What's new

Jose Mourinho

How do you feel about Mourinho appointment

  • Excited - silverware here we come baby

    Votes: 666 46.7%
  • Meh - will give him a chance and hope he is successful

    Votes: 468 32.8%
  • Horrified - praying for the day he'll fuck off

    Votes: 292 20.5%

  • Total voters
    1,426

Timberwolf

Well-Known Member
Jan 17, 2008
10,328
50,217
I do agree with this, however the squad appears to have a real confidence issue this season which is also making them look worse than they are too. With the right surgery in the key areas mentioned and a solid gameplan we can be competitive again.

Jose is making mistakes too, I fully agree there, much as Poch did before him this season with his obsession with the diamond. For me Jose needs to stop building our play around Aurier, needs to stop playing favourites with Moura and needs to find a way to thicken up our midfield to support our creaky defence.

Kane, Son and Bergwijn is enough attacking threat to win plenty of games, especially with Lo Celso feeding them. Jose seems to think chucking more attackers on the pitch equals more goal threat these days (maybe a reaction the criticism he received at Utd), but surely having a more solid midfield AND team unit would lead to us getting more chances in a game. Arguably at our peak we often had Kane, Dele and Eriksen as our front three, it's quality not quantity!

I think he is quite unfortunate in that he has inherited a lot of the mental issues, however it also in his remit to build confidence and motivation too.
For me I think our major problem is a lack of an attacking philosophy. Mourinho knows how to set up a team to defend but apparently, even when he was at his most successful, a lot of his attacking play was based on allowing his attackers to improvise and express themselves. That's fine when you have world class players and it's 2008, but I don't think that's good enough today.

That may have worked back in the day, but you look at the way teams like Liverpool, City, Bayern and, to a lesser extent, Chelsea, Dortmund, etc move the ball in attacking areas and everything is done with a sense of purpose. Space is exploited, passing moves are rehearsed and there's a genuine intelligence and purpose to everything. We're the polar opposite at the moment - it's all just completely off the cuff. Even compared to teams with half our talent like Brighton, Sheffield United and So'ton, our play style looks dated.
 

dtxspurs

Welcome to the Good Life
Dec 28, 2017
11,234
46,574
Either you are an actual optician or an idiot. How can anyone call Levy short sighted? He wants success now, and I can't blame him, after years and years of planning and building we apparently have everything in place.
You’re watching a team that has everything in place to be successful?
 

NEVILLEB

Well-Known Member
Nov 6, 2006
6,733
6,335
Mourinho is the Manager you’d appoint if you didn’t understand football. And that’s the real problem with Levy and why we’ve signed so many duds.
 

Ionman34

SC Supporter
Jun 1, 2011
7,182
16,793
Where do I am slating them? I was referring that I said judgement is still out after some meant we are now having a solid defense...
I guess you get me wrong here because I feel we pretty much think the same here.
No one said we had a solid defence, what was said was that the initial signs were good. I believe I even said that 2 games was still insufficient to make a sound judgement on.

Yesterday was downright awful, there's no denying it. The defending was atrocious in every department, from our fullbacks not being able to contain, to our midfielders being non existent, to our CB's not being goalside in our own 6 yard box. This is schoolboy stuff that shouldn't need to be coached to top flight professionals.

3 games in we've had 2 solid defensive performances and 1 abject debacle, which you'll have youth coaches using as a prime example of what NOT to do when defending. But just as you can't make a truly informed assessment from 2 good games, you certainly can't claim it's all gone tits up from one poor one.
 

carpediem991

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2011
8,836
20,308
No one said we had a solid defence, what was said was that the initial signs were good. I believe I even said that 2 games was still insufficient to make a sound judgement on.

Yesterday was downright awful, there's no denying it. The defending was atrocious in every department, from our fullbacks not being able to contain, to our midfielders being non existent, to our CB's not being goalside in our own 6 yard box. This is schoolboy stuff that shouldn't need to be coached to top flight professionals.

3 games in we've had 2 solid defensive performances and 1 abject debacle, which you'll have youth coaches using as a prime example of what NOT to do when defending. But just as you can't make a truly informed assessment from 2 good games, you certainly can't claim it's all gone tits up from one poor one.

No you can't. And this post wasn't directed to people who said jury is still out. In some posts it seemed we have now for fact a solid defence (that wasn't truely tested against Man United and West Ham).

Whatever, I hope we can sort out things already on Everton (giving myself an optimistic rating)
 

danielneeds

Kick-Ass
May 5, 2004
24,179
48,764
I think people are starting to fall into the trap of thinking our players are shit because of recent performances.

