Metalhead
But that's a debate for another thread.....
- Nov 24, 2013
- 25,413
- 38,427
I've no idea. I'm literally just saying that's how Ange is. It's just an observation rather than me saying how I feel personally about it.
Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou
- Thread starter Archibald&Crooks
- Start date
Ruffinthepuffin
Well-Known Member
- Jun 21, 2011
- 1,323
- 3,831
Bore off, keep politics out of it.
mattstev2000
Well-Known Member
- Aug 15, 2007
- 2,782
- 5,512
When he signed, with the squad we had I was kind of expecting 5-7th. Having said that I think we've made some really good signings since then and some young players like Sarr have really emerged so at the moment I kind of feel like he's underachieving a bit.
Conversely the football is much more entertaining and some of the draws and losses we've had have felt better than some of the wins under Conte and Jose!
I'm concerned he only has a tendency to stick places for a couple of years or so, so some of the talk about long term change and mentality shifting doesn't entirely seem to fit with his normal approach.
Conversely the football is much more entertaining and some of the draws and losses we've had have felt better than some of the wins under Conte and Jose!
I'm concerned he only has a tendency to stick places for a couple of years or so, so some of the talk about long term change and mentality shifting doesn't entirely seem to fit with his normal approach.
HildoSpur
Likes Erik Lamela, deal with it.
- Oct 1, 2005
- 9,130
- 28,562
You are neglecting to say that we also sold possibly our best ever player. Also Ange has always been trying hard to get to this level. Now he is here, at the highest level his motivation will be to stay here rather than to move on.
Wearegoingtowintheleague
Well-Known Member
- Nov 10, 2018
- 836
- 4,347
I'm still not convinced on our front three or any of the combination of forwards being a front 3 that would be what we need.
I know we are looking for another player who could make the difference.
Son up top works better if there is space to run into. But not so well if the opposition sit back. It may do if we had our full backs overlapping and getting crosses Into the box but we don't play that way.
As much as I like Deki, it's frustrating seeing him try to beat two players to create something as he often ends up losing the ball. He can hold up the ball and progress up the pitch.
BJ has improved, but he still has a way to go. He has potential with time and should continue to improve.
Timo has great pace and energy, he can get to byline but he doesn't have a great left foot and often wastes a good position to get in a cross. He is also not clinical.
Richarlison is hot and cold, will score goals and can hold up the ball.
I understand that we are fixed on our formation and getting players used to the system. But feel our front three is not quite right.
I do wonder if a change in formation may suit some games. Having son and richarlison as a front two would probably suit them both better and then using Porro and Udogie as our wing backs.
We could then put an extra man in the middle.
Sadly I don't think we will try that as we are going all in on this front three, but my concerns are it leaves us exposed and when the front 3 are nullified, we lose grip of the game.
I know we are looking for another player who could make the difference.
Son up top works better if there is space to run into. But not so well if the opposition sit back. It may do if we had our full backs overlapping and getting crosses Into the box but we don't play that way.
As much as I like Deki, it's frustrating seeing him try to beat two players to create something as he often ends up losing the ball. He can hold up the ball and progress up the pitch.
BJ has improved, but he still has a way to go. He has potential with time and should continue to improve.
Timo has great pace and energy, he can get to byline but he doesn't have a great left foot and often wastes a good position to get in a cross. He is also not clinical.
Richarlison is hot and cold, will score goals and can hold up the ball.
I understand that we are fixed on our formation and getting players used to the system. But feel our front three is not quite right.
I do wonder if a change in formation may suit some games. Having son and richarlison as a front two would probably suit them both better and then using Porro and Udogie as our wing backs.
We could then put an extra man in the middle.
Sadly I don't think we will try that as we are going all in on this front three, but my concerns are it leaves us exposed and when the front 3 are nullified, we lose grip of the game.
ultimateloner
Well-Known Member
- Jan 25, 2004
- 4,569
- 2,203
I give him 3 years judging from his record.
