Poch: In or Out? - You CAN change your vote

[dontcallme]

But equally, who's to say that Poch gets the season from Levy and then decides not to up sticks and move anyway...?

A decision can't be taken on what he may do, you can only take a decision based on what he says he'll do.

Agree. Also best not to look too deeply into comments to the media.

The manager has to have constant conferences with the media and they ask probing questions trying to get quotes all the time. No one wants to give 100% guarantees or say they will definitely stay as situations can change quickly.

I just hope Poch and Levy are on the same page and in agreement for the next step.

 

[EastLondonYid]

Said go as he is not going to turn this around if he continues to select the ajax boys

Besides if he plays Ajax players we will be deducted points.

 

[scat1620]

Bump

 

[scat1620]

Reminder - you can change your vote.

 

[Deleted member 29446]

Reminder - you can change your vote.

This!

65% for Poch IN is mental!

 

[riggi]

Red star will do us.

 

[mike_l]

This must be another poll hijacked by Arsenal fans???

 

[gregga]

Just changed my vote. Don’t see how a manager can turn things around when he’s clearly lost the squad

 

[canadacelt]

Time to start a new poll to accurately track the mood right now, most people won't bother to change their vote

 

[mrlilywhite]

This!

65% for Poch IN is mental!

Yep totally agree! Never would I have thought that a manager of this club, who has turned in the performances that his team has would still hold so much sway over the fans. You have to seriously ask the question - who do you really support ffs

 

[dontcallme]

Yep totally agree! Never would I have thought that a manager of this club, who has turned in the performances that his team has would still hold so much sway over the fans. You have to seriously ask the question - who do you really support ffs

I support Spurs, thanks for asking.

Things have gone stale and we need a rebuild. We need to get rid of numerous players and bring in the next group.

I remain on the fence as to whether Poch should go and won't change my mind based on weekly results.

 

[muppetman]

Am still sticking with Poch but he needs to drop some players - Jan, Toby, Aurier, Rose all spring to mind. He needs to do something quickly or the decision will be taken out of his hands

 

[mrlilywhite]

I support Spurs, thanks for asking.

Things have gone stale and we need a rebuild. We need to get rid of numerous players and bring in the next group.

I remain on the fence as to whether Poch should go and won't change my mind based on weekly results.

It's not necessarily the actual results, it's the manner of them. We have looked less than bang average this season, bar one game against Palace, but as you mention weekly results, let's look at them so far to the point we are at now and we won't even go down the form from last year.

League

1. Villa at home we went behind but 3 late goals saved us from a home defeat. - Win
2. Man City away. How we got anything out of this game is beyond me - we were lucky, extremely lucky 2-2 - Draw
3. Newcastle home. We lost even though we dominated the game - couldn't break them down. Typical Poch problem when all else fails 0-1 Loss
4. Arsenal away. Tbf we should have won this but failed to see the game out at 2-0 - Draw
5. Leicester away. Another one of those games where we were a tad unlucky, but either way 1-2 - Loss
6. Southampton home. A good battling win after Aurier's red - on another day Southampton could have at least drawn that. - Win
7. Brighton away. Possibly one of the worse performances I have seen in recent memory. the whole team was completely bereft of any ideas of how to play a basic game of football. - Loss

Cups

1. Olympiakos away - They should have won - we were terrible and squeaked a point - Draw
2. Colchester away - Is there anything that needs to said about this one? - Loss
3. Bayern Munich - If ever there was a game that polarized Poch then this was it - 1st 30 mins we looked great, pressing and intensity was bloody good and if not for Neuer we could have shut up shop on this one before half time. It didn't happen and 30+ mins we were finished physically, and it's worth noting the word physically because for Poch to have any success, he needs a system that works to his ideal's and anyone of the Bielsa school of thought needs players who can play a high-intensity press for at least 70-80 mins. After those 30 mins, Bayern carved us open at will and not just because we were knackered, but because Poch didn't have a clue once his system was null and voided. Huge and unacceptable 2-7 Loss.

You say that things have gone stale and we need a rebuild, and whilst that is true, it isn't for the reason you might think we need one for. Poch's system (and we are talking singular here, not plural cause if you have been watching, you'll realise that Poch does not have systems or multiples of tactics) demands players that have high amounts of physical attributes, natural fitness, anticipation, determination - these I would suggest are the core parts of the system to work in any given situation of the Poch press - the fundamentals if you will. couple those with specific player attributes for a specific style of playing and you have a Poch press.

Now let's assume Levy says to Poch here is the £200-£300m you need to rebuild the squad for your style of play, and those core players you had 5 years ago that are burned out now we can take the hit on, go on fill your boots for the next project. Fast fwd another 5 years and Poch hasn't learned to adapt his system where it doesn't harm players fitness long term and they are old and natural fitness isn't what it once was, then asks to do it all over again - at what point do you stop and realise that actually the players have a fucking point and it's not the players directly, it is what is being asked of them that they can not do, unlike 5 years ago when he could get so much more out of them because that is what his system demands.

In a Klopp press system, these players we have would fair so much better than what Poch is trying to get them to do and when they can't do it, he sends them out with a Harry Redknapp "just run around, son" approach - which also translates to " I haven't got a fucking clue, so we'll just wing it". When people realise just how limited a manager Poch really is then perhaps they will start to look at different options. I mean christ on a bike ITK have been alluding to the problems for a good while and everyone just walks around with their hands over their eyes or fingers in their bloody ears! Poch has to go - the results won't improve and he should be gone by the time Liverpool have mauled us.

