Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[TOLBINY]

You can just imagine the post match presser if we lose to Palace - "yeah look like I've said there are no easy games in this league mate, we weren't expecting the 8-1-1 low block and struggled to break them down first half, second half I thought we were better, but then you know, they've got the new manager bounce and we get caught on the break for their first goal and after that when you are chasing the game you are always vulnerable to conceding a second counter attack goal. But we are only 8 months into our process, Palace have had two whole weeks with their new manager, look mathematically we can still win the league so we'll keep going"

 

[dontcallme]

You can just imagine the post match presser if we lose to Palace - "yeah look like I've said there are no easy games in this league mate, we weren't expecting the 8-1-1 low block and struggled to break them down first half, second half I thought we were better, but then you know, they've got the new manager bounce and we get caught on the break for their first goal and after that when you are chasing the game you are always vulnerable to conceding a second counter attack goal. But we are only 8 months into our process, Palace have had two whole weeks with their new manager, look mathematically we can still win the league so we'll keep going"

Are you criticising him for something he hasn't said in response to a game that hasn't yet happened?

 

[RuskyM]

You can just imagine the post match presser if we lose to Palace - "yeah look like I've said there are no easy games in this league mate, we weren't expecting the 8-1-1 low block and struggled to break them down first half, second half I thought we were better, but then you know, they've got the new manager bounce and we get caught on the break for their first goal and after that when you are chasing the game you are always vulnerable to conceding a second counter attack goal. But we are only 8 months into our process, Palace have had two whole weeks with their new manager, look mathematically we can still win the league so we'll keep going"

I know you're being sarky, but I've got to be honest: I'm not sure what your underlying point is.

 

[Styopa]

Are you criticising him for something he hasn't said in response to a game that hasn't yet happened?

It doesn’t matter. Most of the same criticisms will probably levelled regardless of the outcome of the match or how we play, win lose or, draw:

“too open”; “so defensively naive”; “won’t win anything playing like that” “will be slaughtered when we come up against someone decent”; “lucky we have Vic”; “lucky we have vdV”; “not sustainable”; “I hope I’m wrong, but I just don’t see it with Johnson” ; “teams have worked us out“; academy players must be wondering what they have to do to get a game”…

 

[easley91]

You can just imagine the post match presser if we lose to Palace - "yeah look like I've said there are no easy games in this league mate, we weren't expecting the 8-1-1 low block and struggled to break them down first half, second half I thought we were better, but then you know, they've got the new manager bounce and we get caught on the break for their first goal and after that when you are chasing the game you are always vulnerable to conceding a second counter attack goal. But we are only 8 months into our process, Palace have had two whole weeks with their new manager, look mathematically we can still win the league so we'll keep going"

 

[easley91]

It doesn’t matter. Most of the same criticisms will probably levelled regardless of the outcome of the match or how we play, win lose or, draw:

“too open”; “so defensively naive”; “won’t win anything playing like that” “will be slaughtered when we come up against someone decent”; “lucky we have Vic”; “lucky we have vdV”; “not sustainable”; “I hope I’m wrong, but I just don’t see it with Johnson” ; “teams have worked us out“; academy players must be wondering what they have to do to get a game”…

The too open and defensively naive stuff make me laugh. After 10 games and before going down v Chelsea, we conceded 9 goals in 10 games (at that point the joint 3rd best defensive record in the league with Liverpool playing the exact same style we do now).

Chelsea we conceded 4 (the majority with 9 men). Then we had a makeshift CB pairing and midfield. We just haven't had a settled side since that Chelsea game for one reason or another and that hasn't helped.

 

[RuskyM]

The too open and defensively naive stuff make me laugh. After 10 games and before going down v Chelsea, we conceded 9 goals in 10 games (at that point the joint 3rd best defensive record in the league with Liverpool playing the exact same style we do now).

Chelsea we conceded 4 (the majority with 9 men). Then we had a makeshift CB pairing and midfield. We just haven't had a settled side since that Chelsea game for one reason or another and that hasn't helped.

We've conceded a lot of goals but as you say, it's not a coincidence that it aligned with our team being decimated.

The naivety stuff is just working backward to explain defeats imo, and it's a bit patronising. This man has been managing for nearly thirty years, and he's gone from the Aussie leagues and a third division Greek club to some of the biggest teams in Europe, entirely because of his talents as a manager. People are very free to question him but it's often phrased like he never would've been challenged or faced adversity, which is just absurd, because he's been a manager longer than anyone else in the league.

 

[easley91]

We've conceded a lot of goals but as you say, it's not a coincidence that it aligned with our team being decimated.

The naivety stuff is just working backward to explain defeats imo, and it's a bit patronising. This man has been managing for nearly thirty years, and he's gone from the Aussie leagues and a third division Greek club to some of the biggest teams in Europe, entirely because of his talents as a manager. People are very free to question him but it's often phrased like he never would've been challenged or faced adversity, which is just absurd, because he's been a manager longer than anyone else in the league.

It has been mentioned in this thread today I believe, but people really do need to be patient with this. I have said it once, I have said it multiple times. New manager, new style, new younger squad that has been decimated by injuries and suspensions. It's going to take time to really settle into some sort of consistency for a whole season..

They first ten games we set a very high standard and perhaps expectations raised in some minds, along with us being in and around 4th still. That shouldn't take away from the fact this is a new project and this season is about laying the foundations.

 

[alfie103]

What amazes me is these folk on Social Media all apparently know better than Ange but don't actually do the job. I wonder why that is ? Perhaps it is because they actually know F all ?

It is a fair point but the same could be said of people who criticised Conte, Mourinho and any other premier league manager.

