Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

[Reece_Spurs]

So who does the buck stop with!

The chairman.

 

[cliff jones]

To be fair, if we'd won the past couple of games handsomely 5-0 then this discussion wouldn't even be happening today.

It all depends what the beholder sees the "problem" is I suppose. For me the problem is a tactical, over-coaching and confidence one. I believe those are the things that need improving upon if we wanted to have won more games and performed better so far this season, not a change of ownership.

I do feel that too many see literally everything as leading back to Levy, and I just don't buy into that being the case.

It does. He makes all the key decisions. From ticket prices, to appointing managers or dofs, to whether or how we could meet Palaces requirements for Eze.

Of course he doesn't pick the team, and decide whether Porro over or underlaps, but I'm not panning Levy for that. I'm questioning Ange.

I can't speak for others- who is suggesting Levy is directly responsible for that? Is it this imaginary poster called "people" again?

I saw elsewhere Levy wants to win. If that's the answer, the question is wrong. The question is will he pay the fees and wages to ensure we have a consistently competitive squad? With the right blend of established quality and younger prospects? Of course not.

Some posters, like you, don't seem to mind, you have a lower bar- whether you pay big money for your seat or not.

Others, like me, believe that if he won't he should stand aside. If you've been in the same job for a,quarter of a century surely it's time for a change?

It used to be Dein putting him in the shade, now its Barber.

After all this time, THFC deserves better

 

[cliff jones]

I can’t believe people don’t have faith in him. He is the man still in my eyes.

Trajectory. Those last 30 odd game stats?

We can't bury our heads in the sand.

Of course there are posters talking about knee jerking, or if we'd won the last two games 5-0. Back on earth, its still early doors for Solanke and he deserves more time- but what else is different, or better?

Some remarkably think that Kulu is already peak David Silva but when is he or Maddison gonna put real numbers up?

We're all desperate for it to work, but we desperately need a good performance and win today to give the playing squad (not fragile fans, lol) belief and confidence they can turn the corner

 

[SaKkA.kenchiku]

It's funny how all through the Summer every signing we brought in Ange was out the in press conferences telling us how long he'd wanted them, and as such posters on here were happy with them "because they were the ones Ange wanted". Now apparently he was not getting what he wanted and that's why we are struggling.

This may be over simplifying the point that people are using the transfers in summer as an excuse for Ange. Manufacturing a narrative that these were not his signings So to speak. He was positive on the signings from what I had interpreted but also it did also seem we did not push hard enough for key players in the ready made form, Neto or Eze for example. Ange seems to understand how Levy works and is working in that constraint, he could throw his toys out the pram in press conferences (which he seems to do when people question His methods) but seems to accept our approach to transfers, but I suspect he was not fully satisfied as, in my view and i believe this was. What Ange had been told (speculation on my part), We needed also the Neto/Eze (more Neto) type player ready to take our attack to the next level now to help the the young up and coming world talent. So my view is Ange might not be completely satisfied with the window and it would impact what he’s doing now but not using it as an excuse And we as the fickle lot were are amplifying this factor But there are many who are considering this as one factor not suddenly swinging their opinion.

As I work through this reply, of the point I believe you were making is that Ange is working within the boundaries that are Levy and the board approach. It may be the better way of working with Levy than Conte throw your toys out publicly or Poch more passive aggressively using the media to push levy/board. Ange also is creating his images, his brand and is in a position in his career where he cant just leave if the transfer policy is undermining his work.

 

[SaKkA.kenchiku]

Suppose I can't say much more than alreadys been said but this stat is so damning against a championship team.

Yet we won, and other games we had a large number of touches in the box and lost….

 

[SaKkA.kenchiku]

I think its a very lazy conclusion Ange didn't get what he asked for.

Again we have spent lots of millions in new players. Ange said he wanted Odobert and Solanke. Obviously we are still lacking a productive RW and an experienced no. 6 with a strong leader mentality, not sure these were Anges priorities.
And still he needs to do better with what we have. Next to zero flexibility and the line up is always a lazy pick of the more established players. We look so clueless on the pitch, like no one knows how to open up space or make useful runs.

I really would like Spence to start next game. Why? He deserved it by putting an effort in. Udogie did next to nothing so far this season. And with Odobert and Werner out we finally see some minutes for Moore hopefully. His intelligence could be useful.

