Defensive record under Ramos??

[mrbrightside73]

Does anyone know the stats for how many we've conceded under Ramos and how it compares to Jol?? I thought myself we'd improved under Ramos,but do the stats back that up??

 

[AngerManagement]

We have still shipped alot of goals under Ramos (four against the likes of Chelsea and Reading) but since his transfer window signings the defense looks a more solid unit and this is without them having extended playing time together.

We may well see a new keeper (although Robinson seems to be recapturing his form) and Bale return to left back, both of which could have a positive impact.

I think many of the goals we ship would also be plugged if we had a more solid and dominate midfield to take the pressure of and stop teams getting to our back line so frequently. This could come from either new players or improved form our our existing players.

What im trying to say is the stats dont really matter at this time, Things have improved under Ramos and I have no doubt will continue to do so (regardless of what the stats suggest)

I would suggest the stats this time next year will be much improved.

 

[robbiesavagehasbreasts]

Scored 68 goals, conceded 42 goals. In all competitions. In 35 games.

 

[buttons]

Scored 68 goals, conceded 42 goals. In all competitions. In 35 games.

I can't believe we score so many goals!! I also can't believe how many we conced! 70 goals in 15 PL games at the Lane :rofl:

 

[AllSeeingEye]

I did some summage and as far as Jol's complete record goes he fairs slightly better than Ramos.

..........W..........D............L
Ramos..41%......23%........36%
Jol.......41%......28%........32%

But Jol picked up a team in much better shape than Ramos did in terms of league position.

However Ramos whoops Jol at the goals per game ratio.

Ramos 2.00 gls per game
Jol 1.41 gls per game

It would be better to compare at the end of the season though.

But as you know, only one manager has won us a cup....

 

[chrissivad]

But Jol picked up a team in much better shape than Ramos did in terms of league position.

In terms of League position yes this season, but not a better team.

Ramos picked up a team that had finished 5th in the league the last two seasons that was low on confidence and going threw a bad patch.

 

[tommyt]

We have still shipped alot of goals under Ramos (four against the likes of Chelsea and Reading) but since his transfer window signings the defense looks a more solid unit and this is without them having extended playing time together.

We may well see a new keeper (although Robinson seems to be recapturing his form) and Bale return to left back, both of which could have a positive impact.

I think many of the goals we ship would also be plugged if we had a more solid and dominate midfield to take the pressure of and stop teams getting to our back line so frequently. This could come from either new players or improved form our our existing players.

What im trying to say is the stats dont really matter at this time, Things have improved under Ramos and I have no doubt will continue to do so (regardless of what the stats suggest)

I would suggest the stats this time next year will be much improved.

:wink:

 

[AllSeeingEye]

I was thinking League position and points-wise though Chris.

Jol's last league position:

...............Pld..W.D..L.GF.GA.GD..Pts
18 Spurs....11...1..4.6.18.23..5....7

Santini's last league position:

...............Pld..W.D..L.GF.GA.GD..Pts
15 Spurs...13...3..4..6.12..16.4....13

 

[chrissivad]

I was thinking League position and points-wise though Chris.

Jol's last league position:

...............Pld..W.D..L.GF.GA.GD..Pts
18 Spurs 11 1 4 6 18 23 5 7

Santini's last league position:

...............Pld..W.D..L.GF.GA.GD..Pts
15 Spurs 13 3 4 6 12 16 4 13

but his last league possition doesn't give you what the team was though.

We hit a bad patch and everyone knows we are a where a better side than 18th in the league. I dont think you can say we had the 18th worse team in the league when Ramos took over. Just a top 8(ish) team going through a bad time.

 

[robbiesavagehasbreasts]

I did some summage and as far as Jol's complete record goes he fairs slightly better than Ramos.

..........W..........D............L
Ramos..41%......23%........36%
Jol.......41%......28%........32%

But Jol picked up a team in much better shape than Ramos did in terms of league position.

However Ramos whoops Jol at the goals per game ratio.

Ramos 2.00 gls per game
Jol 1.41 gls per game

It would be better to compare at the end of the season though.

But as you know, only one manager has won us a cup....

Those have to be only league stats? Because in all competitions Ramos has done much better.

Juande Ramos:
Games: 35
Won: 18
Drawn: 9
Lost: 8

51.43%

Martin Jol:
Games: 148
Won: 67
Drawn: 38
Lost: 43

45.27%

 

[AllSeeingEye]

but his last league possition doesn't give you what the team was though.

True, but how bad was the mentality of that squad faced with all the expectation at the end of last year?

Sure, on paper we are definitely more talented but you need look no further than West Ham's relegation a few years ago to see that good players do not always make the best of it without man management.

I'm not cussing Jol, he was great. He was also unfortunate that he didn't seem to know how to take it to the next level.

That's not what this thread is about though, it was about stats and comparison, which I've already shown has not meant an awful lot......which surprises me since I was also under the impression that Juande had done much better than he actually has.

But just in case people were wondering...

Spurs team for Jol's first game (which for arguments sake will be the Villa game):

Robinson; Pamarot, Naybet, King (Capt.), Edman (sub Ziegler, 46);
Mendes (sub Keane, 69), Brown, Carrick, Atouba (sub Davenport, 82);
Defoe, Kanoute

And Ramos' first game:

Robinson (Capt.); Chimbonda, Dawson, Kaboul, Lee;
Lennon, Jenas, Boateng (sub Zokora, 62), Malbranque;
Bent (sub Berbatov, 57), Defoe (sub Keane, 57)

 

[AllSeeingEye]

Those have to be only league stats? Because in all competitions Ramos has done much better.

It was only league stats. We already know that he did better in the cups.......being as he won one.

Oh, and he beat Arsenal......

 

[haxman]

It was only league stats. We already know that he did better in the cups.......being as he won one.

Oh, and he beat Arsenal......

Beat? Destroyed more like :up:

I like to think we're the reason for the goons recent crap form.

 

[tommyt]

ASE - nice post. have some rep

 

[dricha1]

We have still shipped alot of goals under Ramos (four against the likes of Chelsea and Reading) but since his transfer window signings the defense looks a more solid unit and this is without them having extended playing time together.

We may well see a new keeper (although Robinson seems to be recapturing his form) and Bale return to left back, both of which could have a positive impact.

I think many of the goals we ship would also be plugged if we had a more solid and dominate midfield to take the pressure of and stop teams getting to our back line so frequently. This could come from either new players or improved form our our existing players.

What im trying to say is the stats dont really matter at this time, Things have improved under Ramos and I have no doubt will continue to do so (regardless of what the stats suggest)

I would suggest the stats this time next year will be much improved.

I think this is a very good point. United, Chelsea, Liverpool & Everton all play with 2 holding midfielders and at least 1 creative (Ronaldo, Lampard, Gerrard, Arteta).

We now have excellent defenders in Woodgate, Hutton, (King, Bale when fit) and Dawson. What they lack is decent protection from the midfield - how often do you scream at the team to close down as they continually back off towards our own box?

For us to join (consistently) the top four we need 2 solid, hard working, good passing midfielders, who-ever they may be. Jenas and Huddlestone can share the responsibility of creative midfielder and play further up the field.

Now we are as good as safe - I am gonna enjoy the rest of the season - and watch Ramos shape his team. This is pre season for 2008/2009 and I expect us to start next season better prepared than any other.

 

[marion52]

It's usual to have better stats over a lesser period, what about breaking Jols into first season, 2nd season , 3rd season for a fairer comparison!