The Daily ITK Discussion Thread 30th June

[SpartanSpur]

If the trade off for losing out on Martial and signing Plea is that we have a proper wedge to splurge on a real top quality CM I'll happily take that. No pun intended but wouldn't mind one Real CM in particular.

That would certainly ease things for sure, a lot of the concerns are due to us working with limited info and fearing the worst. We have had very little on midfielders other than Grealish though.

 

[Japhet]

We don't think that way unfortunately. Rather than identify positions of need it seems like we just go off who might be available for a knockdown price. Not criticising Plea and particularly Grealish, but would we really be interested if they were both £40m plus? I doubt it.

Unless there's a quality midfielder that is cheap then we won't be bringing one in.

Our dearest defender was Toby at around 11m before we spent 43m on Sanchez. Things can change you know.

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

Spoiler: Minimised to avoid clogging up the thread

You make some good points, but I fully stand by my opinion on the importance of having a strong window this summer.

Martial and De Ligt would have been the kind of moves I am hoping for. Other links such as Malcom or Pulisic would also fall into that bracket for me. We are talking about some the best young prospects in Europe watched by all of the top clubs (much like Davinson Sanchez was last summer). A net spend of circa £50-80m would surely not cause us to 'do a Leeds'. Our pre-tax profits for 2016/17 were £58m alone. The reason for 'why now?' is that our most valuable assets need to be shown ambition for the current project to continue smoothly. I personally believe Levy will be aware of this and it's why I'm optimistic for the window still. I guess I am putting more weight into that than you are, which is fair enough.

That we were able to compete in 2016/17 with a wage bill of ~60% of Liverpool and Arsenal, and under 50% of the Manchester clubs is quite the testament to Levy and Co, but to think we could maintain that success over a sustained period is fanciful. I believe that the club has realised this with the large pay rises for Kane and Poch and the raft of other contract renewals mooted. This shift in wage budget is far from the 'same old, same old' and I'm delighted it by it. The large recent increases in all forms of turnover will allow us to maintain our very healthy Wages to Profit ratio whilst allowing for a wage bill much closer to the likes of Arsenal and Liverpool than ever before. As evidenced by Spurs' and Liverpool's best players both signing £200k per week deals recently.

Servicing the debt will be an issue for us but naming rights will be a whole new revenue stream which will hopefully cover the annual cost of the loan interest at the very least. Back when Arsenal were crippled by stadium debt annual revenues were a fraction of what they are now, not to mention the contributions we have already made to our stadium project over the last few years which they did not have the luxury of.

Obviously this is very simplified view and you have shown a good knowledge of financial affairs, but I think you are taking the counter view as being a lot less realistic that what it really is. Last season we spent over £110m on 5 first team players. A gross spend of say £160m is not too far of a reach in those terms, especially of the sales of Toby and Dembele pending. Scope for us to break our transfer record more than once this window. We are seemingly looking at 3-4 players for the window, dependant on the outgoings. Now is the time for quality over quantity, and my opinion is there must be better options out there than Plea in our available price range. Herc and Rebrab's recent posts seem to be suggesting that is still very much the case which is encouraging.

I respect your stance and I have a feeling the truth will lie somewhere between my optimism and your pessimism. I hope we are both happy come 9th August! Up the Spurs

You only talk about servicing the debt. It also has to be repaid, unless we get an equity infusion. We can all debate how well Arsenal managed this process, but debt repayment was a significant drain on their resources for some years.
I don't know whether Plea is good, bad ,or indifferent. I have never seen him play and had never heard of him until the interest of various clubs was mooted in the media, which I suspect was agent fed.
If we sell Toby we will have what? £75 million available? If we don't, we won't. We won't get much more than £25 million, if that, for Dembele. That potential £100 million could quite possibly go on one signing. If it does, then let's hope the new player doesn't do his cruciate ligament in pre-season training.
I don't think we will have a vast amount of net spend available, for the reasons I've repeated to, I suspect, a lot of people's irritation, so whether or not we buy big-name players will I suspect depend on how (in Poch's words) "creative" we can be in our dealings.
I don't regard my views as pessimistic, more progressive rather than instant. I look forward to quite a few more contract renewals for current players, who are not being traded as part of the "creative" process, and possibly one or two welcome surprises, but I would be amazed and disappointed if we didn't continue to see the club managed prudently, and large net spends would be very risky in my view.
I feel very positive about the future of the club and look forward to some trophies in the near future.
As you so rightly say: Up the Spurs!

 

[tommyt]

I’m in recovery from my stag do, full sense of humour lobotomy has taken place.

There was a mankini...

Please can we discard the picture rule this one time @Archibald&Crooks ?

 

[Lou3000]

Honestly, it isn't about "salt." It's about understanding that there are so, so many steps in the process. An ITK hears that a player's agents are talking up a transfer, and everonye here acts like that's 99% done.

The only thing I think people should be upset about is that training starts soon (this week?) for non-WC players, and we haven't completed all the rumored contracts, we haven't signed any new talent, and all this is despite Poch saying (not ITK cryptics) that now was the time to be bold and make aggressive moves. This doesn't feel like us being bold at all.

 

[aussiespursguy]

You guys panic too easily.

Arsenal have signed Leno and Lichtsteiner, neither of which would have impressed our fans.
Chelsea have signed nobody.
Liverpool have admittedly done some business in signing Fabinho, and tied up Salah this morning which has to be seen as great news for them.
City have signed nobody.
United have signed Fred, which seems to be seen as a good signing, and Dalot who is a good prospect.
The rest of the teams floating around the top half have barely made a signing between them, except Leicester and Watford.

