UEFA EURO 2024 .. June 14th - July 14th

[Shanks]

From some dude called kieran maguire on X

Based on FIFA rankings and converting into domestic positions England’s results over 90 minutes would have been
Spurs 1 Preston 0
Spurs 1 Leicester 1
Spurs 0 Exeter 0
Spurs 1 Portsmouth 1
Spurs 1 Burnley 1
Spurs 2 Newcastle 1
Spurs 1 Man Utd 2

 

[Riandor]

From some dude called kieran maguire on X

Based on FIFA rankings and converting into domestic positions England’s results over 90 minutes would have been
Spurs 1 Preston 0
Spurs 1 Leicester 1
Spurs 0 Exeter 0
Spurs 1 Portsmouth 1
Spurs 1 Burnley 1
Spurs 2 Newcastle 1
Spurs 1 Man Utd 2

A couple of years ago I would have said that sounds very realistic.

 

[Westmorlandspur]

Archie Gray in that England midfield by 2026. He is a proper midfield player. Rice is a converted centre half who can run about a bit. Give him the ball when marked he’s clueless .
The criticism of Southgate is that when we play a team who appear better than us, we lose. Harsh but true.
We lose because the other team always have a better midfield than us.
Wharton, Kobbie and Gray sounds ok to me.

 

[Shanks]

My kid in the sticks in 8 years time will do nicely too haha

 

[Styopa]

The criticism of Southgate is that when we play a team who appear better than us, we lose. Harsh but true.

I think Netherlands are the closest Southgate's England have come to defeating an evenly-matched opponent. I think it's probably Southgate's best win in tournament football. The win versus Germany in 2021 was emotive and inspiring, but it was an average German team. Nonetheless those two ties stand out as the two top-tier teams England have defeated in tournament football during the last four tournaments.

They have come up short versus virtually every other evenly matched or better opponent they have faced (i.e Croatia, Italy, France and Spain). This is why his record of finals and semi-finals needs to be contextualised: because had his team met better teams earlier in the tournaments, they would probably have gone out earlier, like they did at the last World Cup.

The one thing Southgate's reign has shown is how important a role luck plays. I think it's fairly unlikely England would have progressed beyond the QF if they happened to be on Spain's side of the draw. The fact they avoided all of the major favourites before the final was mainly luck.

 

[Llord Flashheart]

Meanwhile, over here.

(Sorry, if posted already)

 

[Shanks]

I think Netherlands are the closest Southgate's England have come to defeating an evenly-matched opponent. I think it's probably Southgate's best win in tournament football. The win versus Germany in 2021 was emotive and inspiring, but it was an average German team. Nonetheless those two ties stand out as the two top-tier teams England have defeated in tournament football during the last four tournaments.

They have come up short versus virtually every other evenly matched or better opponent they have faced (i.e Croatia, Italy, France and Spain). This is why his record of finals and semi-finals needs to be contextualised: because had his team met better teams earlier in the tournaments, they would probably have gone out earlier, like they did at the last World Cup.

The one thing Southgate's reign has shown is how important a role luck plays. I think it's fairly unlikely England would have progressed beyond the QF if they happened to be on Spain's side of the draw. The fact they avoided all of the major favourites before the final was mainly luck.

The luck bit I sometimes agree on, but then for the first time in forever we have actually won our groups securing an easier draw.

The lucky part was France messing up there group somewhat.

Southgate gets plenty of praise for his supportive management of the players, just missing on the football side of things though

 

[Styopa]

The luck bit I sometimes agree on, but then for the first time in forever we have actually won our groups securing an easier draw.

The lucky part was France messing up there group somewhat.

Southgate gets plenty of praise for his supportive management of the players, just missing on the football side of things though

That's true. But England also had a relatively easy group, which itself was a bit lucky.

For example:
Spain were in a group with Italy and Croatia.
France were in a group with the Netherlands.