It's not enough for a culture shift; if Poch can't do it neither could he. We will remain Spursy because it's our DNA.
What I am more optimistic about is we will continue to be fun to watch and if we are lucky we might win something.
mattstev2000
Well-Known Member
- Aug 15, 2007
- 2,782
- 5,512
I wasn't neglecting it, I think the squad now is considerably better than it was when we had Kane. One player doesn't make a team.
Wheeler Dealer
Well-Known Member
- Jul 29, 2011
- 6,924
- 12,438
We will remain Spursy as you state due to the fact that there are 3 or 4 clubs with better players and over a 38 game season these better players will probably win more points than we will gain over the same period.
the reality is that we are where we should be based on numerous metrics. Wage bill, squad quality and transfer spend…etc
I have every confidence in Ange making us better, but he’ll struggle to get the leverage to pass the 3-4 teams that are better than us.
EastUpperDK82
Well-Known Member
- Jan 16, 2022
- 3,077
- 6,766
Many experts say that Ange's style of football and personality would be perfect to succeed Klopp at Liverpool... and he has that Liverpool connection from his youth... I actually agree with them... if you look at the way he sets up his team. Energy, high line, organized chaos, pressing, atmosphere, culture etc... Ange as a person and father figure... it's exactly what the fans there would love (to continue) as well.
It would be a very good choice for Liverpool. IMO.
SO !! ... of course yesterday was unacceptable. The players know it. Ange knows it... But Ange has warned us... he will do what he does and believes in.... and there will be bumps... we will be true to the way we want to play. Where we want to go as a club/team. Learn from it.
If we can't see that or we get impatient too quickly... it's not impossible that Ange could be tempted if Liverpool come knocking.
If Ange is a good fit for Liverpool... he's more than a good fit for us. Because we want the same kind of football-culture at Spurs... don't forget that.
We can criticize... point out errors and faults. Sure... but if we want to move forward and change the culture on and off the pitch our support needs to be unwavering. We have already seen glimpses of what Ange can do. I want more of that.
To me Ange is an opportunity we simply can't waste.
COYS.
It would be a very good choice for Liverpool. IMO.
SO !! ... of course yesterday was unacceptable. The players know it. Ange knows it... But Ange has warned us... he will do what he does and believes in.... and there will be bumps... we will be true to the way we want to play. Where we want to go as a club/team. Learn from it.
If we can't see that or we get impatient too quickly... it's not impossible that Ange could be tempted if Liverpool come knocking.
If Ange is a good fit for Liverpool... he's more than a good fit for us. Because we want the same kind of football-culture at Spurs... don't forget that.
We can criticize... point out errors and faults. Sure... but if we want to move forward and change the culture on and off the pitch our support needs to be unwavering. We have already seen glimpses of what Ange can do. I want more of that.
To me Ange is an opportunity we simply can't waste.
COYS.
Last edited:
- Oct 2, 2004
- 48,263
- 47,342
- Staff
- #9,350
We all want instant success, particularly after the dross we were served up in the Conte and Mourinho eras.
But it's precisely because of the failings, basically since the Champions League final, that we have to give Ange time.
Performances like yesterday are unacceptable, and Ange has to take his share of the blame when those sorts of performances occur.
But he is going through a transition from a club that was pretty much as far removed from its identity and fanbase as it had been in a long time.
We're still probably 7/8 players short of having a squad that can fully deliver on Ange's plan and there's a fair amount of deadwood that we still need to shift as well.
Yesterday was awful. Nobody is saying otherwise.
And Ange needs to continue learning and that will mean having to be more flexible in his approach sometimes.
I think top 4 is now pretty unlikely but if we can hold on to 5th that's a great season from where we were when Ange took over.
I continue to have that faith in him, even if nonsense like yesterday pushes that faith to the limit.
But it's precisely because of the failings, basically since the Champions League final, that we have to give Ange time.
Performances like yesterday are unacceptable, and Ange has to take his share of the blame when those sorts of performances occur.
