The VAR Thread

MK Yid

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You have been told?
Yes, by a PGMOL official. Riley didn't declare which the errors were though, Sky have made their own conclusions.
The ones I have stated are the ones, PGMOL agreed were the errors
 
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Marty

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Only six out of ten wrong decisions overturned is a very poor rate. Even if the system is new they should be expected to do better than that.

I also wonder how on earth Lascelles on Kane isn't on that list, so six from 11.
 

Marty

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Yes, by a PGMOL official. Riley didn't declare which the errors were though, Sky have made their own conclusions.
The ones I have stated are the ones, PGMOL agreed were the errors
I'm more inclined to believe Sky's version with the Haller penalty instead of the Lamela/Rodri one tbh, but both are fairly blatant.
 

LeSoupeKitchen

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The four incidents in question are:
  • Claims for a penalty from Manchester City for a foul on midfielder David Silva in their 3-1 win at Bournemouth on 25 August
  • A foul on West Ham striker Sebastian Halle in their win against Norwich City on 31 August
  • Leicester City's Youri Tielemens should have been sent off for his foul on Bournemouth's Callum Wilson on the same day
  • Also on 31 August, a handball by Newcastle United's Isaac Hayden was missed in the build-up to Fabian Scharr's equaliser against Watford

There are a f*** tonne more errors than that IMO
 

Marty

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The four incidents in question are:
  • Claims for a penalty from Manchester City for a foul on midfielder David Silva in their 3-1 win at Bournemouth on 25 August
  • A foul on West Ham striker Sebastian Halle in their win against Norwich City on 31 August
  • Leicester City's Youri Tielemens should have been sent off for his foul on Bournemouth's Callum Wilson on the same day
  • Also on 31 August, a handball by Newcastle United's Isaac Hayden was missed in the build-up to Fabian Scharr's equaliser against Watford

There are a f*** tonne more errors than that IMO
Lamela on Rodri and Lascelles on Kane are definite errors, and that's just from Spurs games. Not sure how any of those are even debatable.

It's like they're admitting that they've got stuff wrong, but trying to fudge just how much.
 

nailsy

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I'm not impressed with how it's being implemented at the moment. It's like having half a system in place with the people in the studio too scared to make a decision. Take the penalty in the Liverpool game last night - you could see exactly the same challenge happen in two games, but in one match the penalty could be given, but in the other one it wouldn't and VAR wouldn't overrule either decision. I appreciate that they don't want to overrule the ref when they think its a subjective decision and that they don't want to slow the game down by looking at screens on the side of the pitch all the time, but if it's a debatable incident that's going to change the game then just let the ref take another look at it.
 

'O Zio

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I'm not impressed with how it's being implemented at the moment. It's like having half a system in place with the people in the studio too scared to make a decision. Take the penalty in the Liverpool game last night - you could see exactly the same challenge happen in two games, but in one match the penalty could be given, but in the other one it wouldn't and VAR wouldn't overrule either decision. I appreciate that they don't want to overrule the ref when they think its a subjective decision and that they don't want to slow the game down by looking at screens on the side of the pitch all the time, but if it's a debatable incident that's going to change the game then just let the ref take another look at it.
Agree. They've somehow managed to make a complete hash of it but in a totally different way to what people were worried about. The people that run football seem to repeatedly take ineptitude to another level.
 

Lighty64

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the way they have set VAR up, with the man on the box, not once undermining the onfield ref, I really can't see any penalty decisions or very rarely a possible red card being awarded instead of a yellow ever being overturned. we will only ever see it rule out goals for offsides, and if that's going to be the case they are going to have to put sensors in the ball especially for instances like Sterling and Son to try and get 100% accuracy
 

BehindEnemyLines

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They are using cameras for VAR (and assuming they are 60fps).
A sprinting player takes ~12 seconds to run 100m, which equates to 833cm per second.......or 13.9cm per frame.
So, for every frame they are calling an offside of single digit cm's between the player could have moved almost 14cm.......and that's without applying the same metric to the passing player who's foot (and strike of the ball) are likely to be even faster and less accurate!

The police know that neither their speed cameras or the speedometer in your car are 100% accurate, which is why they apply a tolerance in the drivers favour (normally 10% + 3mph if memory serves).........so it seems mental that VAR can't hold their hands up and admit that they can't 100% call a marginal decision............or sell the technology to the Police and make a fortune!
 
