m problem Daniel Levy needs Jose Mourinho to solve

[ero1x]

He has not been as Mourinho is claiming. Mourinho is using him to deflect how bad his tactics were in the first half. I gave Mourinho a chance even though I never wanted him. Jose proved how bad a manager he was when we played Chelsea at home. Now he is using excuse of injuries, then why were we so bad over the Christmas period.

So, do you feel Ndombele has done well since his arrival?

 

[whitesocks]

The point is though that he's not the only manager that will call out a player publicly if he doesn't feel that they are playing to their ability.

Yes, and it is better the manager calls out the player before the fans get frustrated with him themselves.
Rose never forgave us for being critical about him in the early days when he would not track back.

 

[Shadydan]

With all due respect Sheffield Utd players arent a bunch of well paid prima donnas are they? Its the 100k a week internationals that dont take kindly to be publicly slagged imo.
I'm basing this on what happened at Chelsea and then Man U and also what I've experienced in life. Nobody likes a public slating. Get called into the office and bollocked, fine, and of course people respond differently but I cant imagine anyone in any walk of life improving and putting in more effort after your boss basically says your fkin useless in front of everyone. Its unprofessional.
We'll see.

I knew someone would make an excuse like this as if Sheff Utd aren't a Premier League team...so players earning over a certain amount are immune to public criticism are they? That's a new one lol.

 

[HedgieSpur]

What would have been refreshing and less odious would have been if Jose OWNED his part in the first half debacle and said "I set them up incorrectly in the first half but I rectified it at half time and in the second half our shape was better".

That would have been the managerial and honourable thing to do. He could then have addressed Ndombele separately and privately.

 

[Metalhead]

He has not been as Mourinho is claiming. Mourinho is using him to deflect how bad his tactics were in the first half. I gave Mourinho a chance even though I never wanted him. Jose proved how bad a manager he was when we played Chelsea at home. Now he is using excuse of injuries, then why were we so bad over the Christmas period.

You never wanted him? You kept that quiet.

 

[Metalhead]

What would have been refreshing and less odious would have been if Jose OWNED his part in the first half debacle and said "I set them up incorrectly in the first half but I rectified it at half time and in the second half our shape was better".

That would have been the managerial and honourable thing to do. He could then have addressed Ndombele separately and privately.

Come on - all he did was say that Ndombele needs to step up. If it works then it's done everyone a favour and if it doesn't then Mourinho can be judged accordingly. You're right - he could have admitted that he got it wrong with the first half but managers, to my recall, rarely categorically come out and say "I got it wrong with my tactics".

 

[HedgieSpur]

Come on - all he did was say that Ndombele needs to step up. If it works then it's done everyone a favour and if it doesn't then Mourinho can be judged accordingly. You're right - he could have admitted that he got it wrong with the first half but managers, to my recall, rarely categorically come out and say "I got it wrong with my tactics".

It was unnecessary and it came across as petty. Most of the team were poor in that first half. Lloris didn't hold onto the shot and Dier's header back into danger was ill advised. To single out one player comes across as him having an agenda.

 

[Gassin's finest]

Poch did say it'd take a season or two before you saw his peak.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

Ndombele has clearly been disappointing all season. But in his defence yesterday, having 5 defenders behind & a defensive mid next to him, with 3 ‘forwards’ 40 yards ahead didn’t half make it difficult for him.

Shocking, shocking line up. I have no problem with 3 centre halves but for fucks sake play wing backs, not 2 more centre halves as full backs.

In the teams defence first half, it must have been difficult being a defender with no protection or no pressing straight ahead of you, and difficult being an attacker with no supporting passes or runs from the midfield.

 

[Metalhead]

It was unnecessary and it came across as petty. Most of the team were poor in that first half. Lloris didn't hold onto the shot and Dier's header back into danger was ill advised. To single out one player comes across as him having an agenda.

It wasn't petty and it wasn't due to one game and much as Lloris does make howlers at times, he's already proven his worth over the last few seasons so I can't really agree on that one.

 

[double0]

In the teams defence first half, it must have been difficult being a defender with no protection or no pressing straight ahead of you, and difficult being an attacker with no supporting passes or runs from the midfield.