 

[dontcallme]

It's not necessarily the actual results, it's the manner of them. We have looked less than bang average this season, bar one game against Palace, but as you mention weekly results, let's look at them so far to the point we are at now and we won't even go down the form from last year.

League

1. Villa at home we went behind but 3 late goals saved us from a home defeat. - Win
2. Man City away. How we got anything out of this game is beyond me - we were lucky, extremely lucky 2-2 - Draw
3. Newcastle home. We lost even though we dominated the game - couldn't break them down. Typical Poch problem when all else fails 0-1 Loss
4. Arsenal away. Tbf we should have won this but failed to see the game out at 2-0 - Draw
5. Leicester away. Another one of those games where we were a tad unlucky, but either way 1-2 - Loss
6. Southampton home. A good battling win after Aurier's red - on another day Southampton could have at least drawn that. - Win
7. Brighton away. Possibly one of the worse performances I have seen in recent memory. the whole team was completely bereft of any ideas of how to play a basic game of football. - Loss

Cups

1. Olympiakos away - They should have won - we were terrible and squeaked a point - Draw
2. Colchester away - Is there anything that needs to said about this one? - Loss
3. Bayern Munich - If ever there was a game that polarized Poch then this was it - 1st 30 mins we looked great, pressing and intensity was bloody good and if not for Neuer we could have shut up shop on this one before half time. It didn't happen and 30+ mins we were finished physically, and it's worth noting the word physically because for Poch to have any success, he needs a system that works to his ideal's and anyone of the Bielsa school of thought needs players who can play a high-intensity press for at least 70-80 mins. After those 30 mins, Bayern carved us open at will and not just because we were knackered, but because Poch didn't have a clue once his system was null and voided. Huge and unacceptable 2-7 Loss.

You say that things have gone stale and we need a rebuild, and whilst that is true, it isn't for the reason you might think we need one for. Poch's system (and we are talking singular here, not plural cause if you have been watching, you'll realise that Poch does not have systems or multiples of tactics) demands players that have high amounts of physical attributes, natural fitness, anticipation, determination - these I would suggest are the core parts of the system to work in any given situation of the Poch press - the fundamentals if you will. couple those with specific player attributes for a specific style of playing and you have a Poch press.

Now let's assume Levy says to Poch here is the £200-£300m you need to rebuild the squad for your style of play, and those core players you had 5 years ago that are burned out now we can take the hit on, go on fill your boots for the next project. Fast fwd another 5 years and Poch hasn't learned to adapt his system where it doesn't harm players fitness long term and they are old and natural fitness isn't what it once was, then asks to do it all over again - at what point do you stop and realise that actually the players have a fucking point and it's not the players directly, it is what is being asked of them that they can not do, unlike 5 years ago when he could get so much more out of them because that is what his system demands.

In a Klopp press system, these players we have would fair so much better than what Poch is trying to get them to do and when they can't do it, he sends them out with a Harry Redknapp "just run around, son" approach - which also translates to " I haven't got a fucking clue, so we'll just wing it". When people realise just how limited a manager Poch really is then perhaps they will start to look at different options. I mean christ on a bike ITK have been alluding to the problems for a good while and everyone just walks around with their hands over their eyes or fingers in their bloody ears! Poch has to go - the results won't improve and he should be gone by the time Liverpool have mauled us.

Thanks for info, I am aware of our results.

 

[mrlilywhite]

Thanks for info, I am aware of our results.

And yet there you are, seemingly happy to sit on the fence and seemingly not alarmed by the actual way we are playing, let alone the results!

 

[dontcallme]

And yet there you are, seemingly happy to sit on the fence and seemingly not alarmed by the actual way we are playing, let alone the results!

Not what I'm saying at all though is it?

6 months ago if we fired Poch and the board said the players were tired of him, had run them into the ground and we were going stale almost everyone would have gone nuts at getting rid of a manager who had us in the top four and bound for CL final after taking us to top 4 finishes 4 seasons in a row.

So am I going to say he should be fired after an awful start and a long period of bad results? Not necessarily.

That doesn't mean I am not worried about our performances or results but I do think we need to choose our next move correctly. Poch has taken these players as far as he can and we now need to work out if he is the right man for what it is to come.

The reason I sit on the fence is because the older I get the more I realise that we can't judge situations completely on the outsider info we get.

I respect the ITK we get but I don't use it to say if we should fire a manager anymore than what the manager says to the press or the body language of people.

 

[Navin R Johnson]

I remain on the fence as to whether Poch should go and won't change my mind based on weekly results.

At what stage do you stop considering weekly results and start looking at a sequence of results?

 

[dontcallme]

At what stage do you stop considering weekly results and start looking at a sequence of results?

The factor on which I base whether Poch should stay as manager is on if he is the right man to help the squad for the next 1-3 years.

Us beating or drawing with Watford will not change that.

 

[Lennon1981]

I’m just clinging on by my fingernails Poch In

but only just. I love the man and I want him to sort this mess out. I worry that when has a manager at any club come back from this? It’s like they have ave all given up.

 

[rabbikeane]

Give Pochettino a new group of players and he'll turn them into non winners and burn them out in three years as well. Meanwhile we hear whispers of both Son and Kane instructing their agents into working on a get out.