Player Watch Player Watch: Archie Gray

[onthetwo]

No I don't. You keep talking about a double pivot and I mention Sarr as giving us that option.

with the first touch that he has, playing Sarr in DM is a disaster waiting to happen.
Reminds me a lot of Sissoko in that regard so personally i never want to see him as a 6 again.

 

[mil1lion]

with the first touch that he has, playing Sarr in DM is a disaster waiting to happen.
Reminds me a lot of Sissoko in that regard so personally i never want to see him as a 6 again.

Again never mentioned Sarr in DM only in a double pivot. So basically I'm thinking

Bentancur/New DM​

Bergvall/Sarr

​

Let Gray develop his defensive game in central defence for a while. Then he can move to midfield similar to what Dier did. It also helps bridge the gap until Vuskovic is ready so when Gray moves to midified Vuskovic steps into his spot in defence. Gray can still cover in midfield if needed on occasion but he barely got chance this season with 4 other central midfielders. I think ultimately Gray will replace Bentancur when he's developed some more. The 6 role is so crucial it takes time, took Rodri time too. For now Gray just needs to gain more experience first and we have the experience of Bentancur and ideally sign a new experienced 6 for next season.

 

[Westmorlandspur]

Again never mentioned Sarr in DM only in a double pivot. So basically I'm thinking

Bentancur/New DM​

Bergvall/Sarr

​

Let Gray develop his defensive game in central defence for a while. Then he can move to midfield similar to what Dier did. It also helps bridge the gap until Vlahovic is ready so when Gray moves to midified Vlahovic steps into his spot in defence. Gray can still cover in midfield if needed on occasion but he barely got chance this season with 4 other central midfielders.

Vlahovic plays centre forward for Juve. Gray is not a centre back, cover in an emergency but never anything near his position. If Thomas Frank arrives he will play him as an 8, later moving to 6. That’s what he was told when in negotiations with Brentford.

 

[mil1lion]

Vlahovic plays centre forward for Juve. Gray is not a centre back, cover in an emergency but never anything near his position. If Thomas Frank arrives he will play him as an 8, later moving to 6. That’s what he was told when in negotiations with Brentford.

Yeah I corrected the name thanks. I'm just giving my opinion of what I think we should do which is the point of the forum. Not what I think a manager who doesn't even manager would do. Gray hasnt spent nearly enough time in midfield to come to that conclusion. His long term may be in midfield and that's what I'm suggesting as well. But he has played a lot more in defence and I don't see why he can't continue to develop his game there. I haven't seen anything to suggest he's suited as an 8 yet anyway.

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

with the first touch that he has, playing Sarr in DM is a disaster waiting to happen.
Reminds me a lot of Sissoko in that regard so personally i never want to see him as a 6 again.

Sissoko was strong and athletic but technically flawed. Sarr does not possess the same levels of strength but is technically superior.

 

[onthetwo]

Sissoko was strong and athletic but technically flawed. Sarr does not possess the same levels of strength but is technically superior.

Given that Sissoko’s first touch was usually a tackle ill give you Sarrs superiority in that department but still wouldn’t have Sarr receiving the ball out from the back in anything other than an emergency.

 

[onthetwo]

Again never mentioned Sarr in DM only in a double pivot. So basically I'm thinking

Bentancur/New DM​

Bergvall/Sarr

​

Let Gray develop his defensive game in central defence for a while. Then he can move to midfield similar to what Dier did. It also helps bridge the gap until Vuskovic is ready so when Gray moves to midified Vuskovic steps into his spot in defence. Gray can still cover in midfield if needed on occasion but he barely got chance this season with 4 other central midfielders. I think ultimately Gray will replace Bentancur when he's developed some more. The 6 role is so crucial it takes time, took Rodri time too. For now Gray just needs to gain more experience first and we have the experience of Bentancur and ideally sign a new experienced 6 for next season.

You probably know more about this stuff than me but whether we call it a ‘6’, double-pivot, libero, barista etc, my point is the same re Sarr ie he has technical limitations such that he struggles to receive and turn with the ball so that being asked to do so in a central position with strikers breathing down his neck is a recipe for disaster. Of our current crop id posit that BIssouma can do it (when hes in the mood) but the rest struggle. Dembele was the master but we havent had anyone close to his level for a very long time.
Personally id ty and get Mainoo for that role but not sure whether thats realistic or not.

