Match Threads Spurs vs RB Leipzig 1st leg - Match Thread

[davidmatzdorf]

I think Jose is the one who does not believe. If he put some faith in the players maybe we could actually be allowed to have some possession but like Chelsea and ManU under JM in recent years we have become a park the bus side ... a sort of upmarket Stoke

The problem is I don't see how the mourinho approach is going to win is trophies. Then what are left with a succession of ruined weekends and nothing to show for it, not even memories of great attacking performances or a ridiculous piece of skill. I remember the fa cup win but I look back more fondly on the screamer gazza scored in the semi final more.

There isn't a "Mourinho approach". He's always been a pragmatic manager, unlike Pochettino, who is an idealist manager who casts his teams in a prescribed way of playing. Mourinho has always tweaked the tactics to the opposition and his available squad. Pochettino has a vision of football in his head that he demands from his squad.

As I posted the other day, Mourinho is trying to scuffle an inherited squad through to the end of the season in a Champions-League-qualifying position and, until both of our world-class strikers were struck by season-ending injuries, he was on track to achieve that.

I reckon he has used two or three different "Mourinho approaches" already since he arrived, all in response to the injuries to four tactically key players: Davies, Sissoko, Kane and Son. But they're all improvisations, not an approach. None of them represents what he wants to do - he's said so several times in interviews, with varying degrees of ruefulness, using increasingly fanciful analogies.

Wherever we end up this season, the squad renovation will continue this summer and we can start to judge what the current "Mourinho approach" is next autumn, after he has had a chance at a pre-season with his squad.

More generally, the fallacy underlying the previous several pages of bad-tempered bitching is that the manager and the club ownership plan out our player transfers with the current season in mind. No club ever does this, unless they are threatened by relegation.

Mourinho would never have considered signing a striker in January with the current season in mind - he said almost exactly that in an interview about a week or two ago. Only fans think that way. If a suitable loan had been available, that might have been different, but what high quality striker would have signed a long term contract with a club that already had Kane and Son on its books?

Player transfers are never aimed at the current season and the reams and pages of fans complaining about it will never change that.

 

[Bulletspur]

During the game, I could not figure out why RBL players were so much fitter than Spurs.

Then I recalled something. From 21 December till 19 February they only played 6 games and had a clear break till 18 January.

Spurs played 13 games in two months and only had 5 days rest last week. No wonder they were first to every ball.

That wasn't the reason. How do you then explain Southampton doing the same thing to us when they have played just as many games as us?
It is down to Jose's tactics imo, lay back and absorb the pressure and attack on the break, a tactic that is ugly and that I am not in favour of.

 

[ostrov]

That wasn't the reason. How do you then explain Southampton doing the same thing to us when they have played just as many games as us?
It is down to Jose's tactics imo, lay back and absorb the pressure and attack on the break, a tactic that is ugly and that I am not in favour of.

I agree about tactics, passive, not proactive and I don't like it myself. But they were visibly fresher as well and it's difficult to argue - they had much lighter fixture list and almost a month without football.

 

[stov]

This exact approach has won him 27 (twenty seven) trophies, how can you even question that?

You may not see it yet which is fine and okay to be skeptical but I'm here for the long run, maybe you ought to be as well?

I didn't question that he has won trophies. But the majority have been won on a big budget with (Porto were dominant in Portugal and hoovered up the best players domestically and from South America where they had a magnificent scouting network which we don't). Past performance is no guarantee of future success.

My point is that just because he has won stuff before is no guarantee he will do so again. The conditions at spurs are different and football has moved on a bit from peak mourinho days. Given the above, id rather have enjoyable matches to watch than the potential of winning something but have to put up with turgid football for a couple of years.

But seems most on here are happy not to be entertained for the promise of trophies that may never materialise. If we do win a trophy or two it may be at the expense of our footballing principles which attracted a lot of us into supporting spurs in the first place.

Anyway, no point piping on about this any longer as I'll just collect more spams and dislikes.

 

[stov]

There isn't a "Mourinho approach". He's always been a pragmatic manager, unlike Pochettino, who is an idealist manager who casts his teams in a prescribed way of playing. Mourinho has always tweaked the tactics to the opposition and his available squad. Pochettino has a vision of football in his head that he demands from his squad.

As I posted the other day, Mourinho is trying to scuffle an inherited squad through to the end of the season in a Champions-League-qualifying position and, until both of our world-class strikers were struck by season-ending injuries, he was on track to achieve that.

