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MOTD thread

daveduvet

Well-Known Member
Oct 6, 2008
5,638
15,337
He didn’t accuse the government of being nazis though did he? Still why let the facts get in the way of fake outrage
He never called them N*zis. He said:

'This is just an immeasurably cruel policy directed at the most vulnerable people in language that is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the '30s'
(Just responding to your response btw)
 

Thenewcat

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2019
3,040
10,499
How is it closer to the truth? Explain? Freedom is not being eroded.
Freedom is being eroded because 1) the new rules are a flagrant breach of international law (here’s a hint: when someone suggesting a policy says it pushes the boundaries of international law, it’s breaking international law) and 2). Free speech is being eroded
 

McFlash

In the corner, eating crayons.
Oct 19, 2005
13,004
46,666
Do you not read the article I linked by a qualified historian?

I'll repost it.


Is Johnathon Pie a recognised expert now?

Lineaker hasn't done this because he actually cares about the plight of immigrants. The fact is that immigration, is different to the issue surrounding people travelling illegally on boats.

He's skirting over the actual issues, just to push his own political agenda.
Yeah, I read the article.
It goes on about the Holocaust a lot but I don't recall Lineker mentioning that at all?
I think he was more referring to the type of nationalistic rhetoric used by the Nazi party early in their reign, used to whip the German population into a frenzy.

And I don't know if Pie is an expert in anything or nothing but he speaks a lot of sense in that video.
More sense than either of the two articles you've posted, both of which seem to rather be missing the point in my view.
 

beats1

Well-Known Member
Feb 22, 2010
30,040
29,630
Funny how presenters at the BBC need to be perceived to be impartial, whereas if you are running the organisation political bias is pretty much a job requirement
View attachment 123699
Also its worth noting that Robbie Gibb was one of the leading forces behind GB News, funny how the nut jobs who wanted to start the British Fox News ended up in the top positions at the BBC
 

DarwinSpur

Well-Known Member
Dec 30, 2020
6,019
10,625
I think it's important not to distort what he actually said. He hasn't accused the government of being Nazis. He's accused the government of using language that is similar to what was used by the Nazis. Some might say I'm just being pedantic, but there's a massive difference.

If this were true then why did he not say "language reminiscent of 2010's Britain" or "New Labour Britain" or "Thatchers Britain" or "1960's Britain" with rivers of blood speeches.

Or literally hundreds of other liberal democratic nations in dozens of post war eras where similar language has been employed by politicians of every side of the chamber on the subject of illegal immigration- driven by the fact it's a hot button issue with voters?

We all know why. He was talking about NAZIS because that's where Godwins fucking law demands social media goes.

Bizarre that people are deploying the "he didn't mean what he clearly meant" argument. Most people agree with him BECAUSE they know exactly what he meant :ROFLMAO:
 

DarwinSpur

Well-Known Member
Dec 30, 2020
6,019
10,625
Yeah, I read the article.
It goes on about the Holocaust a lot but I don't recall Lineker mentioning that at all?
I think he was more referring to the type of nationalistic rhetoric used by the Nazi party early in their reign, used to whip the German population into a frenzy.

And I don't know if Pie is an expert in anything or nothing but he speaks a lot of sense in that video.
More sense than either of the two articles you've posted, both of which seem to rather be missing the point in my view.

Jonathan Pie made his name taking coin from Russian state television. Whether he's right or not on any particular subject I'm taking anything he has to say with a freighter full of salt :D
 

McFlash

In the corner, eating crayons.
Oct 19, 2005
13,004
46,666
If this were true then why did he not say "language reminiscent of 2010's Britain" or "New Labour Britain" or "Thatchers Britain" or "1960's Britain" with rivers of blood speeches.

Or literally hundreds of other liberal democratic nations in dozens of post war eras where similar language has been employed by politicians of every side of the chamber on the subject of illegal immigration- driven by the fact it's a hot button issue with voters?

We all know why. He was talking about NAZIS because that's where Godwins fucking law demands social media goes.

Bizarre that people are deploying the "he didn't mean what he clearly meant" argument. Most people agree with him BECAUSE they know exactly what he meant :ROFLMAO:
Maybe that is used because it's such a massive lesson in history, something that's been taught in schools ever since it happened?
The current government is trying to paint immigration as an invasion, and that all immigrants should be treated as criminals.
That, for me, is an attempt to dehumanise people and have them viewed as second class citizens and while I'm not studious in 1930's German politics, that's pretty much how the Nazi party spoke about certain sections of society as they were building their power.
That, I think, is where the comparisons are being made.
 

philll

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
9,569
32,973
If this were true then why did he not say "language reminiscent of 2010's Britain" or "New Labour Britain" or "Thatchers Britain" or "1960's Britain" with rivers of blood speeches.

Or literally hundreds of other liberal democratic nations in dozens of post war eras where similar language has been employed by politicians of every side of the chamber on the subject of illegal immigration- driven by the fact it's a hot button issue with voters?

We all know why. He was talking about NAZIS because that's where Godwins fucking law demands social media goes.

Bizarre that people are deploying the "he didn't mean what he clearly meant" argument. Most people agree with him BECAUSE they know exactly what he meant :ROFLMAO:
Because he never called the government Nazis, he said the language being used is reminiscent of that used by the Nazis (when they were planting seeds to get everyone to hate who they wanted them to hate).
 

McFlash

In the corner, eating crayons.
Oct 19, 2005
13,004
46,666
Jonathan Pie made his name taking coin from Russian state television. Whether he's right or not on any particular subject I'm taking anything he has to say with a freighter full of salt :D
Did he? I thought he was pretty much just a political comedian?
 

