The Rugby Thread

[Japhet]

My main concern from that game is that England will think that style of rugby is the way forwards.

It's not a style that can win a World Cup though in this day and age.

We need some serious progression.

I'd say the tactics were chosen for that specific match. why wouldn't you kick a lot when you had a height advantage over both wingers and a player like Freddie Steward who can beat anyone in the air? I doubt very much that Borthwick would have done the same again if we'd made the final with the size of NZ's wingers.

 

[talkshowhost86]

I'd say the tactics were chosen for that specific match. why wouldn't you kick a lot when you had a height advantage over both wingers and a player like Freddie Steward who can beat anyone in the air? I doubt very much that Borthwick would have done the same again if we'd made the final with the size of NZ's wingers.

If you look at Borthwick at Leicester and in his few months with England I don't think there's anything to suggest he'd do anything else.

 

[talkshowhost86]

It does seem silly to be so negative about England after what was a very brave performance against a far superior team.

But I do genuinely believe that England now need to rip it up and start again with the next World Cup as the aim.

And, for me, that means phasing out the players who won't be there in four years time...including Farrell...and I just don't see Borthwick doing that.

I would happily see England take a bit of a hammering in the next 6Ns if we played a younger team, with a view on the future.

But it really wouldn't surprise me to see most of last night's XV starting our next match.

 

[TheHoddleWaddle]

Regardless of your opinion on borthwick's tactics. (I'm not a fan either). Rugby has always been a tacticians game and love it or hate it, kicking and forwards play is all part and parcel.

That was a tactical display by England. When you look at where they were prior to the tournament, this is a big turn around in performance levels. The turn over ball was outstanding..

Let's see what he can do going forwards. I remain a bit sceptical of his approach but at least England are in a place to dust off the cobwebs of Eddie f****g Jones.

Time to blood the new talent and see the last of the class of Vunipola

 

[midoshairband]

It does seem silly to be so negative about England after what was a very brave performance against a far superior team.

But I do genuinely believe that England now need to rip it up and start again with the next World Cup as the aim.

And, for me, that means phasing out the players who won't be there in four years time...including Farrell...and I just don't see Borthwick doing that.

I would happily see England take a bit of a hammering in the next 6Ns if we played a younger team, with a view on the future.

But it really wouldn't surprise me to see most of last night's XV starting our next match.

Sir Clive was spot on last night - current side is just too slow with speed of thought and play to keep up with the other better nations. even some of the 'minnows' play quicker than we do.

needs a reset, not for the thinking that last nights tactic is a way forward. there is some promising talent in this country, they need to be given their heads now and phase out the likes if Vunipola etc.

 

[Arnoldtoo]

I can't see Billy playing for England again tbh. Bless him, but his two appearances on the pitch produced more for SA than they did for England.

I wouldn't be too quick to ditch Farrell, even though I don't think he will be there for the next WC. He has a lot to pass on to the new group, whoever it may be, and we shouldn't let our prejudice dismiss him.

It will be interesting to see who starts at #10 in England's next game ...

 

[talkshowhost86]

I can't see Billy playing for England again tbh. Bless him, but his two appearances on the pitch produced more for SA than they did for England.

I wouldn't be too quick to ditch Farrell, even though I don't think he will be there for the next WC. He has a lot to pass on to the new group, whoever it may be, and we shouldn't let our prejudice dismiss him.

It will be interesting to see who starts at #10 in England's next game ...

George, Cole, Marler, Lawes, Vunipola, Care, Youngs, Farrell, Daly, Ford, Tuilagi and May...I'm just not sure what any of them will add to England by continuing to play.

Farrell is the one there is the strongest argument for to keep, but I'm actually not sure his approach is the sort of influence we want on young players going forward.

His lack of discipline has been an active hindrance to England in recent years and his excellent kicking doesn't outweigh that for me.

Nevertheless I'd be gobsmacked if he didn't start the next competitive game as captain.

 

[Arnoldtoo]

George, Cole, Marler, Lawes, Vunipola, Care, Youngs, Farrell, Daly, Ford, Tuilagi and May...I'm just not sure what any of them will add to England by continuing to play.

Farrell is the one there is the strongest argument for to keep, but I'm actually not sure his approach is the sort of influence we want on young players going forward.

His lack of discipline has been an active hindrance to England in recent years and his excellent kicking doesn't outweigh that for me.

Nevertheless I'd be gobsmacked if he didn't start the next competitive game as captain.

Farrell is probably in the best position to warn the youngsters against letting your passion occasionally boil over, like the old con talking to a class of schoolkids.

I'd agree with all your discards, except I'd keep Courtney for a while unless we've got an exceptional talent to replace him.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Farrell is probably in the best position to warn the youngsters against letting your passion occasionally boil over, like the old con talking to a class of schoolkids.

I'd agree with all your discards, except I'd keep Courtney for a while unless we've got an exceptional talent to replace him.

I would agree that Farrell could do that if he'd learnt that lesson himself at any point.

 

[Arnoldtoo]

I would agree that Farrell could do that if he'd learnt that lesson himself at any point.

I think he's learned it by now; it's applying it he has trouble with!

I presume you want to defenestrate him and build your team around a certain Mr Smith?

 

[talkshowhost86]

I think he's learned it by now; it's applying it he has trouble with!

I presume you want to defenestrate him and build your team around a certain Mr Smith?

If you aren't applying it in the big games then you haven't learned it.

As for Smith...I'd love to see a manager brave enough to build an England team around Smith (I.e. not having Farrell as his babysitter) but I just can't see it under Borthwick.

There's gaps in talent in some positions in England right now, but a back-line built around Mitchell/Van Poortvliet, Lawrence, Arundell and Steward...perhaps Malins as well...is a good starting point if you are building towards 2027.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Do we think this will work?

 

[Pink_Floyd]

Do we think this will work?

I think it's the same mistake SANZAR made, watering down your product. Hopefully i'm proven wrong.

 

[talkshowhost86]

I think it's the same mistake SANZAR made, watering down your product. Hopefully i'm proven wrong.

I like the idea of the lower tier nations playing against each other more often and having a chance to play in the top division if they do well.

I also like the idea of making the test matches feel more important.

But it does all hinge on everyone taking it seriously.

Also good to see the draw for the next World Cup will happen in the same decade as the actual tournament.

 

[Arnoldtoo]

Good luck for the future, Leigh.

Wales great Halfpenny to retire from Test rugby

Wales and British and Irish Lions great Leigh Halfpenny announces he will retire from international rugby.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[UncleBuck]

One thing the IRB could have looked at was the use of B Teams from the top ranked nations to play against tier two teams, four groups of four with the top four ranked teams in the world providing a B Team, which would then lead to the semis and a final.
Similar format to the Johnstones Trophy where the PL teams stick an u21 team out in a league and knockout format.
Then you could have Japan and Fiji join the championship, the winners and runners up of the northern and southern hemisphere then play in semis and a final whilst anyone else left can arrange their own home/away tests.
That way the Tier two teams get to play against some stronger teams as let’s face it there is absolutely no point in some of them playing against some of the Tier One nations.
I’m all for development but what would SA or Romania gain from playing against each other?

 

[jurgen11]

sooooo..i am going to Paris this weekend, managed to blag a ticket to both games. Might blow out the England Pumas game and find a nice sports bar for the Palace match .. lol

 

[Johnny J]

Let's hope this game isn't decided by contentious scrum calls.

 

[talkshowhost86]

Nowhere near the neck Wayne?

 

[Johnny J]

Damage was his knee, not the neck. I think that's a cruciate or medial rupture.