The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - DEADLINE DAY 31st August 2021

[funkycoldmedina]

Keep this simple!
Any more actions like this from DL, our DoF will serve notice! Now go argue with that.

That's the bit of info I'm after. If it was all a storm in a teacup then fine but if Paratici is seriously pissed off and feels undermined then that's on Levy.
I'm generally a supporter of ENIC but there's always shades of grey. I always felt one of the biggest mistakes they made was not insisting on DOF during Poch's reign and moving away from buying regularly, high quality young talent.

The general policy this window has been much more in line with where I think we are in the pecking order, get the best young talent and have a coach that actually coaches and improves the talent. The Traore deal didn't fit the pattern, especially if you add in having to offload Bergwijn/Moura for probably sub optimal fees to fund it. The big but is that Levy getting involved like this is bad news as I felt we were back on track.

 

[sausage]

I'd be surprised if we didn't have a clause in the contract that ties him in financially from joining another club immediately particularly if its one we had recently negotiated with. Unless of course the terms were favourable to both parties

Could always be Agent Aurier off to help get the job done

 

[Jet]

And that right there is why you are ok with it. You are completely Ignoring the precedent it sets, how it undermines the senior recruitment team, and the fact it was the only player the head coach wanted. You'll be the first to jump on it when it's a player you like though.

The fact that it was the FIRST and ONLY player that Nuno wanted looks terrible.

Imagine how Nuno feels - the first time he’s asked to be backed, after dealing with the Kane saga all summer and delivering 9 points and a well drilled team (defensively) despite all of it, we fail him. I’m terribly disappointed for him, even though I didn’t want Adama myself.

 

[King of the Lane]

I think some of you are fighting a losing battle. The majority on here are quite level headed but for a few they will clearly defend Levy till the death even when it makes no sense. Levy could burn down our stadium this evening and some would praise him and tell us its all part of the big rebuild.

You can be a fan of what Levy has done for us whilst still recognising his mistakes and vice versa.

 

[pablo73]

A lot of people defending Levy seem to be completely missing the point. It's not about whether Levy thinks Traore is good value or not, it's the fact that by all accounts he gave Paratici autonomy and a budget to operate within and he then overruled him thus taking that autonomy away.

And here's the crucial point, it was not because he had exceeded said budget, but because he decided Lucas and Bergwijn were just as good thus completely undermining his DOF who he has employed because he clearly doesn't have the relevant footballing expertise himself.

If the money's not there fair enough but just say that, that's clearly not how it played out though.

 

[KingNick]

I think some of you are fighting a losing battle. The majority on here are quite level headed but for a few they will clearly defend Levy till the death even when it makes no sense. Levy could burn down our stadium this evening and some would praise him and tell us its all part of the big rebuild.

You can be a fan of what Levy has done for us whilst still recognising his mistakes and vice versa.

funny you should say that. Have the seen the news about what happened this morning?

 

[Nanky_1988]

I don't think anybody really knows what's going on here and if it was Levy that didn't want to spend 50mill on traore well then fair play to him because he aint worth it!

It's on Fab to bring in a backup striker and make sure we have balance and cover throughout the squad and he failed 100% so it's on him and nobody else.

What would you have said if the Atlanta wanted Cash upfront for Romero and Levy said no?

The manager wanted Traore and Levy didn’t once say we haven’t got the money so why did he let them negotiate to such a point! You’re just okay with it because you didn’t fancy the player!

Trix and Herc are right here in that this just means Levy will intervene and meddle whenever he doesn’t like the structure or price!

The DoF role effective becomes irrelevant as it’s still ultimately down to Levy ?

 

[shelfstandspur]

I would probably come under the BSODL title and feel that 50m would be expensive for Traore; so I am not too upset we didn't get him.

However, I fully understand why Trix, Herc, Rob et al are up in arms.