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stevenurse

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Do the referees have the option to come and take another look? Don't recall it happening if they are. Surely that clears up any issues with this? Currently it's colleagues 'advising' the referee who don't want to be seen as undermining them so they don't do anything. The whole thing is a shambles and even after being shown it can work (world cup 2018) they've managed to make a mess of it.

This season is a joke
 

tooey

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Do the referees have the option to come and take another look? Don't recall it happening if they are. Surely that clears up any issues with this? Currently it's colleagues 'advising' the referee who don't want to be seen as undermining them so they don't do anything. The whole thing is a shambles and even after being shown it can work (world cup 2018) they've managed to make a mess of it.

This season is a joke
I believe that the PL VAR protocol is that the referee doesn't view the decision himself. One of the major gripes during trials was the time it was taking to make a decision and a lot of that time was due to the referee going over to the screen.

The brief at the start of the season was that the referee's call would be given precedence over the VAR official - If the referee has seen an incident and has either called a foul, called a foul and given a card or deemed there to be no foul his call stands unless in an instance where a glaring and obvious error has occurred.

To call the whole thing a shambles after a month is a little premature, it was always going to be a challenge this year and probably for 2 or 3 more seasons there will be problems. It's there as a safety net for the officials not a crutch. The more it's used the slicker it will get.

Patience.
 

LeSoupeKitchen

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I believe that the PL VAR protocol is that the referee doesn't view the decision himself. One of the major gripes during trials was the time it was taking to make a decision and a lot of that time was due to the referee going over to the screen.

The brief at the start of the season was that the referee's call would be given precedence over the VAR official - If the referee has seen an incident and has either called a foul, called a foul and given a card or deemed there to be no foul his call stands unless in an instance where a glaring and obvious error has occurred.

To call the whole thing a shambles after a month is a little premature, it was always going to be a challenge this year and probably for 2 or 3 more seasons there will be problems. It's there as a safety net for the officials not a crutch. The more it's used the slicker it will get.

Patience.
The problem is that the PL are saying it's pretty much working perfectly (just a handful of errors) so how can we have any hope that it will evolve into something better?
 

tooey

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The problem is that the PL are saying it's pretty much working perfectly (just a handful of errors) so how can we have any hope that it will evolve into something better?
The only thing saw was that 3 or 4 decisions were made incorrectly so far, at the current rate that will probably amount to 30-40 per season. Plenty of room for improvement.
 

stevenurse

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I believe that the PL VAR protocol is that the referee doesn't view the decision himself. One of the major gripes during trials was the time it was taking to make a decision and a lot of that time was due to the referee going over to the screen.

The brief at the start of the season was that the referee's call would be given precedence over the VAR official - If the referee has seen an incident and has either called a foul, called a foul and given a card or deemed there to be no foul his call stands unless in an instance where a glaring and obvious error has occurred.

To call the whole thing a shambles after a month is a little premature, it was always going to be a challenge this year and probably for 2 or 3 more seasons there will be problems. It's there as a safety net for the officials not a crutch. The more it's used the slicker it will get.

Patience.
The problem is that there have been several, not even close or 50/50 incidents that anyone with eyes would deem to be a penalty, that haven't been overturned.

The Lamela foul in our game with City, The Barnes challenge yesterday, the foul on Haller a few weeks back and the lascelles wrestle with matip to name a few. How can these be adjudged by a panel who see from various angles and replays to not have been fouls? There's simply no excuse. It all gives the impression that the VAR teams are sat around doing fuck all but eating doughnuts like you'd see during a stake out in an 80s cop film.

It seems everyone is in agreement that the handball from sokratis was a penalty, nothing given.

I'm of the opinion that refs aren't making calls because they think VAR will back them up

But the teams in the VAR studios don't seem (or at least it appears) to want to undermine the ref by changing a decision.

Therefore there's this weird catch 22 situation where nothing happens and clear fouls are being missed.
 

sausage

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Laughable that they disallowed the City goal in the last minute against us for the ball grazing Laporte on the arm yet they don't give this. The game is slowly killing itself.
Fortunately, it's just the PL - not the game itself.
 
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