Harry Winks - Leicester City

[NickHSpurs]

So you're saying that Winks actually is able to break the lines but chooses not to?

That's just daft. Yes Winks primary "job" isn't the same as say Ndombele's and Eriksen's but it's clear as day for me that Winks offensive contribution to the team is a huge gap in his play and our overall play at the moment.

And even if we assumed that Winks "job" is to solely recycle possession you have to ask if we're actually in need of that type of player anyway. A vast majority of the teams we come up against just sit deep and defend with 10 men behind the ball. It wouldn't have mattered if it's the masters of tiki taka Barcelona who'd play against Newcastle yesterday, if they don't have incisive passers in the middle they wouldn't create chances either. There's no wonder that Sissoko and Winks look much better against teams who go at us because in those matches there's much more space in the middle of the park. But then again most teams don't go at us so I once again question if they should start most matches.

Winks is a tidy player and I like him but if he doesn't evolve his game he's very much a luxury player as I see it.

No, exactly the opposite. I’m saying that’s not his game and it’s not what he’s being asked to do and that’s what people fail to understand. People do not understand what he’s being asked to do, they don’t understand the job Poch is giving him.

The problem is Poch playing him in games like yesterday where don’t really need him to keep the ball for us. The only way he works in games like that is when we’re in form. Again, it’s not his job to drag us through games like yesterday, he isn’t capable and it’s not what is being asked of him.

 

[Primativ]

Oh come on mate, he was an absolute beast against some of the best sides in the world. He has been exceptional against teams like Barca, Real and Dortmund.

Part of the problem is also Poch playing him in games like yesterday where we don’t really need him. We were always going to dominate at home to Newcastle, we didn’t need him to keep possession for us. His best games for us have always been when we were expected to have our backs against the wall or use possession well when we have it.

Are you saying you know better than all the many mangers and pundits who have given him plaudits and saying he’s part of the future for England?

Winks has done well in the CL at times, but he certainly hasn't replicated that in the PL. Can you point out which PL games he's performed well in?

On that last point, loads of pundits are always quick to hype up young english players when it is unwarranted. Some pundits even think he is England's answer to Frank De Jong. Yes I do think I know better than them in this instance, Wink is just a not very good Scott Parker.

 

[Dirtysanchez6]

Over rated

 

[ljinko888]

Absence must make the heart grow fonder it seems. Dier was a fucking car crash in midfield last season in a CM2 and that will be the case again if he slots in in place of Winks and somehow people expecting it all to click into place!

Absolutely we have bigger problems here at play than merely swapping Winks out but maintain the same system.

As a team many of our best performances came with Dier in the team. That 2015-17 period he was everpresent. The style of play was good. How much influence he was can be debated but we don't play that many dominant games with Winks in the team.

 

[agrdavidsfan]

As a team many of our best performances came with Dier in the team. That 2015-17 period he was everpresent. The style of play was good. How much influence he was can be debated but we don't play that many dominant games with Winks in the team.

It’s funny people don’t appreciate dier at all as he’s not an ass off seats kind of player but he is what we need at the moment

A screen a platform to play off and someone who can shout at others and lead them!

He will also hold his position and be there when he’s needed to be.

He will also do exactly what golden boy does (pass sideways)

But Eric can also pass sideways diagonally and sense danger.

 

[Dazzazzad]

We will have to agree to disagree then. He marshall’s nothing. He is weak defensively and offers nothing going forward.

If Poch doesn’t change it up soon it will end up costing him his job. Winks isn’t the answer in CM. We need a proper DM who gets stuck in and can win the ball, and a ball player alongside (Ndombele).

It’s no coincidence for me Winks becoming our main man in CM has coincided with it all going wrong and it being our worst year of the Poch reign.

He was injured for a big chunk of the year, prior to that the start of the year we were flying in the league and Winks was a regular starter.

Last season after New Years he only started in 2 of our league losses.

So you may as well say our form fell off when Winks went out - of course I wouldn't say that, there are a lot of reasons why we fell off but Winks playing definitely wasn't one of them.

 

[dtxspurs]

Honestly, how the fuck is he meant to pass it forwards when everyone in front of him is playing musical fucking statues.

Winks job has never been to beat three players or play a defense splitting pass, his job has always been to hassle people and keep/recycle possession when we have the ball which he does extremely well. If you don't understand that then don't comment as you're expecting him to be something he's not and has never been.