But he is going through a transition from a club that was pretty much as far removed from its identity and fanbase as it had been in a long time.
We're still probably 7/8 players short of having a squad that can fully deliver on Ange's plan and there's a fair amount of deadwood that we still need to shift as well.
Yesterday was awful. Nobody is saying otherwise.
And Ange needs to continue learning and that will mean having to be more flexible in his approach sometimes.
I think top 4 is now pretty unlikely but if we can hold on to 5th that's a great season from where we were when Ange took over.
I continue to have that faith in him, even if nonsense like yesterday pushes that faith to the limit.
Last edited:
easley91
Well-Known Member
- Jan 27, 2011
- 19,054
- 54,719
Patience.
A lot of people in this fanbase don't have it or simply do not understand it.
If you cannot take the downs in the first season then go to Man City instead. This isn't a video game. It's not going to happen overnight. These are young players with a new manager. We were never going to win every game.
Was yesterday a poor performance? Absolutely. Was Ange's changes too late? Yes. But as this is the first season I will let it slide and accept majority of teams have days like that. Arsenal lost to Fulham this season themselves. City have lost games. We all lose games here and there.
I'm still loving big Ange.
A lot of people in this fanbase don't have it or simply do not understand it.
If you cannot take the downs in the first season then go to Man City instead. This isn't a video game. It's not going to happen overnight. These are young players with a new manager. We were never going to win every game.
Was yesterday a poor performance? Absolutely. Was Ange's changes too late? Yes. But as this is the first season I will let it slide and accept majority of teams have days like that. Arsenal lost to Fulham this season themselves. City have lost games. We all lose games here and there.
I'm still loving big Ange.
Teegart
Scottish Yid
- Jun 30, 2006
- 815
- 2,188
Personally I’m not worried about Ange, actually really excited, however there is a caveat to that. Im excited if he ends up getting the players he clearly needs. We need to be all in with Ange as a club, can’t half measure it or we’ll never get anywhere.
He needs very specific profiles to make this system work, a system that rightly or wrongly however you choose to look at it, he won’t swerve from. With that said, we need to make sure he has the players to succeed.
For example, the difference in our defending when Van de Ven doesn’t play is stark. The system imperatively needs a CB with elite pace to work, imo. We have to get a second CB in that has this, or we’ll continue to have trouble conceding on transitions, we leave too much space. Thankfully, from Anges quotes Friday, a CB is part of his summer plans. I think we can rest assured it will be a CB with blistering pace he’s after.
Also, as many have discussed, the front line is disjointed, that’s another priority for the summer. The squad balance just isn’t there yet, but it’s never going to be 9 odd months into his rebuild.
So basically, I’m content and exited to be all in on Ange, I have no major worries with him in charge. My only worry is Tottenham in general backing him this summer like he needs to be backed.
He needs very specific profiles to make this system work, a system that rightly or wrongly however you choose to look at it, he won’t swerve from. With that said, we need to make sure he has the players to succeed.
For example, the difference in our defending when Van de Ven doesn’t play is stark. The system imperatively needs a CB with elite pace to work, imo. We have to get a second CB in that has this, or we’ll continue to have trouble conceding on transitions, we leave too much space. Thankfully, from Anges quotes Friday, a CB is part of his summer plans. I think we can rest assured it will be a CB with blistering pace he’s after.
Also, as many have discussed, the front line is disjointed, that’s another priority for the summer. The squad balance just isn’t there yet, but it’s never going to be 9 odd months into his rebuild.
So basically, I’m content and exited to be all in on Ange, I have no major worries with him in charge. My only worry is Tottenham in general backing him this summer like he needs to be backed.
EastUpperDK82
Well-Known Member
- Jan 16, 2022
- 3,077
- 6,766
I think we have backed him so far... even made major changes in the clubs setup. Can't see why that should stop... and Ange is a big reason why we have made significant changes.
gerishep
Connected to the Spurs.
