Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[jay2040]

Why are you mentioning Dier when he hasn't played a single competitive minute, and isn't even on the bench?

Sure he is here because things weren't going well. That's neither here nor there when it comes to assessing who is up to it in his view. He can only make that judgement on what he sees, under his way of playing.

I guess I'm just surprised that lots of people seem so surprised. We've been told over and over that a) there will be plenty of bumps along the way. This won't be the last. and b) That Ange insists that he and no one else assesses the players suitability for the squad and he does it his way whether we, Levy, or pundits like it or not.

Down to interpretation of what 'bumps along the way' is as differs for people and being out in the first stage of the cup is not one of them for me!

I guess those that are surprised might be more ambitious than others too and that we could have had a chance at the cup.

 

[PLTuck]

Down to interpretation of what 'bumps along the way' is as differs for people and being out in the first stage of the cup is not one of them for me!

I guess those that are surprised might be more ambitious than others too and that we could have had a chance at the cup.

More ambitious or more unrealistic, considering we are 4 games into what is hopefully a long and fruitful relationship?

How long did it take Pep at City or Klopp at pool to win a domestic cup?

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

Over his two years at Celtic, the most that Ange rotated for any single cup game was four players. In his first cup game at Spurs he rotated nine players.

Stuff like this is so easy to verify - instead of just putting "if its true..."

1st game I checked was the 1st cup game from last season - Ange made 9 changes.

 

[rabbikeane]

Since the same thing happen no matter who manage us, it's likely linked to the manager's bonus payment. I assume there's little in it for cup competitions and minor UEFA competitions. All to earn from league positions and CL progressions.

 

[AtoubaToothpaste]

My biggest takeaway from tonight was the contradiction in what Ange has been saying and what he did (and what he said about why he did it). He's made a big thing in a number of press conferences about putting winning above all else, including individual players. He knew that this was one of only two things we can win this season, and then does what he does, with players that he knows aren't good enough (if they were, they'd already be playing in his first 11). To then come out and say that he did this to test them... well, that's putting the players before the idea of winning. He could have done this in any other game that wasn't a knockout situation.

You don't sub on Scarlett when the priority is to win the game. So that leaves me somewhat upset that we have a manager who has brought so much positivity back to the club tarnishing his own words literally within a week of saying them. It all feels so unnecessary. Losing the game isn't the problem; it's the way he went about it.

That said, I'm 100% behind him and hope he succeeds. Tonight is one to forget and hopefully learn quickly from.

 

[13VanDerBale13]

We lost to Fulham away on pens. Fulham aren't a team we have a divine right to beat.

Exactly, which defeats your argument of making it seem acceptable, to make 9 changes.

 

[Bobbins]

Fulham themselves made 7 changes. You watch Liverpool, United, City, Chelsea, Arsenal. They'll make 6-11 changes in the early rounds. That's what clubs do.

Not making changes would have demotivated the fringe players because they'd wonder when they'll ever get a chance to play. He made 2-3 changes too many for me tonight but I understand why he did.

We lost to Fulham away on pens. Fulham aren't a team we have a divine right to beat.

Interestingly though we have beaten them the last 7 times we've played them at Craven Cottage.

 

[Now it's Spursonal]

Stuff like this is so easy to verify - instead of just putting "if its true..."

1st game I checked was the 1st cup game from last season - Ange made 9 changes.

Well fuck me for trusting someone on the internet No but seriously, apologies for posting false info.

I'm going to delete my post to ensure it doesn't spread misinformation, but keep your post up as a mark of shame for me

(Will say though that in the 6 days after that cup game, Celtic played Rangers in the league and also Real Madrid in the Champions League, so Ange would have had far more valid of a reason to rotate.)

 

[ronzalo]

As disappointed as I am to not go through, I totally understand that at some point he had to try these other players out in a competitive game, and the league is absolutely his (and the club's) priority for good reason.

A good consolation for going out would be if we finally see the end of some players we all know are done now. Hopefully Ange has seen enough to consent to shipping them off and Levy heeds his warnings and bins them off sharpish.

I won’t hold my breathe. Heard that argument before unless the players are sold they end up playing here or there and don’t deliver.

 

[TheSpillage]

I don’t think it’s an over-reaction to be very unhappy about going out tonight. Yes, we drew with a premier league side and, yes, we only went out on penalties. But we were crap. Really crap. And if we hadn’t made so many changes we probably wouldn’t have been so crap.

Going all out to win a cup would’ve been another signal that things are changing for the better. So it’s just really disappointing that we didn’t go all out for the win.

That starting 11 was not too dissimilar from a Conte team. And the performance was not too dissimilar from a Conte team. The frustrating thing is that everything Ange has done so far has been completely dissimilar to Conte and that’s why things have felt so good. Think he missed a trick tonight.