I do think Southgate deserves some credit for successfully navigating the qualifying phases and winning groups, which has led to easier draws. But above and beyond that, he's still had a decent bit of luck.

Spain won their qualifying group for Euro 2024, and their Euro 2024 group, but still had to play the defending champions in the group stages, the hosts in the QF and the joint -favourites in the semi-final.

 

[spursfan77]

The state of this!

 

[rossdapep]

All through this tournament I've been arguing with the Southgate apologists and every time I've asked the question... Which of this squad of players is Southgate getting close to the best out of. Every single time they've avoiding saying the actual answer which is none of them. So all this bollocks about how much technical ability the players have compared to Spain, from some of those same people is quite frankly laughable. It isn't going to matter which side has more technically brilliant players, if one of those sides is way below their usual club standards individually speaking from 90% of the players pov.

I think in some aspects GS is a very good England head coach. He's a media dream for the FA and I think he's a very good man manager. I actually think he managed to convince the players they were going to win the whole thing. Unfortunately he also managed to convince them they didn't need to play football to do so.

I speak to a lot of people from other European nations and they all say England have exceptional talent, some even said England were their favourites.

So we absolutely should be playing better and look more comfortable with the ball

 

[Shanks]

That's true. But England also had a relatively easy group, which itself was a bit lucky.

For example:
Spain were in a group with Italy and Croatia.
France were in a group with the Netherlands.

I do think Southgate deserves some credit for successfully navigating the qualifying phases and winning groups, which has led to easier draws. But above and beyond that, he's still had a decent bit of luck.

Spain won their qualifying group for Euro 2024, and their Euro 2024 group, but still had to play the defending champions in the group stages, the hosts in the QF and the joint -favourites in the semi-final.

I agree on all of that mate, definitely some luck and whilst I've always been, he's been lucky, then I think about it and some of it has been pretty decent planning.

I do think a Southgate in the team working with players and keeping unity would work, but only if they had a football manager (a proper one) doing the game side of stuff

 

[DenverSpur]

When we beat Spain in 96 we had Platt and Gazza as the CM pairing.

Gazza was an exception to the rule and even he was initially viewed suspiciously .

 

[Timbo Tottenham]

Gazza was an exception to the rule and even he was initially viewed suspiciously .

And Gazza was a shadow of the player he was at Spurs, by this stage. He was never the same after the injury in the cup final, he showed some flashes at Lazio, being the best player on the pitch against a star studded Milan side as an example, but it always felt that he had lost a yard of pace/acceleration.

 

[aliyid]

The state of this!

That pass map for England is outrageous

 

[Styopa]

And Gazza was a shadow of the player he was at Spurs, by this stage. He was never the same after the injury in the cup final, he showed some flashes at Lazio, being the best player on the pitch against a star studded Milan side as an example, but it always felt that he had lost a yard of pace/acceleration.

And by Euro 96 he was already at Rangers. And whilst the SPL was stronger in those days than it is now, it's not like being a star player at Madrid, Man C or Munich is today. Rangers finished bottom of their Champions League group that season, below Steaua Bucuresti, Dortmund and Juve. They were smashed by Juve 4-1 and 4-0.

 

[kmk]

 

[Fergus]

Unlike many, I don't think England lagged behind Spain on technical skills, fitness or physical ability. The real difference was football IQ. Olmo, Rodri and Zubimenda all used their brains. England's gifted "generational talents" just did what they were told and came across as unimaginative and tactically limited.

 

[easley91]

View attachment 143127

Meanwhile, over here.

(Sorry, if posted already)

I just love how the Scottish flag was the only one not put on this.

 

[Blake Griffin]

Bellingham is a really selfish player. When he was moved back into midfield he offered absolutely nothing positionally

i really don't understand those that think he can or should play there.

 

[qqq1]

Having no spurs players in the England squad made me realise how much club bias people have when talking about England. So many wildly different opinions and they mostly line up with what club someone supports.