I really feel Spence has earned his spot, what more can you do, he’s changed his attitude and performed well, was suspectable defensive at left back but was decent at right back. The biggest disappointment from the second string teams in Europa league league cup is they do not take their chance. Spence was direct brave, including telling Son where to move, and scored the vital goal. Udogie is clearly off and not fully recovered from significant surgery at the end of last season. Udogie is not the was as last season and probably for good reason. Hes defintiely earned a start or more minutes from bench now. He was really powerful gliding through against Coventry.

 

[jolsnogross]

This Neto and Eze stuff is tiresome speculation based on rumour and bullshit in here and elsewhere. Did we even bid for these guys? Ange said he's happy with our window. Says we spent most of it securing Solanke. Really wanted Solanke and sees him and Richarlison as ket components towards our next step. That'll need a bit of time, but he's hanging his hat on it.

We spent plenty of money. We're not at the point yet where Spurs have done enough under Ange for Levy to have undermined him already. Some of you are getting ahead of yourselves. Ange still needs to achieve something at spurs before we know he's being constrained by spurs.

 

[SaKkA.kenchiku]

He might be pushing a company line but if he is that’s concerning because it shows weakness on his part. The likes of Poch and Conte for their faults would never.

How did that work for Poch and Conte, Conte’s not weak approach meant he failed before he started really, it was quite an embarrassing break down and suddenly found the media and team didn't support his approach to have a tantrum in a press conference. Poch wasn’t a direct outspoken approach it was more cryptic in his approach but was showing his dissatisfaction through the media, you could argue that this is the best approach as he was the most successful working with Levy. Ange is on the other side and we are yet to find out how that works out. Also Ange is make or break his career for his route to the top. IF he fails at spurs he will back into the lower level teams and unlikely to get another big chance, such as Rodgers. Ange throwing his toys out I suspect and he seems to agree would not go well for him yet. He needs to build his name and credibility at the top to exert more pressure and will be better to do so like Poch did not Conte or Jose. Levy is here, so you have to work within that framework or leave, Ange does not want to leave as he wont get anythino higher than spurs again. He’s worked a long way to get to this position. I believe he’s showing good management of this situation to work to the top. Hopefully he can do the same with his tactics until he gets the right level of players to succeed in his ideal style and structure of football.

 

[Sarsipius]

Suspectable indeed.

 

[Styopa]

This Neto and Eze stuff is tiresome speculation based on rumour and bullshit in here and elsewhere. Did we even bid for these guys? Ange said he's happy with our window. Says we spent most of it securing Solanke. Really wanted Solanke and sees him and Richarlison as ket components towards our next step. That'll need a bit of time, but he's hanging his hat on it.

We spent plenty of money. We're not at the point yet where Spurs have done enough under Ange for Levy to have undermined him already. Some of you are getting ahead of yourselves. Ange still needs to achieve something at spurs before we know he's being constrained by spurs.

I think "Neto" and "Eze" are placeholders for any top-quality, relatively experienced player who’s ready to step into the first team and make an immediate impact. Solanke could arguably fit that category, while Bergvall, Gray, and Odobert don’t, or we shouldn't be relying on them to.

The issue, as always, isn’t the transfer fees—it’s the salaries. That’s been Spurs' longstanding problem. We’ve never hesitated to compete on fees; we paid nearly £17 million for Bent going on 20 years ago. In relative terms, that's pretty similar to the Solanke deal today. But, as Harry Redknapp hinted around the same time, we struggle to attract top-tier talent because we tend to hold back when it comes to offering top-tier wages.

Still, I agree that Ange needs to make the most of the players he has available. It’s the situation he’s in, and he’ll have to find a way to make it work, or risk becoming the fifth manager sacked in the last five years. Honestly, though, I don't hold out much hope for the 6th manager in 5 years being the one to get it right either.

 

[E17yid]

Feeling more positive today. Expecting a big response from Ange and the players and think we’ll do Brentford. Would be nice to get a good performance and win but will obviously settle for a 1-0.

 

[west indie]

What Ange an us fans need, is the senior players who have been here 2, 3, 4 years to now start delivering / fulfilling their potential and take the mantle from Sonny to become the foundation for us to build around.

We shouldn't be relying on 32 year old winger Sonny to pull us through every game, it's now time for other senior players to come out of the shadows and start delivering or ship out, simple.

I'm still Ange in, let's go and beat Brentford and make it two wins out of two.

