Spurs v Liverpool (1st Team)

[Dan Yeats]

So you think Downing is better than Bale, and Lucas is better than Sandro?

You've misread the post.

I forgot to delete the DM bit (will do so now), but all the other comments are my edits.

 

[shaqTHFC]

You've misread the post.

I forgot to delete the DM bit (will do so now), but all the other comments are my edits.

Oh right lol. My mistake. I disagree about Gomes though. Reina is definitely the better all round keeper. Gomes' clowning was more than occasional last year unfortunately.

 

[Legacy]

Only player Liverpool have who'd be a significant upgrade on our first team is Suarez, that pretty much says it all for me.

Assou-Ekotto, Modric, Bale, Van der Vaart, Sandro, Lennon and Kranjcar would all strengthen Liverpool considerably, in my opinion.

 

[SpurSince57]

Take Carroll out and you're there

As Wes Brown did this afternoon?

 

[OmarsComing]

A lot of white and navy tinted glasses in this thread. Hard to believe that people think that Walker>Johnson and Gomes>Reina

Reina

Johnson Gallas King BAE

Gerrard Modric Sandro

Suarez Carroll Bale​

 

[Brewster]

Lets be honest Downing was quality last season and more productive than Lennon. Although if we had a striker it would probably be a different story.

 

[Marty]

A lot of white and navy tinted glasses in this thread. Hard to believe that people think that Walker>Johnson and Gomes>Reina

Agree that people preferring Gomes over Reina is madness, but for my money Corluka massively >>>>>> Johnson, I want my full-backs to be able to defend, thank you very much. Walker I haven't seen enough of tbh, but he can't be a worse defender than Johnson.

 

[SpurSince57]

A lot of white and navy tinted glasses in this thread. Hard to believe that people think that Walker>Johnson and Gomes>Reina

Reina

Johnson Gallas King BAE

Gerrard Modric Sandro

Suarez Carroll Bale​

Gomes' shot-to-save ratio last season was rather better than Reina's, I believe. I agree that anyone who believes Walker to be better than Johnson is off his chump, because unless we have a lot of closet Villa fans in here I don't know what they're basing it on. Come to that, I don't know why they're assuming Walker, rather than Corluka, will be first choice.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

A lot of white and navy tinted glasses in this thread. Hard to believe that people think that Walker>Johnson and Gomes>Reina

I agree about Johnson. Many of those advocating the prospects of Walker would probably slag off Johnson, yet Johnson is exactly the player that Walker aspires to be. Johnson was actually much better than Walker even at the same stage, which is why he was one of the first first purchases at Chelsea's Abramovich era.

 

[Dan Yeats]

A lot of white and navy tinted glasses[/CENTER]

Yep, but I like them.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Last week we were talking about how commentators apply their cliches to players. Defoe "looks sharp" was the one that caught a few peoples attention.

I said another one is Gomes. When he came and didn't get much on a cross it was "Gomes came and flapped at that" but if another top keeper did the same it wouldn't be called in such a derisory way. Today in the 42nd minute of the Liverpool game Reina comes for and completely misses a cross. The commentary: "Reina was struggling a bit there".

It's subtle but the emphasis is slightly different and more derogatory. It helps perpetrates the perception, when the reality is that they all make big howlers.

 

[SpurSince57]

Well, there are no two ways about it, when Gomes fucks up he really fucks up. I simply don't believe there's another keeper in the EPL who could save a penalty and then give another away 30 seconds later. That's Gomes.

However, only a few keepers had a better shot-to-save ratio last season, and Reina wasn't one of them. In fact, over the years, even on MOTD I've seen Reina make an awful lot of flaps. He's a very good keeper, but better than Gomes? I don't think so.

 

[OmarsComing]

If you created a poll on any non spurs forum, I'm certain that at least 80% of people would consider that Reina and Johnson are better footballers than Gomes and Walker.

So it doesnt matter how many stats you pull out of the bag or how many MOTD howlers you saw Reina make, Reina is definitely the better keeper.

If tomorrow both Reina and Gomes were put onto the transfer market who would command the higher transfer fee?