 

[mil1lion]

You probably know more about this stuff than me but whether we call it a ‘6’, double-pivot, libero, barista etc, my point is the same re Sarr ie he has technical limitations such that he struggles to receive and turn with the ball so that being asked to do so in a central position with strikers breathing down his neck is a recipe for disaster. Of our current crop id posit that BIssouma can do it (when hes in the mood) but the rest struggle. Dembele was the master but we havent had anyone close to his level for a very long time.
Personally id ty and get Mainoo for that role but not sure whether thats realistic or not.

Again I've clearly listed Sarr in the advanced position.

 

[Grim54]

Again I've clearly listed Sarr in the advanced position.

But if you have one (Sarr) ''in the advanced position' and another in a more defensive position, then aren't you really talking about a classic CM/DM pairing?

In a double pivot, surely either one player or the other may take up a more defensive position, depending upon game circumstances. Both need to be defensively strong.

 

[mil1lion]

But if you have one (Sarr) ''in the advanced position' and another in a more defensive position, then aren't you really talking about a classic CM/DM pairing?

In a double pivot, surely either one player or the other may take up a more defensive position, depending upon game circumstances. Both need to be defensively strong.

So where do you think Sarr can play then?

 

[Grim54]

So where do you think Sarr can play then?

I think that Sarr is a CM who has a particular interest in going forward into (or close to) the opposition penalty area. So an attack-minded CM, rather than a defence-minded one.

 

[worcestersauce]

Jason Dozzell was fucking shite

But he was our fucking shite.

 

[mil1lion]

I think that Sarr is a CM who has a particular interest in going forward into (or close to) the opposition penalty area. So an attack-minded CM, rather than a defence-minded one.

I would say he's more box to box, covers a lot of ground and gets tackles and interceptions in recovery's. Needs to develop his reading of the game but I think he presses higher under Ange by instruction which often leaves the other central midfielder exposed. He probably does suit us more if we are pressed higher but I think predominantly Bergvall will start in the 8 but can drop into the 6. If we get a true defensive midfielder as a first choice it's largely going to be them and Bergvall. Then Bentancur and Sarr in competition each offering something different. I don't see Gray getting much chance yet, 5 is a lot for 2 positions.

 

[Grim54]

I would say he's more box to box, covers a lot of ground and gets tackles and interceptions in recovery's. Needs to develop his reading of the game but I think he presses higher under Ange by instruction which often leaves the other central midfielder exposed. He probably does suit us more if we are pressed higher but I think predominantly Bergvall will start in the 8 but can drop into the 6. If we get a true defensive midfielder as a first choice it's largely going to be them and Bergvall. Then Bentancur and Sarr in competition each offering something different. I don't see Gray getting much chance yet, 5 is a lot for 2 positions.

Yes. But we are short of options at 10. So if you look at it as 7 for 3 midfield places, its not so unreasonable.

 

[mil1lion]

Yes. But we are short of options at 10. So if you look at it as 7 for 3 midfield places, its not so unreasonable.

How often does someone other than Maddison or Kulusevski play as 10? I think we should be looking to sign a 10 as well anyway

 

[Grim54]

How often does someone other than Maddison or Kulusevski play as 10? I think we should be looking to sign a 10 as well anyway

Ah, now I have that space reserved for Jamie Donley from Summer 2026!

 

[mil1lion]

Ah, now I have that space reserved for Jamie Donley from Summer 2026!

Too early to say on him , hopefully gets a championship loan next season. Could succeed Maddison in a couple of years or may not make it to this level. I certainly see wouldn't leave ourselves short there next season on the off chance he does.

 

[DJS]

I remember Brentford we’re going to play Gray a box to box midfielder for the season before moving him back to defensive midfield.

So if we do get Frank maybe he’ll look to do this and we’ll see some good development of Gray as a midfielder next season.

 

[Wearegoingtowintheleague]

Again I've clearly listed Sarr in the advanced position.

Whilst I appreciate your opinion, I just can't see Sarr being a success in goal.

 

[Bluto Blutarsky]

I am really interested in seeing Frank work with Gray. Obviously Brentford wanted Gray last summer, so I assume the Frank has some idea of where he sees Gray - position wise.