Ratings vs Liverpool

[Legend10]

He didn't say that, it was a twitter wind up that people fell for.

they quoted him on Sky Sports?

Plus it was on Liverpool's official site before being removed!

 

[PrettyColors]

Fuckin hell. It's getting really really hard to suck any positives from the performances. All you can hope is these results we are digging out get us through to January intact so that we can perform a complete frontal lobotomy on our side.

We have so many stupid fuckers it's really depressing. Walker, Dawson, Lennon, Demspey, Defoe should all wear big point hats with D on them when they come out the tunnel. Gallas, Bale, Sandro aren't exactly cerebral, and even Dembele and Vertonghen have their moments when you wonder if the others are rubbing off on them.

I would would swap Lennon and Defoe for Suarez and Sterling in the blink of an eye. Away from home against a side above them Suarez saw the ball 67 times, Sterling 61. Defoe 20, Lennon 28. Suarez made 31/40 passes, Sterling a kid having his first season 31/35. defoe 8/11, Lennon 13/17. What I like most about the pair of them is when the lose the ball it makes them angry, they want to scrap and get it back. They take it personally. That little kid Sterling's got more fight in him than Lennon, Defoe, Bale and Dempsey put together.

Lennon & Defoe. I'm sick of watching those two insipid little wankers do so little. Offensively and defensively. They should have been upgraded a while ago.

Bale is a talent, but he is so fucking lazy it's painful. I don't want to run on the pitch and punch the ref or the opponents goalkeeper, I want to run on a kick Bale firmly up the arse. First half he just stood and watched as their bloke (I can't remember who) just runs past him, into the box and through.

Both CB's were fucking awful tonight. The both looked wobbly, gave the ball away got sucked in and skanked.

I really do not know what AVB is teaching any of them, but I suppose all we can say is, in fairness to him, he is working with a really poor bunch of footballers, the poorest I've seen since Arnesen arrived and signed half of Europe in one window.

The first half was reasonably un shit. The second half was just heinous. No-one would move (the problem with a team full of stupid ****s) off the ball, when we did have it our passing was atrocious. We dithered in defence and made cluster fuck after cluster fuck, and only luck and Liverpool's wastefulness saved us from getting the result we deserved.

Ratings:

Lloris 8 - Again showed good proactive initiative.

Walker 6 - He was OK defensively tonight. Best I can do.

Dawson 5 - Got is some clearances but was clumsy, gave the ball away, generally just looked bad.

Gallas 5 - Same as Dawson. Got some blocks and tackles but also looked really shaky at times and made some poor moves.

Vertonghen 6 - OK but even he had a couple of less than great moments. We need a LB and Kaboul either side of him at CB.

Sandro 6 - Run ragged but also as bad as I've seen him for a while.

Dembele 6.5 - Was our busiest player on the ball.

Lennon 4 - There was a spell after they scored when he actually pressed with genuine purpose. Before that it was the usual ten yard pressing. Played no meaning flu part in the game.

Dempsey 4 - Someone needs to edit this ****s wicky page. He ain't no "attacking midfielder". He's an un-attacking striker.

Bale 6 - Does see more ball and get more involved than the other fuckers, and does carry a genuine threat, but he's such a fucking faggot, it drives me nuts sometimes.

Defoe 2 - Weak, insipid and worse, much worse is he's fucking lazy. When you are having a shit game and your side is under the cosh, the least you could do is close down properly. Lazy, selfish little prick.


I keep saying this, but we have kids who I have seen play better than this. I have seen them pass and move and work. We need to start getting them involved, they cannot be worse than the shit we are watching week in week out at the moment.

Was going to write something complaining about how negative you are, but then I realized that would be unfair. A least you're consistent. Now, you have ridiculously unrealistic expectations (it appears you want us to dominate every minute of every game Barca style... in fact, it seems you want us to be Barcelona) but at least I understand how you judge us and give players ratings.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

No, Bale is a lazy **** chocolate soldier!

He ain't no soldier.

 

[beats1]

Was going to write something complaining about how negative you are, but then I realized that would be unfair. A least you're consistent. Now, you have ridiculously unrealistic expectations (it appears you want us to dominate every minute of every game Barca style... in fact, it seems you want us to be Barcelona) but at least I understand how you judge us and give players ratings.

