The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - 16th July 2015

[robbiedee]

Whilst it's not exactly the glamorous big name we've been hoping for, after giving it some thought, I don't think McCarthy would be a bad signing. If we could keep the cost down with Lennon going the other way..say £15m, I think we'd have ourselves a decent hardworking, Prem experienced DM. Also, am I right in thinking Irish counts as 'home-grown'?

Could be win win as long as the price is right...I'm certainly warming to the idea...

 

[youngyids]

Whilst it's not exactly the glamorous big name we've been hoping for, after giving it some thought, I don't think McCarthy would be a bad signing. If we could keep the cost down with Lennon going the other way..say £15m, I think we'd have ourselves a decent hardworking, Prem experienced DM. Also, am I right in thinking Irish counts as 'home-grown'?

Could be win win as long as the price is right...I'm certainly warming to the idea...

Home-grown rules depends on how many years you have spent at which club from the ages of 15 to 21. If some dude from a Central African tribe spends 3 or more years at Spurs between the ages of 15 to 21, he is considered hom-grown by the club.

 

[longtimespur]

Whilst it's not exactly the glamorous big name we've been hoping for, after giving it some thought, I don't think McCarthy would be a bad signing. If we could keep the cost down with Lennon going the other way..say £15m, I think we'd have ourselves a decent hardworking, Prem experienced DM. Also, am I right in thinking Irish counts as 'home-grown'?

Could be win win as long as the price is right...I'm certainly warming to the idea...

I believe he's Scottish, saw a documentary on TV the other night with him and James McCarthy playing for Hamilton I think. Really interesting it was too. 16 years old when he made his debut iirc.

 

[Lilbaz]

I believe he's Scottish, saw a documentary on TV the other night with him and James McCarthy playing for Hammilton I think. Relly iinteresting it was too.

Yep. Scottish but plays for ireland.

 

[SpartanSpur]

Whilst it's not exactly the glamorous big name we've been hoping for, after giving it some thought, I don't think McCarthy would be a bad signing. If we could keep the cost down with Lennon going the other way..say £15m, I think we'd have ourselves a decent hardworking, Prem experienced DM. Also, am I right in thinking Irish counts as 'home-grown'?

Could be win win as long as the price is right...I'm certainly warming to the idea...

Just checked the Premier League website and he is HG. He signed for Wigan before his 19th birthday so got his 3 seasons in.

Eric Dier on the other hand is not home grown despite being English.

 

[Sum Monsterism]

There's further ITK on FTL that XXXXXX has a XXXXXXX this afternoon at XXXXXXXXXX.

Could get someone in trouble so not posting names or context.

presumably your msg should have read like this then?

 

[southernspur9]

I think a lot of people are missing the point here. Yes Kramer is a great prospect but we have just had four transfer windows of Spurs buying so called superstars with no Premier League experience and them not performing as to what was expected of them and their inflated price tags.

It wasn't so long ago we were finishing closer to the top 4 or in the top 4 than we have done the last two years when we had a policy of buying Young British talent or players that had premier league experience if you ask me James McCarthy has that 100% and was the standout performer for years in an awful Wigan side and now the standout performer for an underachieving Everton side.

Baring the signing of wimmer that's exactly what we have started again. Which for me is very exciting.

The Kramers and Rabiots are all very exciting and perhaps the 'bigger names' people want to see but who's to say they are going to take to the Premier like a duck out of water just look at Lamela for that.

Who the hell does this guy think he is, coming in here and talking sense! GTFO!!!!!

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

I think a lot of people are missing the point here. Yes Kramer is a great prospect but we have just had four transfer windows of Spurs buying so called superstars with no Premier League experience and them not performing as to what was expected of them and their inflated price tags.

It wasn't so long ago we were finishing closer to the top 4 or in the top 4 than we have done the last two years when we had a policy of buying Young British talent or players that had premier league experience if you ask me James McCarthy has that 100% and was the standout performer for years in an awful Wigan side and now the standout performer for an underachieving Everton side.

Baring the signing of wimmer that's exactly what we have started again. Which for me is very exciting.

The Kramers and Rabiots are all very exciting and perhaps the 'bigger names' people want to see but who's to say they are going to take to the Premier like a duck out of water just look at Lamela for that.