- Aug 2, 2004
- 1,185
- 1,982
It's a generalization, an opinion the poster stated as fact.
Teegart
Scottish Yid
- Jun 30, 2006
- 815
- 2,188
We definitely did back in the summer. We had to either way due to selling maybe our best ever player, so to not would have been madness.
For the record I fully expect a similar outlay this summer, but there’s always the doubt of “well we backed him last summer, this one is more reserved, as the overall rebuild was mostly done then, this is just tweaking”. Which would be a mistake completely.
ultimateloner
Well-Known Member
- Jan 25, 2004
- 4,569
- 2,203
I agree that we are Spursy because there are better teams than us which are less prone to inconsistency, and also we are about where we should be given the numerical metrics.
However I do also feel that some of our less good players can't handle pressure. For example Werner's miss yday isn't down to ability. Weakness in mind is difficult to address and I dont know the solution. Mourinho/Conte's brand of high-pressure bravado isn't suitable for this group, and it's hard to dish out more TLC after performances like that.
“Backing the manager” is one of those phrases thrown around a lot. I wonder how much we did “back” Ange? Vicario and van der Ven were widely seen as cheaper second options and Werner was a loan. Maybe Maddison and Johnson in exchange for Kane? I don’t think that’s massive backing though. It felt like we did the minimum but this time got the recruitment right.
the yid
Well-Known Member
- Dec 14, 2010
- 2,562
- 11,479
Bit of context lads
Ange doesn't have a squad he thinks is ready to compete. We have players signed for 5 different managers. We're realising Kulusevski and Bissouma aren't possibly as good as we thought they might be. Realistically we need 2 Forwards replacing Gil and Solomon, a proper ST to replace Richarlison, a DM to replace Bissouma and potentially another to replace Hojbjerg/Skipp, a Maddison back up/Lo Celso (which is that Bergvall?) replacement, another CB and a Left and a right back. I make that 9 players short currently of having a competitive squad. Reality is the team have off days and having players that fit the managers system to rotate them with is very important. I thought Dragusin and Romero were our best 2 outfield players yesterday and Thought Bissouma Sarr and Maddison were the worst. Unfortunately how deep of shit we were in aint getting sorted over night, we're moving in the right direction but until patience is needes
Ange doesn't have a squad he thinks is ready to compete. We have players signed for 5 different managers. We're realising Kulusevski and Bissouma aren't possibly as good as we thought they might be. Realistically we need 2 Forwards replacing Gil and Solomon, a proper ST to replace Richarlison, a DM to replace Bissouma and potentially another to replace Hojbjerg/Skipp, a Maddison back up/Lo Celso (which is that Bergvall?) replacement, another CB and a Left and a right back. I make that 9 players short currently of having a competitive squad. Reality is the team have off days and having players that fit the managers system to rotate them with is very important. I thought Dragusin and Romero were our best 2 outfield players yesterday and Thought Bissouma Sarr and Maddison were the worst. Unfortunately how deep of shit we were in aint getting sorted over night, we're moving in the right direction but until patience is needes
rossdapep
Well-Known Member
- Aug 25, 2011
- 22,154
- 79,695
True but sometimes you have to let things play out to learn more about your team.
I think he is giving the players a bit of rope and allowing them to correct it.
You can't hook players constantly for poor performances, you have to allow them to find the inner strength to change it or tactically switch on. Otherwise they won't be able to when you get to the crunch moments.
I am still seeing the bigger picture here.
rossdapep
Well-Known Member
- Aug 25, 2011
- 22,154
- 79,695
Ange will definitely have evolved his football and changed things.
But you can't do that in the first 12-18 months of your time at a club because you have to build the foundations.
It has to be deeply rooted in the players do that when you do evolve the football, they have something to fall back on (the core basics).
If you change things as you go along, it becomes harder to revert back to those basics and things can get messy.
Pep and Klopp both stuck to their guns and changed little.
It's only once they had everything they needed and had fully embedded the foundations they started to make adaptations.
Similar threads