Thats just not true. Skipp and Ndombele were pressing but had no width because of the 5 CB's played in a straight line across the back. On a serious note watch that first half again...Mourinho has a history of isolating players and I hoped he'd learnt from before.

 

[Hakkz]

He has not been as Mourinho is claiming. Mourinho is using him to deflect how bad his tactics were in the first half. I gave Mourinho a chance even though I never wanted him. Jose proved how bad a manager he was when we played Chelsea at home. Now he is using excuse of injuries, then why were we so bad over the Christmas period.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

Thats just not true. Skipp and Ndombele were pressing but had no width because of the 5 CB's played in a straight line across the back. On a serious note watch that first half again...Mourinho has a history of isolating players and I hoped he'd learnt from before.

Anti-Mourinho's love this narrative that the 9 other players didn't do Ndombele any favours. The entire fucking rest of the team is to blame, in other words. In a team sport. That makes sense.

 

[HedgieSpur]

It wasn't petty and it wasn't due to one game and much as Lloris does make howlers at times, he's already proven his worth over the last few seasons so I can't really agree on that one.

Lloris has made MULTIPLE howlers and his "proven worth" is irrelevant to treating players equitably. Its poor man management from Jose, intended to deflect from what was another poor set up by him. I like Jose, but on this occasion I can't slavishly ignore that his man management on this occasion is lacking.

 

[Shadydan]

Lloris has made MULTIPLE howlers and his "proven worth" is irrelevant to treating players equitably. Its poor man management from Jose, intended to deflect from what was another poor set up by him. I like Jose, but on this occasion I can't slavishly ignore that his man management on this occasion is lacking.

This is nonsense, Lloris does make mistakes but his general application has always been first class.

Why is it so hard for people to understand - Ndombele isn't applying himself, he's seemingly doing the bare minimum...is it so much to ask a professional footballer just to put some work in and TRY?

Last week against Wolves this whole place and Spurs fans were up in arms for his performance and in particular that viral clip of him practically letting Neto go past him without even bothering to make a tackle, it was pathetic defending and our fans were pissed off - Mourinho could and should have called him out on it but ignored it. You can bet your bottom dollar that words were exchanged behind closed doors and you would hope for a reaction against Burnley, we didn't get one so NATURALLY this is the next step.

We're in a situation where everyone need to pull together, we are in a massive funk right now where we've lost two of our best attackers, injuries galore and we are shipping in goals left right and centre, we need everyone to show some fight, Ndombele is a a player who clearly is talented but needs to buck his ideas up because he's currently doing the bare minimum - there's just no excuses now.

This forced narrative about Jose just needs to stop, just because he's wrongly called out players in the past doesn't mean on this occasion he's in the wrong, he is 100% in the right on this occasion.

 

[HedgieSpur]

This is nonsense, Lloris does make mistakes but his general application has always been first class.

Why is it so hard for people to understand - Ndombele isn't applying himself, he's seemingly doing the bare minimum...is it so much to ask a professional footballer just to put some work in and TRY?

Last week against Wolves this whole place and Spurs fans were up in arms for his performance against Wolves and in particular that viral clip of him practically letting Neto go past him without even bothering to make a tackle, it was pathetic defending and our fans were pissed off - Mourinho could and should have called him out on it but ignored it. You can bet your bottom dollar that words were exchanged behind closed doors and you would hope for a reaction against Burnley, we didn't get one so NATURALLY this is the next step.

We're in a situation where everyone need to pull together, we are in a massive funk right now where we've lost two of our best attackers, injuries galore and we are shipping in goals left right and centre, we need everyone to show some fight, Ndombele is a a player who clearly is talented but needs to buck his ideas up because he's currently doing the bare minimum - there's just no excuses now.

You completely miss the point. Ndombele's lack of application isn't at issue. What is at issue is the scapegoating of a single player in what was a dreadful first half performance. I was at the game (unfortunately) and none of those players in the first half were particularly great (aside from Skipp). As I said earlier, its lazy, petty and dreadful management to take plaudits for a collective but publicly single out a player for criticism. Doesn't work in commerce and sure as hell doesn't work long term in sport.

