Jose Mourinho

[irish doc]

Reality is that mourinho is paid 50k a day to at least get tactics right. So far we have been out played by Southampton twice , Chelsea twice, man Utd once , v lucky v Norwich twice . Against man Utd and first Chelsea game , we had both son and kane but they saw little of the ball.. This is very George Graham again who we were told also won trophies , but with terrible football, in the end we were delighted to see him go..
Danny blanchflower always believed we should win by playing the right way , he would be sick watching this football.

 

[matthew.absurdum]

I don't really agree with the criticism of prehistorical playing style (or yesterday man). I am not saying Jose's style works. But it does not mean that every good teams nowadays need to play like Klopp's or Pep's team. If it could work (a big IF of course), it does not matter whether it is prehistorical or not.

If you don't like defensive, reactive football style, then I can understand. (and perhaps a fair judgment) But saying Jose's style is prehistoric and "pass it" just always confuses me. One example is that almost none of the great team in EPL played 442 when claudio ranieri used it when they won the title.

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

Reality is that mourinho is paid 50k a day to at least get tactics right. So far we have been out played by Southampton twice , Chelsea twice, man Utd once , v lucky v Norwich twice . Against man Utd and first Chelsea game , we had both son and kane but they saw little of the ball.. This is very George Graham again who we were told also won trophies , but with terrible football, in the end we were delighted to see him go..
Danny blanchflower always believed we should win by playing the right way , he would be sick watching this football.

Spot on

 

[tony0379]

We are truly fucked no CL for next season no silverware this season again the short and mid term outlook looks bleak I really can't wait

Who needs silverware, when you've got a multiuse stadium?

 

[Sputic]

This sort of post really really boils my piss

you have no idea what he is like as a man, not in the media. Infact a huge amount of his former players talk so so highly of him? Your comments have now set the tone, you just don’t like Jose!

If you genuinely believe one of the most decorated and driven managers in world football has a tactic driven by hope I’m not so sure you understand football at all!

people often get excuses and reasons confused and I would argue you have done the same. There are factual reasons why we are struggling right now - not excuses, reasons

Only time will tell if it’s a mistake - and that’s something that can and will be afforded to one of the best managers in the world.
if he fails with us after 18months or so then so be it. He goes. Just like any other manager.
Your opinions are tainted by your personal dislike of a person, making them biased without looking at the evidence.

If you think the football we play and the football United played under him (in other words his last five years of work) is winning football or entertaining football, then good luck to you.

And yes I know United won a couple of trophies under him. In his first year, having won a trophy the year before. The longer he had with them, the worse they got.

 

[slartibartfast]

I don't really agree with the criticism of prehistorical playing style (or yesterday man). I am not saying Jose's style works. But it does not mean that every good teams nowadays need to play like Klopp's or Pep's team. If it could work (a big IF of course), it does not matter whether it is prehistorical or not.

If you don't like defensive, reactive football style, then I can understand. (and perhaps a fair judgment) But saying Jose's style is prehistoric and "pass it" just always confuses me. One example is that almost none of the great team in EPL played 442 when claudio ranieri used it when they won the title.

You cannot compare that organised, well drilled, Leicester team to what we are watching.
I agree though, too much is made of styles and formations.
All the best teams though always have square pegs in square holes and everybody knows what their job is. They also have a strong backbone of the team and that pretty much stays the same every game, a few tweaks due to injuries etc, but otherwise you can pretty much pick 80% of the team every match before they start and you'd get it right.
We were the same when we finished 2nd.
I appreciate we have injuries and a joke of a squad but we are so far off meeting that criteria its untrue.
It a shambles.
Nobody has any idea what position theyll be in or if they're even starting.
Tanganga has now played in 4 different positions and he's a young player breaking through!
I dont think the back four has been the same twice.
The full backs change every game.
Whose going in front of the defence this match? Absolutely no idea.
And then we wonder why we look a disjointed mess.
If you make that many changes every match it doesnt matter who is available you will more than likely look like the disorganised cluster fuck we have been watching since JM arrived.
Pick your best defence, pick your best midfield, pick your best formation and when possible stick with it until everybody has some idea of who they playing with and what they need to do.

 

[slartibartfast]

Who needs silverware, when you've got a multiuse stadium?