Welcome!
Good points but not all is black and white though.
Dembele, Dempsey, Sigurdsson, all had PL experience. Where are they now? Only Dembele left, and he doesn't play much.
Going further back, Bent had PL experience. Bently was young and English. Look at them.
Lloris, Vertonghen, Eriksen, Dier, all did not have PL experience. How do we rate them today?
Getting a new player is always risky. It's never predictable. And it is simply not only a question about age, or PL or no PL experience.

 

[Bobbins]

Whilst it's not exactly the glamorous big name we've been hoping for, after giving it some thought, I don't think McCarthy would be a bad signing. If we could keep the cost down with Lennon going the other way..say £15m, I think we'd have ourselves a decent hardworking, Prem experienced DM. Also, am I right in thinking Irish counts as 'home-grown'?

Could be win win as long as the price is right...I'm certainly warming to the idea...

Ah, the classic "SC-member convincing themselves that a transfer is a good idea after running out of other options/it becoming clear the club will pursue it despite it not being a very good transfer" post!

Not the first one of the summer, plenty in the Toby thread.

We do have this amazing ability to warp our own rational minds around to thinking in an unnatural fashion just in order to try and be excited by a transfer.

McCarthy would be one of the most uninspiring big money transfers in the history of the club - a reasonably good player who has never achieved anything, highly likely never will, who will effectively block the progress of our younger/established players whilst not doing the DM job as well as a truly specialist player who might justify a transfer would.

I see little difference between him and Stambouli (who has had effectively zero chance to make the position his own and has all but wasted a year of his career at Spurs) short of James costing an absolute minimum of £10m more and having shitter hair.

 

[NorthernMonkey]

Think JM would be a decent signing. The kind of player who, when is playing well, you don't even notice he's there, everything kinda goes through him. Simple pass, find space, get it back, simple pass, find space etc. He's never gonna get you a bucket load of Fantasy Football points, but if he can make our midfield tick in the same way that Carrick did, I'd take that.

Don't think we'll pay £20-£25m for him though, but if a deal in the region of £15-£18 could be done and we can leverage Lennon in the other direction for around £7 then happy days!

 

[Mr Pink]

Ah, the classic "SC-member convincing themselves that a transfer is a good idea after running out of other options/it becoming clear the club will pursue it despite it not being a very good transfer" post!

Not the first one of the summer, plenty in the Toby thread.

We do have this amazing ability to warp our own rational minds around to thinking in an unnatural fashion just in order to try and be excited by a transfer.

McCarthy would be one of the most uninspiring big money transfers in the history of the club - a reasonably good player who has never achieved anything, highly likely never will, who will effectively block the progress of our younger/established players whilst not doing the DM job as well as a truly specialist player who might justify a transfer would.

I see little difference between him and Stambouli (who has had effectively zero chance to make the position his own and has all but wasted a year of his career at Spurs) short of James costing an absolute minimum of £10m more and having shitter hair.

 

[Mr Pink]

When are people going to start understanding, its about building a 'team' and putting in the appropriate pieces to build it - instead wanking over individual names.

 

[Hoopspur]

McCarthy would be one of the most uninspiring big money transfers in the history of the club - a reasonably good player who has never achieved anything, highly likely never will, who will effectively block the progress of our younger/established players whilst not doing the DM job as well as a truly specialist player who might justify a transfer would.

I see little difference between him and Stambouli (who has had effectively zero chance to make the position his own and has all but wasted a year of his career at Spurs) short of James costing an absolute minimum of £10m more and having shitter hair.

Maybe - it's your opinion and everyone is entitled to theirs of course. But hopefully if the manager actually wants or believes in him then he will get a decent chance within the team. I'm not sure Stam actually ever got that for whatever reason. Also the amount of money we will be paying kind of dictates that he will get his chances - much the same as Paulhi did.

Edit - oh and the old 'told you so' is so easy too. Almost as much as the statement 'well I was wrong'.

 

[THFCSPURS19]

Ah, the classic "SC-member convincing themselves that a transfer is a good idea after running out of other options/it becoming clear the club will pursue it despite it not being a very good transfer" post!

Not the first one of the summer, plenty in the Toby thread.

We do have this amazing ability to warp our own rational minds around to thinking in an unnatural fashion just in order to try and be excited by a transfer.

McCarthy would be one of the most uninspiring big money transfers in the history of the club - a reasonably good player who has never achieved anything, highly likely never will, who will effectively block the progress of our younger/established players whilst not doing the DM job as well as a truly specialist player who might justify a transfer would.

