Spurs Youth Thread 22/23

[Huddlebone]

Really glad we didnt take Madueke such a selfish player with a bad workrate

 

[mdharris]

Skipp’s got some work to do, if he wants to get to next level. Gomes and Jones have looked much much better in the England U21 midfield.

Skipp has a couple of issues - he’s very one footed, he does not find space well, and he’s not able to pivot well (it looks to be a body positioning issue - he’s often too face-on when coming to receive the ball). He gets himself trapped in places where the only pass is a negative one backwards. I would keep him at Spurs - he seems a positive, dedicated character, and he can cover in rotation/ in the cups. And there’s space to improve those weaknesses.

But there’s no coincidence that England are not playing through Israel’s midfield as easily as before Skipp replaced Gomes.

 

[thekneaf]

I don’t like saying this, but Skipp is currently not good enough. Gomes and Jones have looked much much better in the England U21 midfield.

Skipp has a couple of issues - he’s very one footed, he does not find space well, and he’s not able to pivot well (it looks to be a body positioning issue - he’s often too face-on when coming to receive the ball). He gets himself trapped in places where the only pass is a negative one backwards. I would keep him at Spurs - he seems a positive, dedicated character, and he can cover in rotation/ in the cups. And there’s space to improve those weaknesses.

But there’s no coincidence that England are not playing through Israel’s midfield as easily as before Skipp replaced Gomes.

The body position thing will get either fixed by Postecoglou or lead to him leaving very very soon. Hopefully the former. By all reports he sounds like a coachable player, I wouldn't be all that surprised if no one had him working on that all that much. For Postecoglou it will be all he works on, he won't allow negative passing gumming up his midfield.

 

[mdharris]

The body position thing will get either fixed by Postecoglou or lead to him leaving very very soon. Hopefully the former. By all reports he sounds like a coachable player, I wouldn't be all that surprised if no one had him working on that all that much. For Postecoglou it will be all he works on, he won't allow negative passing gumming up his midfield.

Fully agreed. All of those issues are fixable to different degrees. The way Ange likes to play, Skipp will need to adapt. I’m curious to see if he can do it.

 

[Westmorlandspur]

Really glad we didnt take Madueke such a selfish player with a bad workrate

It was never our choice. He wanted to leave at 16 and he did. He’s obviously a lot better than what we have had of a similar age

 

[sidford]

 

[neilp]

It’s a shame he’s gone, but good luck to him.

 

[Spurzinho]

We aren't owed a penny in compo. He's out of contract and FFP is only valid domestically.

 

[Locotoro]

We aren't owed a penny in compo. He's out of contract and FFP is only valid domestically.

European clubs doing to us British clubs what we did to them in the 2000s

 

[Locotoro]

I was going to put this in the Sancho thread but this seems a far more relevant place for it because I'm interested in the views of others on this:

Has anyone else started seeing the growing trend of young British exports leaving English Academies, going abroad for a season or two and coming back in superstar deals.....and then struggling to recapture the form (or in other words) justify the hype?

You see players like Sancho and Pogba who leave UK and come back on huge transfers and then don't get anywhere near to the expected level of performance. Madueke signed to Chelsea after a couple of great seasons in Germany and after 12 games has won only twice (once off the bench for 6 minutes) - granted Chelsea have been awful but he's struggling in the U21 set up too. Does anyone realistically believe that Edwards would be anything more than a flop were we to resign him?

I don't know, maybe I'm seeing a trend which doesn't exist but these players are being billed as the return of the Messiah for the club's in question but maybe seem to be better suited to slower European style of football than what we see in the Premier League

 

[bombarda]

We aren't owed a penny in compo. He's out of contract and FFP is only valid domestically.

I don’t think this is right, is it? We’re due for any player under 23 within UEFA, as long as we’ve offered a fair contract ourselves (which I assume we have). It was all part of the Bosman ruling, way back when.

 

[Spurzinho]

I don’t think this is right, is it? We’re due for any player under 23 within UEFA, as long as we’ve offered a fair contract ourselves (which I assume we have). It was all part of the Bosman ruling, way back when.

Don't believe so. It's why English youngsters are going abroad in the first place. If they move domestically the lawyers get involved, hence Nya Kirby's move to Chelsea falling apart. If he'd gone to PSV as Noni did then there'd have been nothing we could have done. Mundle's going to Belgium and I don't believe we have any recourse.

 

[spurs9]

Don't believe so. It's why English youngsters are going abroad in the first place. If they move domestically the lawyers get involved, hence Nya Kirby's move to Chelsea falling apart. If he'd gone to PSV as Noni did then there'd have been nothing we could have done. Mundle's going to Belgium and I don't believe we have any recourse.