 

[Japhet]

Yeh I fully trust him. I think it’s intentional stubbornness at the moment and if a team plays a style that beats it he isn’t going to change. It’s all about drilling the ideas into players right now and then he can get more flexible with ideas. Always knew there were going to be bumps in the road with it particularly in year 1 just think our expectations were raised when we started so well.

Couldn't agree more. It's well documented that Ange's teams struggle to get it right straight off the bat. They also tend to get a run of injuries in the first season. We all knew this and were prepared for bumps in the road but as you say, our early season form led to higher expectations. It's also well documented that once everything clicks, Ange's teams become very hard to play against, so if things continue to go as expected, we have that to look forward to.

 

[mightyspur]

We've conceded a lot of goals but as you say, it's not a coincidence that it aligned with our team being decimated.

The naivety stuff is just working backward to explain defeats imo, and it's a bit patronising. This man has been managing for nearly thirty years, and he's gone from the Aussie leagues and a third division Greek club to some of the biggest teams in Europe, entirely because of his talents as a manager. People are very free to question him but it's often phrased like he never would've been challenged or faced adversity, which is just absurd, because he's been a manager longer than anyone else in the league.

We've got the 7th best defensive record in the league. The 4 teams above us, United and Everton (randomly). I do think our problem is an inability to keep a clean sheet though

 

[Typical Spurs]

Couldn't agree more. It's well documented that Ange's teams struggle to get it right straight off the bat. They also tend to get a run of injuries in the first season. We all knew this and were prepared for bumps in the road but as you say, our early season form led to higher expectations. It's also well documented that once everything clicks, Ange's teams become very hard to play against, so if things continue to go as expected, we have that to look forward to.

I hear that completely.

Issue for me when I hear that Ange's previous teams struggled at first, is both the calibre of the teams he's managed in the leagues in which they are, are dreadful. He's managed:

Celtic
Yokohama
Melbourne Victory
Brisbane Roar
Whittlesea Zebras

Therefore it's irrelevant to me how quick his previous sides picked up his methods because where he's done it the standard is shit.

On the other hand, I had faith in the beginning with Mourinho and Conte because they've won stuff in big leagues in Europe, and look how that turned out!

Don't know what I'm trying to say. Other than perhaps I need to have more faith in Ange.

 

[daveduvet]

1st season. Folk need to remind themselves of expectations when he was appointed. He’s hit a higher ceiling than we’d all have expected very early on. Major upheavals occurred due to numerous injuries; competitions elsewhere etc, etc. I’m not criticising him directly - as a n other suggested individual brain farts have been shown to have caused many problems with conceding goals. If we’re in top 6 at end of season I feel that’s an achievement given the overhaul that’s been required since peak poch. We’re on a positive trajectory… let’s count the blessings… for me it’s the best for many a moon

 

[Gassin's finest]

You can just imagine the post match presser if we lose to Palace - "yeah look like I've said there are no easy games in this league mate, we weren't expecting the 8-1-1 low block and struggled to break them down first half, second half I thought we were better, but then you know, they've got the new manager bounce and we get caught on the break for their first goal and after that when you are chasing the game you are always vulnerable to conceding a second counter attack goal. But we are only 8 months into our process, Palace have had two whole weeks with their new manager, look mathematically we can still win the league so we'll keep going"

 

[chas vs dave]

I hear that completely.

Issue for me when I hear that Ange's previous teams struggled at first, is both the calibre of the teams he's managed in the leagues in which they are, are dreadful. He's managed:

Celtic
Yokohama
Melbourne Victory
Brisbane Roar
Whittlesea Zebras

Therefore it's irrelevant to me how quick his previous sides picked up his methods because where he's done it the standard is shit.

On the other hand, I had faith in the beginning with Mourinho and Conte because they've won stuff in big leagues in Europe, and look how that turned out!

Don't know what I'm trying to say. Other than perhaps I need to have more faith in Ange.

He did more in Japan than arsene wenger did. Circumnavigating the J League, whilst not being used to the culture or language is very impressive, imo.

 

[Misfit]

1st season. Folk need to remind themselves of expectations when he was appointed. He’s hit a higher ceiling than we’d all have expected very early on. Major upheavals occurred due to numerous injuries; competitions elsewhere etc, etc. I’m not criticising him directly - as a n other suggested individual brain farts have been shown to have caused many problems with conceding goals. If we’re in top 6 at end of season I feel that’s an achievement given the overhaul that’s been required since peak poch. We’re on a positive trajectory… let’s count the blessings… for me it’s the best for many a moon

Indeed. I remember being called wildly optimistic in thinking we might even push for a top 6 finish this season before a ball was kicked. Maybe I was but I still think we finish top 6...

 

[Typical Spurs]

He did more in Japan than arsene wenger did. Circumnavigating the J League, whilst not being used to the culture or language is very impressive, imo.

Did he? Wenger won a league and cup at Monaco and then moved to Japan and in his one season won 2 cups.

Anyway, as I said in my original post, maybe I need to have more faith in Ange as my faith in Jose and Conte was based on what they'd done at top European clubs and I absolutely despised the football, especially under Conte.

 

[chas vs dave]

Did he? Wenger won a league and cup at Monaco and then moved to Japan and in his one season won 2 cups.

Anyway, as I said in my original post, maybe I need to have more faith in Ange as my faith in Jose and Conte was based on what they'd done at top European clubs and I absolutely despised the football, especially under Conte.

Wenger won the cup, and the super cup - which is the equivalent of the charity shield.

Ange won the j league.

The league trumps domestic cups anywhere.

 

[aussiespursguy]

I know you're being sarky, but I've got to be honest: I'm not sure what your underlying point is.

He still pines for Antonio "The Rug" Conte.

 

[chas vs dave]

I find it bizarre that people are questioning ange. Very few managers hit the ground running on their first season.

It's his first season, I remember people were calling pep "fraudiola" in his first season.