DL says 'I have made errors therefore I here is a DOF to manage the football side of things within a budget I will set'
Fans say 'great, no missing out on those deals'
DOF - 'Ha! I can make this deal within budget'
DL 'No you're not doing that deal, yes we can do the financials but on the football side of things.....'

- Traore isn't likely to be a Grealish miss.
- But the next one could be; one of the next three will be.
- We could lose Paratici (I would say I am a BSOFP)
- We likely will not get over the line of winning something by another small margin.
- Someone needs to tell DL 'you have hired a winner, let him do his job' & 'this is your weakness, you don't know best' & 'if you want to maximise the sale price let Paratici work his magic'
- Unfortunately, I don't know if there is anyone who will would lead that intervention or would be able to enforce it. Joe is probably the only one and he is on a yacht somewhere lighting cigars with fifties.
- Let's hope DL sees the light!

 

[DenverSpur]

If the footballing side, Paratici Hitchen NES, decided that's how to spend the set budget then that's how it is. He did meddle with the football side based on his own opinion that the options we have are enough (which they won't be). Earlier ITK said that he was opposed to get rid of Bergwijn too, which would have opened up a wing spot.

Either he gives control to the footballing director or he doesn't. He does as long as it suits him.

Thing is he was being asked to sell Berwijn in a depressed market which means selling him for less than his market value in order to buy Traore at a well over the market price. At the 50M that Wolves wanted plus the loss on Berwijn that would be same as paying twice the market value for him. That doesn’t strike me as good business especially for someone whose stats are not better than the person you’re in fact swapping him for.

 

[funkycoldmedina]

I think some of you are fighting a losing battle. The majority on here are quite level headed but for a few they will clearly defend Levy till the death even when it makes no sense. Levy could burn down our stadium this evening and some would praise him and tell us its all part of the big rebuild.

You can be a fan of what Levy has done for us whilst still recognising his mistakes and vice versa.

Cuts both ways

 

[Gspurs11]

Not sure if mentioned, but think JJ has deleted his twitter account.

Most don't have an issue with the ITK aggregators accounts, and i don't really, but one consequence has been the lack of understanding of how ITK works and therefore brought more scrutiny and unwarranted criticism upon JJ and our resident ITK's on here. This has also emboldened posters in here to circumvent the rules to criticise and mock in various threads with ratings and posts.

It's not good.

 

[thelak]

I would probably come under the BSODL title and feel that 50m would be expensive for Traore; so I am not too upset we didn't get him.

However, I fully understand why Trix, Herc, Rob et al are up in arms.

DL says 'I have made errors therefore I here is a DOF to manage the football side of things within a budget I will set'
Fans say 'great, no missing out on those deals'
DOF - 'Ha! I can make this deal within budget'
DL 'No you're not doing that deal, yes we can do the financials but on the football side of things.....'

- Traore isn't likely to be a Grealish miss.
- But the next one could be; one of the next three will be.
- We could lose Paratici (I would say I am a BSOFP)
- We likely will not get over the line of winning something by another small margin.
- Someone needs to tell DL 'you have hired a winner, let him do his job' & 'this is your weakness, you don't know best' & 'if you want to maximise the sale price let Paratici work his magic'
- Unfortunately, I don't know if there is anyone who will would lead that intervention or would be able to enforce it. Joe is probably the only one and he is on a yacht somewhere lighting cigars with fifties.
- Let's hope DL sees the light!

I don’t think there will be a next one

Paratici will walk

 

[thelak]

Not sure if mentioned, but think JJ has deleted his twitter account.

Most don't have an issue with the ITK aggregators accounts, and i don't really, but one consequence has been the lack of understanding of how ITK works and therefore brought more scrutiny and unwarranted criticism upon JJ and our resident ITK's on here. This has also emboldened posters in here to circumvent the rules to criticise and mock in various threads with ratings and posts.

It's not good.

Damn. Now he’s never going to accept my 3 year old request

 

[lemony snickets]

I kind of hope Serge goes to Arsenal from the banter pov.

