- May 11, 2005
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When Keegan said something similar just a couple of weeks ago regarding the toon he was lacking ambition & belief wasn't he?
But my point has always been for a manger to be successful, there has to be a realistic margin of improvment. In that the previous manager has to have been doing enough things wrong for the new coach to come in and have an impact. For example, you said what Ramos did at Sevila as remarkable. But if you look carefully at the situation, it wasn't quite as remarkable as is made out. The previous coach had taken them from the segunda divsion into La Liga and they only missed out on CL, on the final day of the season. Yet his record before and since leaving Sevilla suggests he's a pretty average coach at best. So there was clearly a decent margin for improvement and on top of that the club had improved each season for 5 years running. Ramos in effect just carried on the improvement at the same rate as the previous coach. Since Ramos has left, Sevilla have actually slighlty improved. Their PPG is the same and had the league started when he left, they'd have finished 3rd, ahead of Barca and only 3pts from second. This is actually better than Ramos managed. All this was achieved by a coach that had never managed a 1st team before. So it puts in persepctive the true effect of Ramos's managerial impact. He did a very good job, but isn't the miracle worker many have made him out to be. And it's this reputation as a miracle worker that could be his downfall with the Spurs fans.
The key at Tottenham, is that BMJ is clearly not an average coach (unlike Caparos who Ramos replaced at Sevilla). The margin of improvement at Spurs is far smaller, infact probably non existent (in terms of coaching). Unlike Jiminez was able to at Sevilla, Ramos wasn't able to improve on Jols results from last season. In fact he only managed to match Jols results in his first season, despite having a massively better squad. It just shows just how much tougher the job is at Spurs than at Sevilla. To put it in simple terms, it's much easier to have an impact when you are replacing Souness than it is when replacing Feguson. At Sevilla, Ramos was replacing a Souness type, whilst at SPurs he's replacing a Ferguson type. I think Jol was right when he said not even Mourinho could have done a better job. Until our fans realise that, I think Ramos will be in for a tough ride.
I think the key impact he's had for us, is that he's made the board aware of what is really needed. It seems before Ramos arrived the board genuinley believed we had a sqaud capable of challenging the top 4. But now Ramos has come in and made it pretty clear we don't. For me the key to success is to buy much better than we have since 2006. The purchases of Woodgate, Modric and Hutton are gret starts, but to have any hope of finishing in the to 4, I think we'' need at least 2 other quality signings. And even then it will be difficult, but the trouble is, if we don't I assure you people will start going on about how Jol did just aswell or even better with a far worse squad.
Deadwood, interesting topic title, bearing little relation to the content of the post. Have you considered a career working for the red tops?
Are you comparing ADO Den Haag with Spurs? I didn't say he didn't do well in Holland - I said he managed small clubs. There is no PSV, Ajax or Feynoord on that list is there? I also really don't see how you can compare being Man U's assistant with the top job at Spurs either. So Sir Alex wanted him to put out the cones - big deal. He didn't hire him though did he? Wonder why? :shrug:
I thought I expalined what I meant by small club manager in my earlier post. Its about attitude and ambition. Jol showed very little - we always sat back on leads, we hit the ball long, he wouldn't play wingers away from home, running the ball into the corners at home to shit sides when winning. These were traits of a small club manager IMHO. At no stage did I say that managing a small club precludes you from managing a big one, you have to start somehwhere - but its how you do it. To compare Jol's abilities as a manager with Clough is laughable. You lost me with the Keegan and Southgate bit...
At the end of the day, I'm glad Levy, Comolli and co felt the same way as me and got rid of him. Nice bloke, great with the press, always went on about how much he loved Spurs - all admirable qualities, but was very limited as a manager - in my opinion (and others').
Erm... because Jol turned it down? And if you think that the Assistant Manager at Man U puts out cones then you need to look at Man U's structure a little more closely.
I'm sorry, but that's utter tosh. There isn't a 'small club handbook' that states that a small club must sit back on leads, not play wingers away from home etc, etc.
The reason I raised Southgate et al is in answer to your assertion that Jol didn't belong at Spurs because he had only managed small clubs. The names I raised went straight from playing to managing decent-sized clubs.
Pardon me, but at what point did I compare Clough to Jol? Obviously you don't understand what I was saying when I talked about Clough. I was saying that the size of the club is immaterial, as demonstrated by Clough taking relatively small clubs to major honours. I hope that's a little clearer.
can't remember beating man u away, unless you are including the goal that never wasAhem. Jol beat two top four teams, Chelski at home, Man U away. That is unless you prefer the view you get with your head wedged up the establishment's ass. Each to their own.
can't remember beating man u away, unless you are including the goal that never was
:|Jol Manager Of Hamburg Just Makes Me Laugh
Hamburg ...Jol...... Lol
why dont jol come out and admit the mistakes he made at spurs which stopped us breaking into the top 4 two years in a row !!!! god im glad he has gone the blind faith people had/has in him really pisses me off
That's the one. I don't care what THE MAN says, we stuffed em in their own back yard and every Man U fan I know was embarassed into conceding they were beaten even if we didn't get the three points awarded after. Jol gets the credit for a win at OT from me, cos that's what happened on the day. His much-denigrated record against the top 4 isn't accurate and I'll continue to say so.
I got some convoluted neg rep for that post from a loser calling me a loser for not recognising that Spurs are losers, brightened my morning right up that has.
Jol Manager Of Hamburg Just Makes Me Laugh
Hamburg ...Jol...... Lol