Style of play

JimmyG2

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Joined
Dec 7, 2006
Messages
9,411
The big boys deploy tactical fouling and have been doing it for years.

We have done it under Poch since he got here so it's nothing new although we had stopped doing it and with us not pressing as much and taking less risks which funnily enough coincided with our bad run of form over the past 8 months or so.

There's nothing unprofessional about tactical fouling, it's part of the game and I'm surprised that after 6 years of Poch ball people are starting to speak out against it now, are you just noticing it for the first time or something?
I think it's increasingly prevalent in the game
and Saturday was a watershed for us for the reasons I posted.
Dier has been doing it for years.
It's spoiling the game
It makes diving look
like the Vicar tripping over a cucumber sandwich
at the proverbial tea party.

Of course it's 'unprofessional'.
It's cheating and against the spirit
of the beautiful game.

Wants stamping on
Not the players but the referees
and powers that be..
 

Shadydan

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Joined
Jul 7, 2012
Messages
27,077
I think it's increasingly prevalent in the game
and Saturday was a watershed for us for the reasons I posted.
Dier has been doing it for years.
It's spoiling the game
It makes diving look
like the Vicar tripping over a cucumber sandwich
at the proverbial tea party.

Of course it's 'unprofessional'.
It's cheating and against the spirit
of the beautiful game.

Wants stamping on
Not the players but the referees
and powers that be..
I don't understand how they spoil the game when they've essentially been a part of the game for years, a tactical foul is merely a an illegal way to stop the opposition, there's no difference to players impeding other players to getting to the ball or a shirt pull, it's just a foul get punished in the correct way - yellow card. Doesn't need anything more than that like sin bins and suspensions, that's just nonsense.

Never in a million years is it worse than diving lol now that's what you can call unprofessional.
 

JimmyG2

SC Supporter
Joined
Dec 7, 2006
Messages
9,411
I don't understand how they spoil the game when they've essentially been a part of the game for years, a tactical foul is merely a an illegal way to stop the opposition, there's no difference to players impeding other players to getting to the ball or a shirt pull, it's just a foul get punished in the correct way - yellow card. Doesn't need anything more than that like sin bins and suspensions, that's just nonsense.

Never in a million years is it worse than diving lol now that's what you can call unprofessional.
I totally agree.
It's illegal
and been going on for too long
 

Cochise

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Joined
Aug 8, 2019
Messages
146
The more I watch, the more I'm convinced that a back three would suit us. The movement of the front three yesterday was great to watch and Lamela in that #10 role was so influential. Son was finding some really nice positions and getting chances that on other days he would tuck away, the same goes for Kane.

The two big drawbacks are that it leaves us needing our fullbacks to push up to provide any kind of width and a midfield three that are continuously out numbered and out positioned.

I think a back three would give us a solid base to allow the fullbacks to play a more risk-reward gamestyle whilst also closing up some of those spaces we seem to be gifting opponents.
 

Ronwol196061

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Joined
Apr 9, 2018
Messages
2,047
The more I watch, the more I'm convinced that a back three would suit us. The movement of the front three yesterday was great to watch and Lamela in that #10 role was so influential. Son was finding some really nice positions and getting chances that on other days he would tuck away, the same goes for Kane.

The two big drawbacks are that it leaves us needing our fullbacks to push up to provide any kind of width and a midfield three that are continuously out numbered and out positioned.

I think a back three would give us a solid base to allow the fullbacks to play a more risk-reward gamestyle whilst also closing up some of those spaces we seem to be gifting opponents.
Where would Son play?
5 at the back, three in the middle and Lamela as the 10...
 

Buggsy61

Free Beer Tomorrow
Joined
Aug 31, 2012
Messages
3,974
What seems clear to me for about the past 9 months is that we are missing the protection in front of the back 4 that we used to have with dembele dier and Wanyama, plus their fierce mentality. Now we seem pretty open and don’t have that cohesion that we used to.
Ndombele was presumably bought to replace dembele but seems a different kind of player and is still settling in.
In the short term I would reintegrate dier into the midfield - his ability to switch between holding mid and a third centre back was crucial in our good form of the past and when he is fit he can still give us that.
I am sure he will be in the team against Colchester.
We have got off to a bad start but it is not a disaster yet and I truly believe that we will put it together and go on a run soon.
 