 

[soflapaul]

Pretty shite result today and short term it sucks but it also i get most of Ange's reasoning. He needs to see all of the players under pressure but wholesale changes doens't bring bring out the best in all of the players because too many players were starting for the first time. all of them needed to be eased in. Wiht that said, there is one fly in the ointment with that analysis. the Barca game

Barca Starting 11: Vicario; Porro, Dier, Sanchez, Reguilon; Skipp, Bissouma, Lo Celso; Solomon, Richarlison, Perisic
Vicario to Foster Downgrade
Porro to Royal Wash/ Pick Em
Dier to VDV Massive Upgrade
Reguilon to Davies Wash.Pick Em
Bissouma to Pierre Massive Downgrade

So one would suspect that the starting team would have performed far better today than they did. It wasn't a garbage Barca team that we played against and that Barca team would have beaten Fulham handily. The one decision which doomed us was the Bissouma to Pierre. I like Pierre and he's fine off the bench and can even play 3rd fiddle under the right circumstances. But GLC, Skipp and him certainly had terrible chemistry and their skillsets were less than complimentary.

 

[jolsnogross]

Funny stuff. The big concern on here last year was getting yet another manager who needed to test first hand whether our squad players are up to it. Turns out, they aren't. Same as it ever was.

Is the honeymoon over after a cup exit with the B team and we sign Maguire

 

[sidford]

He says he needed to find out about the players by playing them which is fine but doing so like that last night isn't fair on those players looking to make an impression. Give them a fair crack by playing the bulk of normal side with 3 to 4 of the subs brought in not 9 of them. Like it always has been the team is far to disjointed by making such drastic changes so you aren't setting the new players up to succeed, you are making it near impossible for them to play well.

It was a real misstep from him hopefully we won't see many more terrible decisions like that again from him.

 

[Dave1882]

His comments about no Europe so needs to experiment in the cup are a disgrace in my opinion. The cups should be treated as a priority with best team picked every time.
If he needs to experiment do it on the training ground/organise behind closed doors friendlies. We threw a chance of progression last night meaning we’re gonna be likely 16 going on 17 years between cups…that is not ok and as much as Ange isn’t at fault for that. He has just added another same old chapter. I hope this doesn’t happen again whilst he’s here

 

[coy-spurs1882]

Why all these managers think changing more than half of the starting 11 is a good idea? Everytime its a disaster. Sorry Ange you made a mistake and another chance of winning a trophy gone, all criticism are justifiable.

 

[eViL]

He says he needed to find out about the players by playing them which is fine but doing so like that last night isn't fair on those players looking to make an impression. Give them a fair crack by playing the bulk of normal side with 3 to 4 of the subs brought in not 9 of them. Like it always has been the team is far to disjointed by making such drastic changes so you aren't setting the new players up to succeed, you are making it near impossible for them to play well.

It was a real misstep from him hopefully we won't see many more terrible decisions like that again from him.

The majority of the Team last night were our starting X1 last season. Mourninho and Conte's golden boy was one of our worst players last night.

The reality is we've got the Green Light for a deck clearance now we're out - we're only going to need injury cover now.

Painful rebuild just got a booster.

 

[Hoddle1982]

This isn’t a knee jerk reaction from the majority of fans. That was truly pathetic from the manager and team last night.
For a new manager to basically throw a chance of a trophy in the bin is unacceptable.
Does he not realise that this was the last trophy we actually won?… FIFTEEN YEARS AGO!!!
The other cup we’re in we haven’t won for THIRTY TWO YEARS!!!
The other chance of a trophy we haven’t won for SIXTY TWO YEARS!!!
No team has a right to win any game.
I couldn’t give a shit if other teams make changes.
We are desperate as a fan base to win something and to not give your best chance to do that is criminal.
Just really disappointed after Ange had brought positivity to the club which has just been undone.

 

[coy-spurs1882]

The majority of the Team last night were our starting X1 last season. Mourninho and Conte's golden boy was one of our worst players last night.

The reality is we've got the Green Light for a deck clearance now we're out - we're only going to need injury cover now.

Painful rebuild just got a booster.

the rebuild should start from top management, i.e. ENIC/Levy & co. Pretty sure they asked our managers to prioritize getting top 4 instead of domestic cups. The losing and failure mentality is deep-rooted at our club due to management's "the game is about profit" motto

 

[Danny1]

I’m sorry but a number of the posts in here are a bit over the top. Disappointing yes, “total disgrace” “all his good work undone” etc etc is a bit much.

We are at the very start of a total rebuild of this squad. He cannot play every player in every game, but I also agree he made a mistake in changing a large chunk of the team.

However, had Bissouma played for example over Skipp, and he got a knock we would have the same posters in here saying “should have played Skipp, it’s a disgrace”.

Fact is, that team should have beaten Fulham last night, it was easily good enough too, and the players have let Ange down. It’s a damning verdict on our back up players and shows just how much work is still left to do with our squad.

 

[dk-yid]

Christ on a bike, some of you lot need meds. Miserable bunch of gits.

We lost, it wasn't pretty. So fucking what....

So many opinions in here (good thing!) based on loads of out of the blue assumptions, wild deductions and twisting of Anges own words.

Can't belive that some are already using words like disgraceful.