Our team isn't shit - there's tons of talent. On paper we're better than all but 3 or 4 teams in the league. We have some glaring holes in the squad (CDM, RB, ST) but I suspect most managers would still prefer our squad over that of Wolves, Leicester, Arsenal and certainly Everton, Sheffield Utd etc. Before the season started most would've also picked our squad over those of Man Utd and Chelsea.

The problem is the way we're setting up. We look like far less than the sum of our parts and that has to be the fault of the manager.

Personally I think we dropped a bollock bringing in Mourihno. Yes he's a winner, but he's also on a downward trajectory and with Liverpool and City being this good I struggle to see him winning us a trophy (which is the main reason you bring him in).

We won't be moving him on anytime soon, so we've basically got to hold on tight, hope that he can turns things around somehow. We're gonna have to grin and bear it for a while, and maybe, just maybe, he'll hit upon a system that works.

I still maintain, though, that our squad is largely quite decent and under the right manager we'd be up there fighting for 3rd.
I suspect you’re right that out squad does have more talent than it’s showed this year, and the imbalances and a lack of certain types of players - midfielders that can intercept and tackle, fullbacks that can cross or run at pace - has made other players worse.

However maybe it’s also time to accept that some of our players were significantly over-performing under Poch and have regressed so far that this may be their natural level.
 

alfie103

Well-Known Member
Jun 4, 2005
3,967
4,441
Mourinho is the Manager you’d appoint if you didn’t understand football. And that’s the real problem with Levy and why we’ve signed so many duds.

Why wouldn't you understand football if you decide to appoint Mourinho?
 

Timberwolf

Well-Known Member
Jan 17, 2008
10,328
50,217
I suspect you’re right that out squad does have more talent than it’s showed this year, and the imbalances and a lack of certain types of players - midfielders that can intercept and tackle, fullbacks that can cross or run at pace - has made other players worse.

However maybe it’s also time to accept that some of our players were significantly over-performing under Poch and have regressed so far that this may be their natural level.
Yeah that could also be true. Maybe some of our slightly more workmanlike players like Sanchez, Winks, Dier, Lucas and Davies are more mananger-dependent in terms of their level and are actually naturally more mid-table players?

I don't think there's any doubting the natural ability of the likes of Kane, Son, Lo Celso and Ndombele, though. Or the potential of players like Bergwijn and Alli.

If you put Pep, Klopp, Flick or perhaps even someone like Hasenhuttl in charge of this group of players, they could get them playing some exciting, progressive stuff. I don't have any doubt about that.
 

Phil_2.0

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2008
927
1,804
I generally like Mourinho but yesterday was the first time I think he got it obscenely wrong tactically.

The idea shouldnt have been to go so attacking, the first goal is so important vs a team like Sheffield United and we needed an extra midfielder to help control the game and protect the defense. It also looked like the team was way too spaced out like it was when he was coach of Manchester United, Dier and Sanchez played way too deep with the ball primarily because there was no Winks to drop in between the defence and take the ball or because they were scared to take risks.

There was a lack of protection for the full backs because it was a back 6 with 4 attackers standing up top. Son and Moura do not protect the full backs enough.

In future games if he wants to go 4-4-2 he should just play Sissoko or Gedson right midfield and Lo Celso on the left. Would much prefer to have a flat solid midfield with Kane and Son up front together.

A big red flag yesterday is the lack of compactness with the ball and without it, that was the main problem for him at Manchester United. The best teams in the world are the ones that push up together and keep distances between attack and defence short.
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,680
104,956
There's no system to compensate for the defensive fuckups like last night. Poch didn't have a magic wand to protect against those kind of things. If you have to "protect" your CBs because they can't stay goal-side of their man, it's a personnel issue.

It’s almost like we need a defensive midfielder or two. It’s the easiest position to play. There must be a couple of water carriers available in Europe that even our scouts could find.
 

Fittster

Active Member
Oct 21, 2019
87
143
Why wouldn't you understand football if you decide to appoint Mourinho?

Can managers change style? I think the evidence is that they cannot.

Does Jose style fit with the players we bought under Poch? If the answer is no, you need to retool much of the squad to play the kind of game that Jose wants. That is expensive.

Does the lack of investment between 2017 and 2019 mean a rebuild of the squad is required? I'd argue it does. Has Jose got a track record of rebuilding squads on the cheap, young players? No.

Mourinho is a square peg in a round hole.

A lot of this comes back to not having a DoF. If someone in that role determines the overall style of football that the club should be playing (Long ball, pressing, whatever), then they can select managers who have a proven track record with that style. It means that when managers move on you don't have to keep rebuilding the squad for a new style.