Are you suggesting only Barca would outplay Liverpool

 

[Bus-Conductor]

You say you'd rather have Suarez and Stirling than our bunch of ****s, but our bunch of ****s are showing a lot more end product than Liverpool at the moment, and our youngsters may pass and move better playing at the level they are playing, but there is no guarantee they will show more end product that our current front 4 of Bale, Lennon, Defoe and Dempsey.

For all of Stirling and Suarez's possession, Liverpoool have scored 18 goals to our 25. Considering our bunch of ****s see so little of the ball at least shows they are incisive and more clinical than Liverpool, which is why we are higher in the league and have scored 0.42 more goals per game. We know Suarez is a much more complete player than Defoe, but when you look at the bigger picture only the Manchester clubs and Arse have scored more goals than us. This is with Defoe being a selfish ****, Lennon a clueless ****, Dempsey a **** **** and Bale the best player in the Prem. It can't all be because of Bale though.

In an ideal world Defoe would hold up the ball and make 50 passes a game but he is 30 and has never shown this in his career. He is not going to change, but he is still capable of contributing to a significant amount of goals in the season so we have to get behind him. Until Ade gets back he is the best we have and we are showing enough to score goals regularly and win games.

If we are going to talk in general terms about goals scored we need to talk about goals conceded too, and goal difference. Liverpool, maybe because their players work harder off the ball, have also conceded 5 less than us. Up until last night we both had identical GD. When they can add another player to chip in with end product and goals they will be a serious threat IMO.

IMO the only reason we won last night was Gareth Bale. The difference between us being where Liverpool are and not is Gareth Bale. In fact we'd probably be lower than them (using your simplistic formulaic approach). He has scored 6 goals and 1 assist this season. Liverpool have a striker scoring at a better rate than Defoe and working much harder than ours, contributing more to team play and defensively, but they literally have no-one else chipping in with the kind of end product Gareth Bale does for us. Their next highest scorer after Suarez, has 1 goal.

When Liverpool improve this area, they will be higher than us, I have no doubt, because they already play much better football.

As much as I moan about Bale's defensive frailty, offensively last season and already this he is a major contributor to our productivity. Which is why for all his defensive laziness, I still rate him (Even last night I gave him the joint highest score of any outfield player). He also sees more ball and is always more involved in team play than Lennon, who really is a weak player. Doesn't contribute enough end product (and never has) doesn't contribute enough in team play and doesn't do enough defensively or off the ball.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Was going to write something complaining about how negative you are, but then I realized that would be unfair. A least you're consistent. Now, you have ridiculously unrealistic expectations (it appears you want us to dominate every minute of every game Barca style... in fact, it seems you want us to be Barcelona) but at least I understand how you judge us and give players ratings.

So we either play an insipid brand of football or we are Barca ? Are you sure there's no middle position (or several) ?

 

[faymantaray]

Their next highest scorer after Suarez, has 1 goal.

So Bale is not only our second top scorer, but Liverpool's joint second top scorer?

 

[beats1]

So Bale is not only our second top scorer, but Liverpool's joint second top scorer?

Yep but this other guy called Owen Goal has 3 goals and for some reason he took bales goal as well

 

[jonathanhotspur]

Talking about Rodgers, my favourite rating on Guardian comment thread...

'Waves a piece of paper at Rodgers'

'YOU"RE iN THE ENVELOPE, YOU"RE IN THE ENVELOPE'...

I don't get the joke.

 

[bubble07]

I think Lennon works well defensively but not so much offensively

 

[We'llWinThePrem]

Lloris 7
Walker 7
Gallas 5
Dawson 6
Vertonghen 6
Sandro 7
Dembele 7
Lennon 7
Dempsey 6
Bale 9
Defoe 5

 

[Mr Pink]

Well fuck a duck.

I think we do have to bear in mind, here, that fatigue crept in to our second half performance. AVB hasn't rotated really and this was our third game in six days off the back of the trip to Rome.

We played some brillant stuff in the first half and for all Liverpool's possession they could only dream of that real attacking prowess we turn on - in little mini spells. What Liverpool did well was close down the space, they totally limited our supply lines and whoever looked up on the ball had a serious lack of options. Again we need to show better off the ball movement when we are in these situations, the second half was similar to the Lazio performance in that regard. We need to work better on and off the ball.

Liverpool certainly have the foundations to build on now, but they're still lacking cutting edge IMO. We'll improve with Adebayor back, Dembele getting up to speed and being able to use Parker to give Sandro a breather.

Enrique is seriously strong though isn't he?

I would seriously consider bringing Carroll in for Saturday.