It's not as though the other teams have got themselves settled squads this season. I'd argue that we've done better business than any of them by signing the best striker in the league, as well as arguably the best manager (is IMO) to long term contracts.

You can't take rumours as a measure of how hard we are working to make signings vs other clubs - we have just gone from one of the worst teams for keeping our business quiet to one of the best in the past few seasons.

Poch will be backed this summer.

Thanks for the input mate. I hope the mods can see it to make your posts powder blue as I'm sure you still get a snippet of info along the way.

 

[parj]

I hear what you are saying & I’m all for uncovering gems that our coaches can work with but respected ITKs have stated big name signings & sounded confident. It didn’t come across that we would ‘try’ but strongly hinted they were done or almost done.

I don't doubt we after big players and I'm sure a lot would be interested, but the selling club has to want to sell. Just like we made it hard for Modric to join Chelsea.

 

[worcestersauce]

I don't doubt we after big players and I'm sure a lot would be interested, but the selling club has to want to sell. Just like we made it hard for Modric to join Chelsea.

We didn't just make it hard we killed it totally, no, never, no way, nada, niet, nien, non and fuck off you scummy bastards, as yet I'm optimistic that other clubs haven't been quite that definitive with us.
Been away for a week just popped in to see how things stand and it seems it's been a little heated, just read Herc's explanation of himself which he shouldn't have had to post, mind you I liked his last line, I hear you buddy.
For what it's worth if I get the grumps and have something to say I take it to the player thread, it's far safer.

 

[punkisback]

And just as tedious ‘same old Levy’ and ‘(sarcastically) lessons learned’. Come on A&C be balanced.

Maybe some of us are just frustrated with peoples inabilbty grasp how hard it is to sign players at the levels of our first team’s ability when we don’t have the type of backing available that any of the other big 6 have. Players signing for us instead of them have to buy into a multitude of facets that are entirely unrelated to remuneration, and this is far less of an obstacle when that player has unfulfilled potential because individual and collective development is our biggest selling point. The proof? The dozen odd players who are now top class, who weren’t before they started playing for Pochettino.



Take a bow.

I don't think the issue is signing someone to improve the first team, we can agree that's difficult. We're not going to be signing Kovacic, Isco etc. These are the players above our midfielders for an example. However the issue is not that we're signing these, but the alternatives we seem to identify to these players have such a vast gulf in glass. As I've said before, we jump from Plan A to Plan D.

 

[SonicSarr]

Will Martial improve our first team? I'd start Son before him. And as for N'Plea and Tierney ? I'm on the patience side. Our squad is ok a year older and a year wiser.

 

[Vitur15]

Will Martial improve our first team? I'd start Son before him. And as for N'Plea and Tierney ? I'm on the patience side. Our squad is ok a year older and a year wiser.

Can we stop comparing every potential signing from France to Nkoudou/Njie ffs

 

[nailsy]

See above. You too.

And anyone else who doesn't understand the nature of ITK. If you want to voice your discontent, save it for your signifiant other or the cat or something.

I just tried this, but they just turned around and started licking their own arse. So I tried the cat instead and he was actually a very good listener.

 

[Jenko]

Shearer saying Verts goal was a fluke. Maybe my rose tinted glasses needs to be removed but I felt he headed that with intent to score. If you look at the direction of his head, for me it was clear that he meant that. If he didn't then it was a shit header as it clearly didn't go to the centre of the box where his team mates were

It was a total fluke

 

[tiger666]

I assume you guys know this is the ITK thread?

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

You

We should never have sold Chadli. Wonder if we could get him back.

Edit. Everyone seems to find this stupid or funny. Don't see why. He was a great scorer for us and would have been a much better player to sub on last year over Llorente.

You

Shearer saying Verts goal was a fluke. Maybe my rose tinted glasses needs to be removed but I felt he headed that with intent to score. If you look at the direction of his head, for me it was clear that he meant that. If he didn't then it was a shit header as it clearly didn't go to the centre of the box where his team mates were

And you again

It was a total fluke

If you can let me know what this has to do with ITK I won't ban you

 

[Dr Know]

You
You

And you again


If you can let me know what this has to do with ITK I won't ban you

Sorry A&C, I posted this in the wrong thread. I shall delete it

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

I did it on purpose not knowing how strict things seem to be now. Sorry though.

Go read the thread rules because you won't get another life.

 

[Lo Amo Speroni]

You guys panic too easily.

Arsenal have signed Leno and Lichtsteiner, neither of which would have impressed our fans.
Chelsea have signed nobody.
Liverpool have admittedly done some business in signing Fabinho, and tied up Salah this morning which has to be seen as great news for them.
City have signed nobody.
United have signed Fred, which seems to be seen as a good signing, and Dalot who is a good prospect.
The rest of the teams floating around the top half have barely made a signing between them, except Leicester and Watford.

It's not as though the other teams have got themselves settled squads this season. I'd argue that we've done better business than any of them by signing the best striker in the league, as well as arguably the best manager (is IMO) to long term contracts.

You can't take rumours as a measure of how hard we are working to make signings vs other clubs - we have just gone from one of the worst teams for keeping our business quiet to one of the best in the past few seasons.

Poch will be backed this summer.

You are a cool ITK. Thanks mate.

 

[nailsy]

Can Rebrab have a blue background?

 

[Goobers]

Thanks for the info chaps. Sounds like activity is going on.