I reckon he has used two or three different "Mourinho approaches" already since he arrived, all in response to the injuries to four tactically key players: Davies, Sissoko, Kane and Son. But they're all improvisations, not an approach. None of them represents what he wants to do - he's said so several times in interviews, with varying degrees of ruefulness, using increasingly fanciful analogies.

Wherever we end up this season, the squad renovation will continue this summer and we can start to judge what the current "Mourinho approach" is next autumn, after he has had a chance at a pre-season with his squad.

More generally, the fallacy underlying the previous several pages of bad-tempered bitching is that the manager and the club ownership plan out our player transfers with the current season in mind. No club ever does this, unless they are threatened by relegation.

Mourinho would never have considered signing a striker in January with the current season in mind - he said almost exactly that in an interview about a week or two ago. Only fans think that way. If a suitable loan had been available, that might have been different, but what high quality striker would have signed a long term contract with a club that already had Kane and Son on its books?

Player transfers are never aimed at the current season and the reams and pages of fans complaining about it will never change that.

The evidence of the mourinho way is on the pitch. At all of his previous clubs, he has played a similar abrasive style and signed players that fit that style. He has given us some platitudes about he has studied the game and will play expansive football and use youth.

I suppose we'll see next season, hopefully your right...

 

[Shadydan]

I didn't question that he has won trophies. But the majority have been won on a big budget with (Porto were dominant in Portugal and hoovered up the best players domestically and from South America where they had a magnificent scouting network which we don't). Past performance is no guarantee of future success.

My point is that just because he has won stuff before is no guarantee he will do so again. The conditions at spurs are different and football has moved on a bit from peak mourinho days. Given the above, id rather have enjoyable matches to watch than the potential of winning something but have to put up with turgid football for a couple of years.

But seems most on here are happy not to be entertained for the promise of trophies that may never materialise. If we do win a trophy or two it may be at the expense of our footballing principles which attracted a lot of us into supporting spurs in the first place.

Anyway, no point piping on about this any longer as I'll just collect more spams and dislikes.

Honestly I love entertaining footy, build up play, high pressing, clever movement quick transitional football but I want to win, we haven't had the experience of lifting a major trophy for nearly thirty fucking years, even the Carling cup was 12 years ago. I'd rather we at least have a go at winning trophies though, I'm tired of being the bridesmaid team and coming up short therefore at this stage I'm win at all costs particularly for the short term, the club is dying for some success and we've hired a man who knows how to be successful.

Of course there's no guarantees he'll win anything but we're in a position to speculate, we've set ourselves up for this to be on the verge of submerging ourselves at the top of the table so why should we be happy just to play good football, what is the actual point of football if you don't aim to win anything? It's completely your choice if you prefer that but you have to understand that people are willing to put up with this for the time being if it means getting us over the line, I am no different.

Besides here we are again judging the quality of football and style of play after 3 months in charge, why? Why are people so quick to judge when it is giving us the best chance to progress, he's been thrown in at the deep end and inherited a mish mash squad and to compound matters we have not strikers to call on, what are you entirely expecting for the time being? This is a a complete transitional season, we just need to get through it and take stock in the summer where the manager can continue to build and have a pre season with the team, if we're still witnessing this this time next year then we riot, until then we just got to wait it out.

Anyway he only has a 3 year contract which isn't a long time in football and going by his previous tenures that's probably the rough amount of time he'll be at the club so it's not as if we've permanently sacrificed our principles, he's been hired as a necessity to get us over the line for the short term, not the long term.

 

[Ionman34]

I didn't question that he has won trophies. But the majority have been won on a big budget with (Porto were dominant in Portugal and hoovered up the best players domestically and from South America where they had a magnificent scouting network which we don't). Past performance is no guarantee of future success.

My point is that just because he has won stuff before is no guarantee he will do so again. The conditions at spurs are different and football has moved on a bit from peak mourinho days. Given the above, id rather have enjoyable matches to watch than the potential of winning something but have to put up with turgid football for a couple of years.

But seems most on here are happy not to be entertained for the promise of trophies that may never materialise. If we do win a trophy or two it may be at the expense of our footballing principles which attracted a lot of us into supporting spurs in the first place.

Anyway, no point piping on about this any longer as I'll just collect more spams and dislikes.

And deservedly so.

Past performance may not be an indicator, but when he’s won major trophies at EVERY SINGLE TEAM he’s managed previously, it’s as good an indicator as you will ever get.

Couple that with the fact that he is a proven multidimensional tactician, able to adapt his tactics and, more importantly, able to coach his players to be adaptable to his varying tactics, then your assertions hold even less weight.

So it’s probably a good thing you’re leaving it alone, we won’t have to take the shovel off of you.