 

[scat1620]

I don't get the joke.

On that Channel 5 documentary about LFC, Brendan Rodgers was shown holding a pre-season meeting with the Liverpool players. He got them together in a room on tour, stood in front of them and held up a sealed envelope telling them that the envelope contained the names of 3 players who would let Liverpool down during the forthcoming season. He then told them "not to be one of those players" and held on to the envelope. Apparently he was trying to play some psychological games and motivate his players to perform well during the season.

A team of crack scientists at CERN is still trying to calculate why on earth he thought that pulling such a shit stunt would be a good idea and not a totally demoralising sham trick guaranteed to backfire.

 

[guiltyparty]

I don't get the joke.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...verpool-boss-picks-players-let-team-down.html

 

[lennon4england]

If we are going to talk in general terms about goals scored we need to talk about goals conceded too, and goal difference. Liverpool, maybe because their players work harder off the ball, have also conceded 5 less than us. Up until last night we both had identical GD. When they can add another player to chip in with end product and goals they will be a serious threat IMO.

IMO the only reason we won last night was Gareth Bale. The difference between us being where Liverpool are and not is Gareth Bale. In fact we'd probably be lower than them (using your simplistic formulaic approach). He has scored 6 goals and 1 assist this season. Liverpool have a striker scoring at a better rate than Defoe and working much harder than ours, contributing more to team play and defensively, but they literally have no-one else chipping in with the kind of end product Gareth Bale does for us. Their next highest scorer after Suarez, has 1 goal.

When Liverpool improve this area, they will be higher than us, I have no doubt, because they already play much better football.

As much as I moan about Bale's defensive frailty, offensively last season and already this he is a major contributor to our productivity. Which is why for all his defensive laziness, I still rate him (Even last night I gave him the joint highest score of any outfield player). He also sees more ball and is always more involved in team play than Lennon, who really is a weak player. Doesn't contribute enough end product (and never has) doesn't contribute enough in team play and doesn't do enough defensively or off the ball.

When/IF Liverpool improve this area we will have a striker better than Defoe (we already have one coming back from suspension, they have nothing unless they buy). Despite his lack of involvement in our general play he is still contributing to our goal tally significantly more than Stirling is for Liverpool, as is Lennon.

Yes they have conceded less than us, but with Dembele back in for Huddlestone and Ade in for Defoe/Dempsey our ability to retain the ball will be vastly improved. Liverpool have a manager focussed on possession football and as nice as it would be for us to match them, without VDV and Modders we do not have the players to do this. Despite not playing particularly well this season we have got results which can't all be down to luck (or Bale's brilliance).

I'm not a huge fan of Defoe and I generally agree with your posts, but he is not going to change at his age and he is still an asset to the team (maybe in not such a prominent role as he has at the moment).

 

[Bus-Conductor]

Honestly no idea where to start after last night, even this morning it seems like the most bizarre game of football I've seen for years. It reminded me of when we won against Chelsea at the Lane for the first time in 278 years when Lennon scored the winner. It felt like a mid table side beating one of the bigger sides. That's not to say Liverpool are 'good', because they are not, they pass the ball nicely but they do fuck all with it. Sterling was ok but he's no better than Lennon or Walcott, Suarez is a terrier and he's impressing me more than he has done since he came to the Premier League, but he's certainly not a worldie.

And 'Brent'an Rodgers is a fucking phoney, what an absolute ****. Make team selections like that then have the audacity to claim two non penalties and say they were generally shafted. They had the ball as we let them have it, but they created fuck all with it and only scored because one of our own players kicked it into another ones of our players face.

For us, I thought Walker was decent, Gallas/Dawson were disgusting together, Dawson had a marginally better first half but then they both competed for 'chief ****' in the second.

Sandro was poor, Dembele on the ball is better than anyone we've had for years, but he lacks any real penetration and seems to shit himself when he gets near the penalty area, I would worry if we rely on him to be our play maker.

Dempsey didnt have a great game, but fucking hell what was the Sigurdsson sub all about? When you're pissing your pants and defending for your lives, unless you're making a massive tactical change then you leave it as it is. If they didn't have enough of the initiative then we handed it too them by bringing on the 'lack of confidence' Sig. Dempsey is very average, but how anyone wants the weak as piss, scared of a mouse fart Sigurdsson to play instead of him defies belief.

Bale was excellent first half, then couldn't be arsed second half.