We would be lucky to get £5-10million for Gomes, where as Reina would fetch at least £15-20million

 

[sloth]

If you created a poll on any non spurs forum, I'm certain that at least 80% of people would consider that Reina and Johnson are better footballers than Gomes and Walker.

So it doesnt matter how many stats you pull out of the bag or how many MOTD howlers you saw Reina make, Reina is definitely the better keeper.

If tomorrow both Reina and Gomes were put onto the transfer market who would command the higher transfer fee?

We would be lucky to get £5-10million for Gomes, where as Reina would fetch at least £15-20million

This is true, I think even amongst Spurs fans the majority would think Reina is superior. Put it this way, if Reina suddenly came on the market and announced the only club he wanted to play for was Spurs, would people want to sign him? And once here would you want to play him?

On the Johnson thing I'm torn, it's not that I massively rate Corluka just I've never really taken to Johnson and he doesn't link up well with Lennon at all.

Anyway, my tuppence worth (seeing as we're in fantasy land:- 3-5-3):

Reina
King Skrtel Gallas
Johnson ___Sandro___ Bale
Modric Gerard
VdV (Carrol)
Suarez​

 

[Dan Yeats]

I said another one is Gomes. When he came and didn't get much on a cross it was "Gomes came and flapped at that" but if another top keeper did the same it wouldn't be called in such a derisory way. Today in the 42nd minute of the Liverpool game Reina comes for and completely misses a cross. The commentary: "Reina was struggling a bit there".

That's exactly what struck me at the time too.

If that had been Gomes, then MOTD would have been crucifying him, and many on here would have followed their lead.

That largely answers Omarscoming's post IMO.

 

[brett.spurs]

Skrtel :grin:

 

[KalSpur]

The Liverpool players I'd like to have at Spurs (in order of preference):

1. Suarez
2. Reina
3. Downing
4. Carrol

Not that interested in the rest.

 

[kishman]

In terms of like for like players.

Gomes < Reina
Corluka > Johnson
King > Carragher
Dawson > Dawson
Ekotto > Enrqiue
Modric > Adam
Sandro > Henderson
Bale > Downing
Suarez > Defoe
Carroll > Crouch

 

[Dan Yeats]

The Liverpool players I'd like to have at Spurs (in order of preference):

1. Suarez
2. Reina
3. Downing
4. Carrol

Not that interested in the rest.

I'd like 1 and 4. Objectively, I know 3 would improve us on the RW, but I just don't like him. I think the years and years of speculation about him joining us ended up pissing me off and biasing me against him.

Out of those, the top of my list would be Carrol. He's not a footballing genius, but he has what we're missing.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

If you created a poll on any non spurs forum, I'm certain that at least 80% of people would consider that Reina and Johnson are better footballers than Gomes and Walker.

So it doesnt matter how many stats you pull out of the bag or how many MOTD howlers you saw Reina make, Reina is definitely the better keeper.

If tomorrow both Reina and Gomes were put onto the transfer market who would command the higher transfer fee?

We would be lucky to get £5-10million for Gomes, where as Reina would fetch at least £15-20million

This is true, I think even amongst Spurs fans the majority would think Reina is superior. Put it this way, if Reina suddenly came on the market and announced the only club he wanted to play for was Spurs, would people want to sign him? And once here would you want to play him?

Omar, but it does matter, because what you are actually talking about is perspective and opinion, not facts. You say it doesn't matter how many stats people pull out, but it should, as Sloth has said previously in other threads why close your mind to all evidence, and as SS has pointed out Gomes save ratio is better than Reina's. And visual evidence says that in fact they both make blunders and if you take blunders out then Gomes possibly does all other things as well if not better than Reina.

What you have to establish conclusively is that it is not the weight of media and mis-informed exaggeration of the negative cost or actual positive gain that effects your perception, if facts and stats and other evidence suggests that Gomes might be at least as good as Reina.

West Broms first goal today was a blunder by ManU's new expensive keeper. I wonder if he'll become a figure of ridicule for the media ?