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wrd

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Aug 22, 2014
Messages
5,117
What seems clear to be for about the past 9 months is that we are missing the protection in front of the back 4 that we used to have with dembele dier and Wanyama, plus their fierce mentality. Now we seem pretty opening don’t have that cohesion that we used to.
Ndombele was presumably bought to replace dembele but seems a different kind of player and is still settling in.
In the short term I would reintegrate dier into the midfield - his ability to switch between holding mid and a third centre back was crucial in our good form of the past and when he is fit he can still give us that.
Part of me wonders whether we are better off adding Dier for the sake of an attacking player, I mean yesterday we pretty much did that, we worked with Sissoko/Winks and then Ndombele further forward, maybe the solution is an outright DM in Dier with Winks and Ndombele can get to grips with the game with less defensive responsibility. However the one issue with that is sacrificing most likely Dele which I'm not too keen on.

Maybe a balance could be for example the three games upcoming in southampton, brighton, watford that we go with the midfield 2 and Dele but vs tougher opposition we go with the midfield 3.
 
Joined
Jan 31, 2006
Messages
639
If we were going to match Liverpool style of play..

Allison
A-Arnold matip vvd Robertson
Henderson fabinho wijnaldum
Salah firminho mane

Then this is closest to it

HL
Aurier Toby VT Rose
Sissoko Dier Ndombele
Lucas Kane Son
 

AnotherSpursFan

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Joined
Dec 4, 2006
Messages
977
Bus parkers are notoriously difficult to beat, breaking down an organised, well drilled side has been the scourge of many including Barcelona, Real etc...
tell that to Liverpool and ManCity, bus parkers are there for the taking, if you cant even beat bus parkers who are basically punching bags, what epl title are we even talking about
 

Everlasting Seconds

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Joined
Jan 9, 2014
Messages
11,995
tell that to Liverpool and ManCity, bus parkers are there for the taking, if you cant even beat bus parkers who are basically punching bags, what epl title are we even talking about
I agree, the defeatist "oh man they parked the bus what can you do" attitude does my head in. What you can do is that you can defeat the fuckers because you are that good, that's what you can do.
 

Kiedis

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Joined
Aug 4, 2013
Messages
2,550
The reason our games looks like two drunks taking turns punching eachother is because we just cannot win the ball back and end up conceding shots or having to defend on the edge of our own box. With world class talent up top and in goal, it does end up yielding decent results most of the time, but we'll never be a team greater than the sum of our parts playing this way.
 

Cochise

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Joined
Aug 8, 2019
Messages
146
I think last night saw a bit of a change from Poch. The result against Red Star was just as much about their incompetence as it was our players playing in their preferred roles. It wasn't a big tactical shift, more about our players playing in parts of the pitch that they are best at. I don't believe that this was a return to the great 4231 that some wanted as in the first half we looked more like a wonky diamond or 433 with N'Dombele and Dele floating.

Son was like a traditional wing forward, staying high and wide on the left and worked in the area of the pitch that he has the most impact. Dele in turn favoured drifting over to the left to create overloads or looked to go beyond Kane when possible. One change for me was Lamela on the other side. Whilst he still tucked in and found space between the lines he just as often stayed high and wide leaving space for N'Dombele and Kane to use.

Defensively though, we were still a mess, at times defending in a 424 and leaving the full backs with a lot on. Son and Dele were guilty of not doing their share at tracking back and Davies got left 1v2 on a couple of occassions. There were two chances coming from these errors that a better team would've scored from.

Second half was defensively a 4141 with Sissoko and then Dier as the DM. Red Star rarely troubled us but when they did break their structure and had runners break our lines, Sissoko wasn't always best positioned. Not only that but the distances kept and tracking of N'Dombele and Dele were sub-optimal. A strong voice in there would probably tighten things up.


So yeah, a nice game with some lovely football but still worrying defensive lapses. I hope that we keep the second half shape as it seemed to work best for Son and N'Dombele in particular.
 
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