Telling Gooners they've gone from steeling our home grown club captain from under our noses when there was literally nothing we could do about it, to sniffing round the bins to see what we've chucked out will bring me sooooo much joy.

Hahahaha, Bin Dipping Gooners, oh how the mighty have fallen. Love that so much @Trix

 

[Dakes]

Question for those saying Levy was right to step in because Traore was too much money....

Where is your cut off point? For me transfers are either in the hands of the DOF or they aren't. In the morning we were ALL
hearing we were going back in for him(that's multiple sources) with a bid that they would accept, that was 100% the plan. By early afternoon that had changed because he was too expensive, and it was only one person that decided it was too much money.

Had the line been we don't have the budget to pay that much all along I'd have been fine with it, but it wasn't. So either the money for it was never there and Levy was leading Fab and Nuno etc on, or it was there and Levy didn't want to spend it.

The line when Fab came in was that he'd get a budget and there would be no interference.

I know some think it's great because they didn't want him anyway, or he was over priced. I've said the same I wasn't keen tbh, but that is not the point. The point is where do you draw the line. If he can veto one player at the last minute, how many more will he do in the future.

Another post I can't winner enough.

 

[wiggo24]

Not sure if mentioned, but think JJ has deleted his twitter account.

Most don't have an issue with the ITK aggregators accounts, and i don't really, but one consequence has been the lack of understanding of how ITK works and therefore brought more scrutiny and unwarranted criticism upon JJ and our resident ITK's on here. This has also emboldened posters in here to circumvent the rules to criticise and mock in various threads with ratings and posts.

It's not good.

Yeah, noticed this. Hope he keeps posting in here instead as it's a bit more protected than twitter but can kinda understand why the ITK is drying up on the whole.

 

[PLTuck]

I would have cringed a bit if we'd paid £50m for Adama, BUT undermining your much lauded DoF is not a great start to your working relationship.

AG paints it a little differently. He says it's as simple as we had an amount we were willing to go to, Wolves wanted more. The end.

 

[jimmyh]

This is the point. Levy didn't go in there saying "look guys we can't afford this with how the world is right now". According to both Herc and JJ, He went in stating how we didn't need Traore at that fee, because what we already have for that position was just as good if not better.

Genuinely can't see how people are defending this. The Chairman telling the manager and DOF how good players are compared to potential transfers is just not on.

Lets just say we sold Kane. Fab, Nuno, Hitchen and the scouting dept decide the best possible replacement is Vlahovic for £80mil, but Levy comes in and says "nope in my opinion Patrick Bamford is just as good if not better and he's only £40mil. I'm buying him instead.

Is that ok?

This is the point a lot on here seem to be missing because you either didn't want Traore or your to busy pulling your Rodgers over levy's picture.

The fact that he is telling the football people who they should be signing is ridiculous. If you put them in the job because they are the best at what they do then let them get on with it to try and get the best options on the football pitch to be successful.

This all proves the baldy wee tosser will never let go of on field matters and while that is the case we will never be competitive or successful for that matter. He either needs to let the people do their jobs and stay out of the way or sell the club and fuck off to the Bahamas with Lewis.

 

[DenverSpur]

The thing about the Traore argument is we can’t see the wood for the trees. We can’t see clearly because it’s Levy involved. If we take Levy out and say the THFC chairman instead vetoed losing money on one asset(Berwijn) in order to buy a similar(?) asset(Traore) at what would be twice their market value most people would say yes I can see the logic in that decision. Trouble is everyone has their opinion of Levy and that affects their judgement of any decision he makes.

 

[crazyguitarman]

Are we totally sure that Daniel Levy hired Fabio Paratici under the premise that he would completely relinquish control over transfers to him? I was always under the impression that Levy simply wanted to free up his own time from negotiations to focus more on the business side of the club, not that he would totally cede control altogether. I guess it was always somewhat expected that he would step in at some point to have his say. I do agree with those who say he should just set the budget and let the DoF do his thing though. Also in this instance it does feel like he overstepped completely.