His poor form has coincided massively with Poch being tactically indecisive and not knowing what to do with our front 3/4. People have very short memories about how good Winks is when we've got the balance of the side right.

Well when he doesn’t hassle people on defense either.

All of our offensive players stop making runs when Winks has the ball and ask for the ball at their feet because they know he won’t get them the ball behind the defense.

What balance in the side are you looking for?

 

[Primativ]

He was injured for a big chunk of the year, prior to that the start of the year we were flying in the league and Winks was a regular starter.

Last season after New Years he only started in 2 of our league losses.

So you may as well say our form fell off when Winks went out - of course I wouldn't say that, there are a lot of reasons why we fell off but Winks playing definitely wasn't one of them.

No we weren't. At no point last season were we flying, we had literally a handful, 3 or 4 really good results, and lots of disappointing performances.

 

[Dazzazzad]

No we weren't. At no point last season were we flying, we had literally a handful, 3 or 4 really good results, and lots of disappointing performances.

I agree we weren't thrashing teams but in mid feb we were 5 pts off the top with a game in hand and a +26 goal difference.

This was by far our best ever points haul at this stage and one of the best by any team in the PL era.

Are you narrowly talking about performances? Even in spite of results?

 

[dtxspurs]

I agree we weren't thrashing teams but in mid feb we were 5 pts off the top with a game in hand and a +26 goal difference.

This was by far our best ever points haul at this stage and one of the best by any team in the PL era.

Are you narrowly talking about performances? Even in spite of results?

Anyone who watched last season knew the results in the second half of the season was much more of a reflection of our performances than the first half results. We played bad all season but got results in the first half.

 

[nedley]

I must like baloney then. Thought he was, when fit, one of our best performing players last season. I think he does a good job marshalling and controlling a contested midfield. My issue is more with his performances when we dominate possession. He doesn't have much impact in the final third so its a whole lot of sideways passing.

Happy to change my mind on this if he puts in more performances like today, but I like Winks a lot.

He was.

Unfortunately when the team is playing pathetically he's the obvious fall guy.

When we're firing on all cylinders he's the one that makes us tick.

He didn't play well yesterday. But absolutely no worse than any of the statues in front of him. Lamela did exactly the same when in possession: easy lay off. The difference is its Lamela's job to break those lines and make those incisive passes more so than Winks.

 

[wrd]

I'm a fan of Winks and to a large extent I'm a fan of Sissoko, I'm not a fan of them together especially without Eriksen.

 

[Dazzazzad]

Anyone who watched last season knew the results in the second half of the season was much more of a reflection of our performances than the first half results. We played bad all season but got results in the first half.

I just find it weird that people are discounting our best ever first 2/3rds of a season in terms of results to make this point. And some even pointing to the period where Winks was out injured, and we had our worse run, as a sign that he is a big part of the problem.

 

[nedley]

Winks has done well in the CL at times, but he certainly hasn't replicated that in the PL. Can you point out which PL games he's performed well in?

On that last point, loads of pundits are always quick to hype up young english players when it is unwarranted. Some pundits even think he is England's answer to Frank De Jong. Yes I do think I know better than them in this instance, Wink is just a not very good Scott Parker.

You can find out how he played in various games in Spurs Chat - Match ratings.

He's clearly a very good young player. He's been sub standard so far this season although with 10 others.

 

[dtxspurs]

I just find it weird that people are discounting our best ever first 2/3rds of a season in terms of results to make this point. And some even pointing to the period where Winks was out injured, and we had our worse run, as a sign that he is a big part of the problem.

And what did that best ever first 2/3rds get us?

 

[fortworthspur]

Ive said all along the sky's the limit with Winks but yesterday wasnt good enough. Ive seen him play better. This is the year he has to push on if he's going to become the player a lot of people think he can be.

 

[Dazzazzad]

And what did that best ever first 2/3rds get us?

Sigh.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

I see Winks is becoming odds on to be scapegoat #1 for the 2019/20 season

 

[Dirtysanchez6]

I see Winks is becoming odds on to be scapegoat #1 for the 2019/20 season

I see him being benched very soon when the squad is settled so you won’t have to worry about that

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

I see him being benched very soon when the squad is settled so you won’t have to worry about that

I wholeheartedly disagree