Meoww lol

 

[Deleted member 27995]

You're funny.
You think we're going to win something with this bloke playing this way?
Ok mate, whatever.

We haven't won anything in the last 12 with all those memories and footballers that have come through, why change the habit of a life time?

 

[Deleted member 27995]

While you're all at it, better get down on your hands and knees at the Shrine of Levy and thank him for giving you the VDV, the Bales, the dombele's the Walkers that you all look back fondly on and giving you the managers to create those memories (while winning nothing, while losing in Finals and semi finals to the likes of the Mourinho's of this world) and thank him for dragging Spurs into 21st century with a stadium that'll, sadly by the looks of things, never befit a team who hasn't won a fucking thing while all this has happened.

Memories, amazing, we can place last years Champions League Semi final next to the Audi Cup - what a club we are.

 

[chelmyid]

Understand your point, but everything in life has a cycle and eventually this cycle finishes and this also applies to football managers. The best people and businesses irrespective of their past success strive to consistently innovate, change and competitively position themselves for future trends and challenges. You can't sit back a bask in the glories of yesteryear as everyone else will be overtaking you.

Fair argument

however - his second stint at Chelsea where he was bad apparently - he still won the league and it was the players that stopped playing for him
His bad spell at Utd - he finished second and won two trophies with a shit group of players (ole is now struggling with the same)
My point being people keep saying he is past it etc yet facts suggest otherwise
I agree it’s not pretty at present but I think there is a much larger problem and that’s why I think he should be given time and at least immediate support - if that support wanes after 12-18 months, after two or three transfer windows and after time then absolutely fine - but after 3 months, missing your only striker, plus other key players plus the turmoil we were in is nothing short of farcical from our fan base

in my opinion of course ?

 

[Ron Burgundy]

I don't really agree with the criticism of prehistorical playing style (or yesterday man). I am not saying Jose's style works. But it does not mean that every good teams nowadays need to play like Klopp's or Pep's team. If it could work (a big IF of course), it does not matter whether it is prehistorical or not.

If you don't like defensive, reactive football style, then I can understand. (and perhaps a fair judgment) But saying Jose's style is prehistoric and "pass it" just always confuses me. One example is that almost none of the great team in EPL played 442 when claudio ranieri used it when they won the title.

what if we don’t have the players to best suit his style?

What would be better? Adjust the style or completely restructure the squad?

 

[doctor stefan Freud]

I really wish he’d just go with a 433, play Dele as a genuine 9 with Moura and Bergwijn in their proper positions as wide forwards. He can then rotate Gedson, Ndombele, Winks, Dier, Lo Celso and Skipp as the three midfielders. Where possible, give Sessegnon as much experience at LB. Just stick to a style and formation to at least breed familiarity within the squad. This chopping and changing just seems to reset us every game

 

[Wheeler Dealer]

We haven't won anything in the last 12 with all those memories and footballers that have come through, why change the habit of a life time?

So you're ultra confident we're going to win things under Mourinho.. I suppose we all need to have a dream

 

[Deleted member 27995]

So you're ultra confident we're going to win things under Mourinho.. I suppose we all need to have a dream

We got to a final last year with the man people still pine for and didn't turn up - not really a dream is it?

 

[mpickard2087]

I don't really agree with the criticism of prehistorical playing style (or yesterday man). I am not saying Jose's style works. But it does not mean that every good teams nowadays need to play like Klopp's or Pep's team. If it could work (a big IF of course), it does not matter whether it is prehistorical or not.

If you don't like defensive, reactive football style, then I can understand. (and perhaps a fair judgment) But saying Jose's style is prehistoric and "pass it" just always confuses me. One example is that almost none of the great team in EPL played 442 when claudio ranieri used it when they won the title.

Ranieri/Leicester can also be used to aid the argument I was making about the nuts and bolts of our tactical work not being good enough, which the manager should be criticised for.

If that Leicester team were sat in a deep block and won the ball back, Vardy would just immediately spin and run for the ball over the top/down the channel from Drinkwater (primarily) or Mahrez. Just totally drilled into them - win it, ball goes to either of those two, Vardy has made the run so play it. They scored numerous goals in this fashion catching teams out.