Lennon worked his balls off without the ball, it's totally and utterly pointless comparing any passing stats as some kind of slight on Lennon when he has the insipid Defoe up front trying to bring others into the game. Sterling saw the ball a lot because Suarez did as well, if the latter got injured the former would struggle to get in the game as much.

Defoe. Falcao must have shit himself with laughter after last night.

Finally on the tactics, people used to say the lottery football was not the way to sustain a challenge for competing with the elite. Fucking hell, it's a lot more sustainable than the shite we served up last night that's for sure. It'll work sometimes, but we desperately need to find a happy medium.

Lloris - 6
Walker -7
Dawson - 5
Gallas - 4.9
Vertonghen - 6
Sandro - 5
Dembele - 6
Lennon - 6.5
Dempsey - 5.5
Bale - 7.5
Defoe - N/A

Subs

Fuck - 3
Off - 4

There's fair points but also some major bollocks in there SB. They had the ball because we let them have it ? We didn't let them, we were just fucking awful. Awful at moving for for each other, awful at passing to each other and awful at stopping them have it. Even if, and I dispute we were, you are trying to play a pragmatic counter attacking approach, you still have to press the opposition and win the ball back quickly to get your breaks in before they are set. We didn't do that either, apart from the first ten and last ten.

And if you run a replay of their goal you'll perhaps not be marking Dawson higher than Gallas. Neither were good on the night, but Dawson was fucking atrocious, as usual, at the set piece they scored from. Stands about 4 yards from his marker, then gets no where near him with the challenge. Three games running Dawson has done this on a goal. And it wasn't zonal, I've looked, everyone other defender has a marker.

Walker, who generally had his best defensive game for months (I agree with your marking him higher than the others), also lets his man get the better of him. Gallas is the only one who sticks tight to his man (Suarez) the whole time.

And Lennon isn't just this insipid with Defoe in the side, he's like it 9/10 games no matter who's up front and always has been. As far as working goes he makes a token sprint but hardly ever engages or meaningfully presses or challenges, he just jockeys from about two yards away.

Sigurdsson was brought on I think because we couldn't retain the football and I can understand the logic, it just made little difference.

 

[Blake Griffin]

If we are going to talk in general terms about goals scored we need to talk about goals conceded too, and goal difference. Liverpool, maybe because their players work harder off the ball, have also conceded 5 less than us. Up until last night we both had identical GD. When they can add another player to chip in with end product and goals they will be a serious threat IMO.

IMO the only reason we won last night was Gareth Bale. The difference between us being where Liverpool are and not is Gareth Bale. In fact we'd probably be lower than them (using your simplistic formulaic approach). He has scored 6 goals and 1 assist this season. Liverpool have a striker scoring at a better rate than Defoe and working much harder than ours, contributing more to team play and defensively, but they literally have no-one else chipping in with the kind of end product Gareth Bale does for us. Their next highest scorer after Suarez, has 1 goal.

When Liverpool improve this area, they will be higher than us, I have no doubt, because they already play much better football.

As much as I moan about Bale's defensive frailty, offensively last season and already this he is a major contributor to our productivity. Which is why for all his defensive laziness, I still rate him (Even last night I gave him the joint highest score of any outfield player). He also sees more ball and is always more involved in team play than Lennon, who really is a weak player. Doesn't contribute enough end product (and never has) doesn't contribute enough in team play and doesn't do enough defensively or off the ball.

so gareth bale was the difference and you scored him 6 out of 10

 

[Bus-Conductor]

At no point in that game did we play scintillating football. We hit them with a couple of quick breaks. And they didn't just pass the ball and create nothing.

 

[guiltyparty]

Interesting to see Dembele start to get some flak

I wouldn't be harsh on him on his first game back but I did think everyone was wetting themselves a little bit over him

He has such a great style to him, his turn of pace, his dropped shoulder, that it seemed to cover up that he did bugger all of note, not to mention us being over-run in midfield

But his win ratio stats still look good and no doubt with almost 90 mins under his belt he'll be better next game

 

[jonathanhotspur]

Neither were good on the night, but Dawson was fucking atrocious, as usual, at the set piece they scored from. Stands about 4 yards from his marker, then gets no where near him with the challenge. Three games running Dawson has done this on a goal. And it wasn't zonal, I've looked, everyone other defender has a marker.

I don't see Vertonghen or Dawson marking anyone in that passage of play, BC. Why do you say Agger was Dawson's man? Was Daws marking him at most other set pieces on the night?