If a club determines it will play a long ball strategy, it means that if the manager decides he wants a short striker, he gets over ruled. If the first team coach requires a new striker, he and the DoF (who has the final say) work together to find one that meets the clubs style. If the manager moves on his replacement already has the players at his disposal to meet the clubs strategy.

A lot of this comes down to accepting there will always be a significant churn in first team coaches / managers. With a DoF changing manager shouldn't mean a whole rebuild of the squad is required with each coach change. The level of cost and disruption with a first team coach change can be significantly reduced.

So sack Jose, and employ Rasmus Ankersen from Brentford and tell him to steal as much of their IP as possible on his way out.
 
Last edited:

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
I generally like Mourinho but yesterday was the first time I think he got it obscenely wrong tactically.

The idea shouldnt have been to go so attacking, the first goal is so important vs a team like Sheffield United and we needed an extra midfielder to help control the game and protect the defense. It also looked like the team was way too spaced out like it was when he was coach of Manchester United, Dier and Sanchez played way too deep with the ball primarily because there was no Winks to drop in between the defence and take the ball or because they were scared to take risks.

There was a lack of protection for the full backs because it was a back 6 with 4 attackers standing up top. Son and Moura do not protect the full backs enough.

In future games if he wants to go 4-4-2 he should just play Sissoko or Gedson right midfield and Lo Celso on the left. Would much prefer to have a flat solid midfield with Kane and Son up front together.

A big red flag yesterday is the lack of compactness with the ball and without it, that was the main problem for him at Manchester United. The best teams in the world are the ones that push up together and keep distances between attack and defence short.

He was only doing what everyone told him to do in this thread.
 

Timberwolf

Well-Known Member
Jan 17, 2008
10,328
50,217
Mourinho is the Manager you’d appoint if you didn’t understand football. And that’s the real problem with Levy and why we’ve signed so many duds.
I think there's some truth in this. For all Levy's business savvy, he does make some odd managerial appointments and often gets swayed by signing either big names or the next big thing.

We signed Ramos because he was Mr Cup Winner at Sevilla, completely ignoring the fact that he didn't know the league or speak a lick of English.

We went for AVB even though he'd been shown up at Chelsea, because he still had that lingering 'next Mourinho' tag from his success in Portugal. He was the sexy, big name young manager on the market at the time and Levy couldn't resist.

Now we've signed Mourinho at a very questionable stage of his career even though he's the polar opposite of Poch in pretty much every single way, simply because he's Jose Mourinho.

He's the same in the transfer market - often trying to make that last minute, hail mary, hollywood signing rather than doing what's actually more logical and best for the team. Occasionally it comes off and we get a VDV, but more often than not it's a Dempsey or a Sissoko.
 

Phil_2.0

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2008
927
1,804
He was only doing what everyone told him to do in this thread.

Spurs have to get to trying to target clean sheets and knicking wins away from home. I don't mean that in a we're now a midtable club sort of way, I just mean get back to basics, grind out results away from home because we're still in the hangover phase from Pochettino where we believe we are on the level of an elite team that can go a dominate the ball and dominate like we did under peak Poch 2 or 3 years ago.

Once we build a foundation then we can start to look to dominate. Yesterday's team was a joke defensively and I am surprised Jose let that happen. Last 6 games needs to be 4-4-2, protect the full backs and look to get some sort of stability, instead of swinging massively between performances.

Need to restore some collective pride and work ethic into the team.
 

NEVILLEB

Well-Known Member
Nov 6, 2006
6,733
6,335
No?

lets be honest, Mourinho knows far more about football than anyone on this forum. You can criticise all you want but to say he is a 'has-been' or a relic is pretty silly.

I‘m not sure you’ve understood what I posted.
 

ILS

Well-Known Member
Jun 21, 2008
3,803
6,913
He will not even be able to really start planning until the season has ended and our final position has been determined. Alot of what we do next in respect of our transfer strategy for both in's and out's will depend on whether we have European football.

In all seriousness would it warrant spending £35m on another main striker if we only have 38 league games to play and the two domestic cups? Or would we better off buying another wide forward who will have an opportunity to get more game team with the limited amount of matches and use Son as our alternative option? Do we need one or two defensive midfielders? Do we need another left back if we already have two on our books? Do we need another centre half which hopefully they would have recognised we do, but what happens to Tanganga's and Foyth's development.

So the point I'm getting to is that the year we require a summer of reflection and time to rebuild, we have literally no time to make the necessary changes and assessments. You would hope these conversations have happened but after a performance like last night, that the realisation to alot of people we have more weaknesses then people would accept; I just don't trust Daniel and Jose to get the balance right.

I hope I'm wrong but come Christmas I have a funny feeling we will be back in the same postion as 12 months prior.
 
Top