Leipzig game was primed for something similar. Them pushed up and with an aggressive press, their whole team just drilled to go one way in every aspect - forward and on the front foot. Trying to go into the feet of the front man constantly just helped them with this. I'd be fairly sure that they'd have looked more uncomfortable and it would have given them something to think about if we'd had the option for a rapid ball over the top, and then the knock on effect is they maybe start to have second thoughts, step out of the backline and press less aggressively, and space starts to open up for others in the midfield/attack to gather the ball in easier circumstances.

To my mind this is stuff that should have been absolutely drilled into them on the training ground in the days before. You work with someone like Moura, on the training pitch, using video analysis, whatever, explaining what you want from him and what he needs to do when we win the ball back. It should be a priority focus, given the need for an outball when sitting deep and our depleted attacking stocks forcing us to readjust.

It's not that I'd then be expecting goals etc. doing this, or for the players to successfully carry out these instructions, but I do want some evidence of trying to put said example of a plan into action. Evidence of players making that immediate spin and run, players making the early pass because they expect the runner to be there, and so on. Instead you see us going out and just ambling about without much of a clue to going about our business, which leads me to believe we haven't got a plan. Which leads me back to the coaching and preparation and tactical detail. If I think that is lacking I will always criticise that, whether a manager has been in charge three months or three decades. This is the absolute top level of the game, they're paid millions, and simple stuff like this should be meat and drink to them.

 

[danielneeds]

We got to a final last year with the man people still pine for and didn't turn up - not really a dream is it?

If you mean by “not turning up” we were the better of two bad teams that night, who got slapped with the softest of penalties after w minutes, controlled the game, created the better chances, we’re wasteful in the final third, then OK.

 

[ultimateloner]

He gives great post-match conferences consistently. Very charismatic; can't see how players wont react to him.
He seems to be methodical and diligent.
Don't see what there is to complain about. 'Style and tactics' are over-rated; you adopt to get the best result you can. If you don't think you can win you park the bus. Trouble is lately our FBs aren't reliable and we don't have proven strikers so we can't even park the bus to counter well.

 

[matthew.absurdum]

To my mind this is stuff that should have been absolutely drilled into them on the training ground in the days before. You work with someone like Moura, on the training pitch, using video analysis, whatever, explaining what you want from him and what he needs to do when we win the ball back. It should be a priority focus, given the need for an outball when sitting deep and our depleted attacking stocks forcing us to readjust.

Lucas is a very interesting case. I am not sure whether any coaches would improve him at his age now. Even in Poch's era, he always looked like a massive talent but have no idea what should do on the pitch. It is annoying that he does not utilize his pace and keeps run into bodies

 

[slartibartfast]

We haven't won anything in the last 12 with all those memories and footballers that have come through, why change the habit of a life time?

Its so hard to win anything in this country even at your best. Most countries have 2 giant clubs and thats it. We have Liverpool and Man U. Now Chelsea and Man City have bought their way in. And then there's Arsenal as well. 5 likely potential winners before you even start.
I personally will take JMs hoof ball tactics to win but we aren't organised enough to do so.
I think everyone knows and appreciates this season is a right off and that the squad is a bad joke but people want to see a glimmer of hope, that he's getting the best out of what is available or able to see what hes trying to do but thats just not happening.
We all know Levy isnt going to hand a blank cheque in the summer and let him buy whoever he wants (£300m isnt enough, Man U) so he needs to show he can do something with what he has or it'll only end one way.
Again publicly saying you have no players, even if true, isnt a way to get the best out of your squad imo. I guarantee some will already be taking that to heart, rightly or wrongly, and thinking well fk you.
I hoped he had learnt from that. Apparently not.
Going to be painful.

 

[CowInAComa]

Nothing wrong with playing on the back foot. If you do it well keep it tight and have a well drilled counter attack.

Leicester won the league doing it. Simeone has made a career of it taking on the big two of Spain successfully.

The issue is we neither have the players for it or the tactically wherewithal to have a coherent plan of action for when we attack or get the ball. We just basically immediately hoof it to a couple of tricksy lightweight attackers who are immediately dispossessed.

I just don't see how any coach could draw the conclusion given our squad strengths and weaknesses that our current tactics are the right tactics.

Even less so if we have no target man, it's a totally contradictory reaction to respond to having no forwards by hoofing to your nonexistent forward line. You have to build slow and bring in midfield runners.