 

[Shadydan]

You completely miss the point. Ndombele's lack of application isn't at issue. What is at issue is the scapegoating of a single player in what was a dreadful first half performance. I was at the game (unfortunately) and none of those players in the first half were particularly great (aside from Skipp). As I said earlier, its lazy, petty and dreadful management to take plaudits for a collective but publicly single out a player for criticism. Doesn't work in commerce and sure as hell doesn't work long term in sport.

Nope - you're missing the point- it's not about this match alone, it's about his general application since he's been with us and in particular his application last week. Look at his reaction to this incident against Wolves last week, he wanted to say something and refrained from saying anything and just laughed it off.

He praised practically every other player - if it was down to man management he would be criticizing and calling out Sanchez for example who had a terrible match by his standards.

Players should want to self improve, any professional footballer would see that clip and be embarrassed and WANT to better themselves - if they can't at least do that then they're at the wrong club, playing at the wrong level.

 

[Metalhead]

Lloris has made MULTIPLE howlers and his "proven worth" is irrelevant to treating players equitably. Its poor man management from Jose, intended to deflect from what was another poor set up by him. I like Jose, but on this occasion I can't slavishly ignore that his man management on this occasion is lacking.

I'm not slavishly ignoring it. I just assume that he has made a calculated decision that calling him out might inspire a positive reaction out of him. If it fails to have the desired effect and he fails to take it into consideration on future occasions then he'll rightly be judged on that and everything else that falls within his remit. The point I was making with Lloris is that yes, he has made howlers but he has also proved himself on many occasions in the past whereas so far Ndombele has failed to get going. I think that Ndombele will get going and will prove a success at the club.

 

[max cady]

For me neither Jose or Tanguy are not to blame, for me it is the club. For me this going back a fair bit. We stumbled and staggered our way to a champs lge final and I for one believe Poch would have been done long before that if we had not got to the final. Results were poor for a long time. We had a summer where we bought some good players what we didn't do was address the areas that needed addressing. Trippier leaves no back-up plan, we rely on KWP & Aurier, Eriksen makes it clear he leaving and we mess about with that saga. We let Llorente & Janssen go with no replacement. We are the only club in the top 8 without a proper back-up striker, no top club in Europe battles on as many fronts as we do without a back-up striker. And we wonder why Kane gets injured more now than ever. We then move on to January and we lose Kane again and we don't secure a striker, Utd lost Rashford and they secured one so why couldn't we. Okay so we got Fernandes (the wrong one) and Stevie Wonder but neither are back-up strikers. Parrott is 18 and not the answer I have seen nothing at senior level to convince me he's the answer. We were challenging top 4, still in the FA cup and had a pretty good draw in champs lge when we lost Kane and we done nothing about it. We can't rely on Son, Lucas & Dele. Son got injured but even he hasn't been on it for a while and Lucas & Dele have not been at the races all season. We never field a settled side, Verts & Toby were our established centre halves but we now see Verts & Sanchez, Sanchez & Toby, Dier & Sanchez and when they play they seem lost/frightened/short of confidence. Our midfield is non-existent at times. Poch's tactics went horribly wrong long before he left and Jose doesn't seem to be able to do much better. Will Jose be given money to sort it out for another 5 year project. I can only imagine he agreed to join us because he knew he would get the money to spend I just hope he spends it wisely and takes us back to where we where 2/3 years ago pushing for the league and regular champs lge participants.

I for one enjoy the Tues/Wed football and hate the Thursday football but the rate we are going at we will not even be playing on Thursdays.

 

[HedgieSpur]

I'm not slavishly ignoring it. I just assume that he has made a calculated decision that calling him out might inspire a positive reaction out of him. If it fails to have the desired effect and he fails to take it into consideration on future occasions then he'll rightly be judged on that and everything else that falls within his remit. The point I was making with Lloris is that yes, he has made howlers but he has also proved himself on many occasions in the past whereas so far Ndombele has failed to get going. I think that Ndombele will get going and will prove a success at the club.

Cool. Lets agree to disagree. We both hope for the same thing nonetheless