DarwinSpur

Well-Known Member
Dec 30, 2020
6,019
10,625
Maybe that is used because it's such a massive lesson in history, something that's been taught in schools ever since it happened?
The current government is trying to paint immigration as an invasion, and that all immigrants should be treated as criminals.
That, for me, is an attempt to dehumanise people and have them viewed as second class citizens and while I'm not studious in 1930's German politics, that's pretty much how the Nazi party spoke about certain sections of society as they were building their power.
That, I think, is where the comparisons are being made.
Yes. He was calling the Government Nazis. :D
 

philll

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
9,569
32,973
Did he? I thought he was pretty much just a political comedian?
No, he did not. It's a line people who don't like what he (the comedian) has to say trot out to discredit him. He worked for RT for about 3 months before he made a video about Trump which went viral.
 

Thenewcat

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2019
3,040
10,499
Yes he did. You don't have to agree with the BBC impartiality guidelines or govt interference but when lineker writes "reminiscent of 1930's Germany" we all know very well what he meant - the blokes trying to steal the Arc of the Covenant not, say, modernist fucking architecture or something...
Sheesh
No he didn’t. He said language being used was reminiscent. That isn’t the same thing at all, and various nazi historians have agreed with him (some have already been posted on this thread)
 

McFlash

In the corner, eating crayons.
Oct 19, 2005
13,004
46,666
Jonathan Pie made his name taking coin from Russian state television. Whether he's right or not on any particular subject I'm taking anything he has to say with a freighter full of salt :D
Do you have a credible link to this claim because everything I can find states that Jonathan Pie is a character created by a comedian and actor.
You do know that he's not a real person, right?
 

beats1

Well-Known Member
Feb 22, 2010
30,040
29,630
If this were true then why did he not say "language reminiscent of 2010's Britain" or "New Labour Britain" or "Thatchers Britain" or "1960's Britain" with rivers of blood speeches.

Or literally hundreds of other liberal democratic nations in dozens of post war eras where similar language has been employed by politicians of every side of the chamber on the subject of illegal immigration- driven by the fact it's a hot button issue with voters?

We all know why. He was talking about NAZIS because that's where Godwins fucking law demands social media goes.

Bizarre that people are deploying the "he didn't mean what he clearly meant" argument. Most people agree with him BECAUSE they know exactly what he meant :ROFLMAO:
I dont know, maybe because they are literally using the language of nazis prior to the war

You can't call them the similar to any of our previous governments, because none of them literally said break UN conventions and international LAW
 

DarwinSpur

Well-Known Member
Dec 30, 2020
6,019
10,625
View them?
No he didn’t. He said language being used was reminiscent. That isn’t the same thing at all, and various nazi historians have agreed with him (some have already been posted on this thread)

As I posted above the "language being used" is reminiscent of literally dozens of other eras by political parties of all stripes. Lineker chose that one because he meant NAZIS. We all do that. The fact that you are disagreeing with it is utterly bizarre :ROFLMAO:



No, he did not. It's a line people who don't like what he (the comedian) has to say trot out to discredit him. He worked for RT for about 3 months before he made a video about Trump which went viral.

Um... "no he did not" - then you go on to say "yes he did actually make his name working for RT". :cautious:
 

leelee

Well-Known Member
Oct 6, 2004
4,376
2,117
No he didn’t. He said language being used was reminiscent. That isn’t the same thing at all, and various nazi historians have agreed with him (some have already been posted on this thread)


Reminiscent: tending to remind one of something.

So he is comparing the language of the Nazi's thus comparing current government to a murderous and barbaric regime. It was a stupid comment to make and he should apologise. I get he doesn't agree with government policy and he is entitled to that opinion. But to compare government policy/language to 1930's Germany is stupid and with a platform like his, a little dangerous too.

There are strong emotions at play here, on both sides.
 

DarwinSpur

Well-Known Member
Dec 30, 2020
6,019
10,625
I dont know, maybe because they are literally using the language of nazis prior to the war

You can't call them the similar to any of our previous governments, because none of them literally said break UN conventions and international LAW


YES THIS IS WHY LINEKER MEANT THEY ARE NAZIS.


Ffs this thread is bizarre. People who think the Govt are acting like Nazis agree when Lineker calls them Nazis (albeit in very obvious "code") - then get angry when people say Lineker called the Goverment nazis.

Have you all gone mad?
 

Thenewcat

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2019
3,040
10,499
If this were true then why did he not say "language reminiscent of 2010's Britain" or "New Labour Britain" or "Thatchers Britain" or "1960's Britain" with rivers of blood speeches.

Or literally hundreds of other liberal democratic nations in dozens of post war eras where similar language has been employed by politicians of every side of the chamber on the subject of illegal immigration- driven by the fact it's a hot button issue with voters?

We all know why. He was talking about NAZIS because that's where Godwins fucking law demands social media goes.

Bizarre that people are deploying the "he didn't mean what he clearly meant" argument. Most people agree with him BECAUSE they know exactly what he meant :ROFLMAO:
Claiming asylum is not illegal immigration. It’s a universally recognised human right that the current policy seeks to strip away
 

Thenewcat

Well-Known Member
Aug 8, 2019
3,040
10,499
Reminiscent: tending to remind one of something.

So he is comparing the language of the Nazi's thus comparing current government to a murderous and barbaric regime. It was a stupid comment to make and he should apologise. I get he doesn't agree with government policy and he is entitled to that opinion. But to compare government policy/language to 1930's Germany is stupid and with a platform like his, a little dangerous too.

There are strong emotions at play here, on both sides.
Stop conflating policy and language, it’s completely disingenuous. He didn’t compare the policy to Nazi Germany, just the language being used.
 
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