I see little difference between him and Stambouli (who has had effectively zero chance to make the position his own and has all but wasted a year of his career at Spurs) short of James costing an absolute minimum of £10m more and having shitter hair.

You refer to the potential transfer as 'uninspiring' but, thankfully, the club don't complete transfers in terms of how much they excite people. Most were extremely excited in 2013, but it turned out to be a disastrous transfer window.

 

[Jamturk]

Think JM would be a decent signing. The kind of player who, when is playing well, you don't even notice he's there, everything kinda goes through him. Simple pass, find space, get it back, simple pass, find space etc. He's never gonna get you a bucket load of Fantasy Football points, but if he can make our midfield tick in the same way that Carrick did, I'd take that.

Don't think we'll pay £20-£25m for him though, but if a deal in the region of £15-£18 could be done and we can leverage Lennon in the other direction for around £7 then happy days!

Isn't that what Bentaleb is?

 

[Jamturk]

You refer to the potential transfer as 'uninspiring' but, thankfully, the club don't complete transfers in terms of how much they excite people. Most were extremely excited in 2013, but it turned out to be a disastrous transfer window.

Ginola, Gascoigne, Klinnsmann, Berbatov, Modric...

These players were not disasters

 

[SpartanSpur]

Welcome!
Good points but not all is black and white though.
Dembele, Dempsey, Sigurdsson, all had PL experience. Where are they now? Only Dembele left, and he doesn't play much.
Going further back, Bent had PL experience. Bently was young and English. Look at them.
Lloris, Vertonghen, Eriksen, Dier, all did not have PL experience. How do we rate them today?
Getting a new player is always risky. It's never predictable. And it is simply not only a question about age, or PL or no PL experience.

I would certainly suggest that in this position we have had more joy with UK based signings, Sandro probably the only true success, such a shame he got injured.

Parker, Carrick, Palacios, Huddlestone, Dembele all very good for spells, the first three especially. Capoue was very highly rated in France and looked a good fit, Paulinho got the bronze ball in the Confeds Cup and flopped, Stambouli never happened either.

There is definitely something to be said for getting a safe option in, especially when the side is already chock full of developing players. Eriksen, Kane, Bentaleb, Rose guaranteed starters. Alli, Lamela, Dier, Wimmer, Mason, Trippier/Walker even in the greater squad. We're far from lacking in potential and youth. In fact at just 24 McCarthy is an excellent blend.

Does seem to be a position where players burn out quick. Hopefully Bentaleb will be an exception to this.

Bent and Bentley were just terrible fits when signed, Dempsey was always a square peg/speculative signing also.

 

[Mr Pink]

Ginola, Gascoigne, Klinnsmann, Berbatov, Modric...

These players were not disasters

Don't think that's the point though.

We're looking for that defensive minded midfielder who can still play a bit. McCarthy ticks the boxes and we clearly view him as a good fit. If he comes in and we improve as a team who gives a fuck if some people saw it as uninspiring? Its so short sighted.

 

[MattPhilpott]

Be surprised, i thought Troy (Andros' Father) really didn't like Tim?

That as may be, although I think if there was an opportunity for his boy to go and be a main man at a club where the manager thinks a load of him, I think the best interests of his son come first, whether he likes the man or not?

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

I would certainly suggest that in this position we have had more joy with UK based signings, Sandro probably the only true success, such a shame he got injured.

Parker, Carrick, Palacios, Huddlestone, Dembele all very good for spells, the first three especially. Capoue was very highly rated in France and looked a good fit, Paulinho got the bronze ball in the Confeds Cup and flopped, Stambouli never happened either.

There is definitely something to be said for getting a safe option in, especially when the side is already chock full of developing players. Eriksen, Kane, Bentaleb, Rose guaranteed starters. Alli, Lamela, Dier, Wimmer, Mason, Trippier/Walker even in the greater squad. We're far from lacking in potential and youth. In fact at just 24 McCarthy is an excellent blend.

Does seem to be a position where players burn out quick. Hopefully Bentaleb will be an exception to this.

Bent and Bentley were just terrible fits when signed, Dempsey was always a square peg/speculative signing also.

There is an obvious reply and an equal obvious player to name in reply to this, but I will refrain as this is not the "debate your eyes out by trumping the other with sad argumentation"-thread.