England has additional rules to UEFA.
UEFA rules for players U23 = Compensation paid out on first pro contract with new club and 5% of transfer fee for any transfers until the end of the season the player turns 23.

English rule = Players under the age of 24, who are out of contract, are only available on a free transfer if released by the club holding the players' license.

That is why lawyers get involved.

 

[spurs9]

I was going to put this in the Sancho thread but this seems a far more relevant place for it because I'm interested in the views of others on this:

Has anyone else started seeing the growing trend of young British exports leaving English Academies, going abroad for a season or two and coming back in superstar deals.....and then struggling to recapture the form (or in other words) justify the hype?

You see players like Sancho and Pogba who leave UK and come back on huge transfers and then don't get anywhere near to the expected level of performance. Madueke signed to Chelsea after a couple of great seasons in Germany and after 12 games has won only twice (once off the bench for 6 minutes) - granted Chelsea have been awful but he's struggling in the U21 set up too. Does anyone realistically believe that Edwards would be anything more than a flop were we to resign him?

I don't know, maybe I'm seeing a trend which doesn't exist but these players are being billed as the return of the Messiah for the club's in question but maybe seem to be better suited to slower European style of football than what we see in the Premier League

Madueke played in the Netherlands not Germany. I wouldn't say he had two great seasons either, he had lots of injury issues and was mostly a sub when fit. Out of his 47 league appearances for PSV, only 19 were starts.

 

[bombarda]

I was going to put this in the Sancho thread but this seems a far more relevant place for it because I'm interested in the views of others on this:

Has anyone else started seeing the growing trend of young British exports leaving English Academies, going abroad for a season or two and coming back in superstar deals.....and then struggling to recapture the form (or in other words) justify the hype?

You see players like Sancho and Pogba who leave UK and come back on huge transfers and then don't get anywhere near to the expected level of performance. Madueke signed to Chelsea after a couple of great seasons in Germany and after 12 games has won only twice (once off the bench for 6 minutes) - granted Chelsea have been awful but he's struggling in the U21 set up too. Does anyone realistically believe that Edwards would be anything more than a flop were we to resign him?

I don't know, maybe I'm seeing a trend which doesn't exist but these players are being billed as the return of the Messiah for the club's in question but maybe seem to be better suited to slower European style of football than what we see in the Premier League

I have plenty of friends in Germany due to my wife being German, and they all said the same thing about Sancho, and it possibly applies to a lot of others too… he was very very inconsistent, but the British media would always cover his good games and not mention his bad, so the hype grew and grew. He could go missing for game after game after game, then suddenly have a two goal two assist game. The latter would be all over English football twitter, with the previous 2-3 games being ignored. It does make sense and can imagine it happening a lot. Bellingham probably being an exception. He really is brilliant.

 

[Krafty]

I don’t think it’s limited to British players, happens with other nationalities when they come to England young and then return to their homeland (Fabregas comes to mind, but the bar was set a lot higher for him when he went back to Barca).

Partly British players going abroad is still a novelty, and I also think when you return to England some of the drive can disappear - the money these players get on their return is massive, and unless you want to kick on a plateauing is almost inevitable.

Again, happens with all nationalities.

 

[bombarda]

Does anybody know what happened to Enock Asante? He was playing college football in the States, but didn't seem to feature last season. All gone very quiet

 

[wlhatwhl]

I have plenty of friends in Germany due to my wife being German, and they all said the same thing about Sancho, and it possibly applies to a lot of others too… he was very very inconsistent, but the British media would always cover his good games and not mention his bad, so the hype grew and grew. He could go missing for game after game after game, then suddenly have a two goal two assist game. The latter would be all over English football twitter, with the previous 2-3 games being ignored. It does make sense and can imagine it happening a lot. Bellingham probably being an exception. He really is brilliant.

Sancho played for Dortmund against Spurs at Wembley in the CL in 2019. Before hand all the press and media covered focused on him, the rising English star in Germany. He looked dangerous in the first half without creating anything but in teh second half, as I remember it, was anonymous with Spurs winning comfortably.

 

[Locotoro]

I don’t think it’s limited to British players, happens with other nationalities when they come to England young and then return to their homeland (Fabregas comes to mind, but the bar was set a lot higher for him when he went back to Barca).

Partly British players going abroad is still a novelty, and I also think when you return to England some of the drive can disappear - the money these players get on their return is massive, and unless you want to kick on a plateauing is almost inevitable.

Again, happens with all nationalities.

So this is where I'm at too. I don't think its the wages that are causing the players to lose drive I am more inclined to think that the player was never that good/consistent in the first place.
@spurs9 I stand corrected, yes it was Netherlands (not sure why but got RB Leipzig in my head instead of PSV)

 

[Lilywhite Rose]