 

[Styopa]

What Ange an us fans need, is the senior players who have been here 2, 3, 4 years to now start delivering and take the mantle from Sonny and become the foundation for us to build around.

We shouldn't be relying on 32 year old winger Sonny to pull us through every game, it's now time for other senior players to come out of the shadows and start delivering or ship out, simple.

I'm still Ange in, let's go and beat Brentford and make it two wins out of two.

Yeah, some of the senior players need to step up. We need bigger performances from the likes of Romero, Bentancur and Maddison. Vicario needs to command his box better. Bissouma needs to be more consistent. If Ange can get these guys performing well again, that could change everything. The problem is they all seem so flaky at the moment.

 

[west indie]

Yeah, some of the senior players need to step up. We need bigger performances from the likes of Romero, Bentancur and Maddison. Vicario needs to command his box better. Bissouma needs to be more consistent. If Ange can get these guys performing well again, that could change everything. The problem is they all seem so flaky at the moment.

Fully agree Styopa, we should be at the stage where Rodrigo, Biss, Deki, Ritchie, Cuti, Timo, Madders etc have raised the bar performance wise that Gray, Bergvall etc can be eased in, but sadly that's not the case. Time has come for them to start putting up proper figures goals/assists wise, minimum 7 out of 10 performances, justify being here to take us to the next level.

The club has invested in them, us fans have invested in them for years now, Kane has gone and not one of them have stepped up, we ain't got time to wait till they reach potential in 2026, 27, 28 having then been at the club 6 years plus, no more lip service after another poor performance now is time to pull your weight to kick start our season.

 

[Metalhead]

So who does the buck stop with!

Levy is bulletproof so the buck will always stop with the head coach.

 

[ajspurs]

What Ange an us fans need, is the senior players who have been here 2, 3, 4 years to now start delivering / fulfilling their potential and take the mantle from Sonny to become the foundation for us to build around.

We shouldn't be relying on 32 year old winger Sonny to pull us through every game, it's now time for other senior players to come out of the shadows and start delivering or ship out, simple.

I'm still Ange in, let's go and beat Brentford and make it two wins out of two.

I'm not sure they have it in them. I thought it was an issue prior to the Arsenal game that I looked around and was unsure of where the big performances were going to come from. We'd relied on a younger Son and Kane for so long in that respect. Not saying we're incapable of winning or anything, far from it, but I don't see the players there who will step up when things do get a little tough, or when we need that additional quality.

I probably look at someone like Maddison the most as someone who should be stepping up for us in such moments, but I think a big issue is that I'm not sure it's something I even expect from a lot of the others. We miss that profile of player IMO.

 

[SA_Spurs]

It does. He makes all the key decisions. From ticket prices, to appointing managers or dofs, to whether or how we could meet Palaces requirements for Eze.

Of course he doesn't pick the team, and decide whether Porro over or underlaps, but I'm not panning Levy for that. I'm questioning Ange.

I can't speak for others- who is suggesting Levy is directly responsible for that? Is it this imaginary poster called "people" again?

I saw elsewhere Levy wants to win. If that's the answer, the question is wrong. The question is will he pay the fees and wages to ensure we have a consistently competitive squad? With the right blend of established quality and younger prospects? Of course not.

Some posters, like you, don't seem to mind, you have a lower bar- whether you pay big money for your seat or not.

Others, like me, believe that if he won't he should stand aside. If you've been in the same job for a,quarter of a century surely it's time for a change?

It used to be Dein putting him in the shade, now its Barber.

After all this time, THFC deserves better

well said mate. in any other industry or sporting institution, DL would've been fired a long time ago (for a lack of performance). He's cleverly separated himself from the on-field matters (and clearly he has fans who believe the same) almost as if he has nothing to do with it. The proof is the fact we've had some of the world's top managers (conte, mou) & a few world class talents (Bale, Madrid, Berba, Kane, Son) who never achieved anything in his time.

Quite simply, DL has mastered the art of doing just the right amount to keep himself & the board that supports him happy and doing just the right amount of buying / spend (look how many ppl are saying Ange has spend xx million already) but never buying the top talent or the players the team needs when they need it.

I said in another post, it's incredible how during Mou's time we didn't buy the defenders he wanted - but we have them now (Romero, VDV & Dragusin) and during Conte's time, we didn't get any of the players he wanted & now during Ange's time we already have opted for lesser players (before anyone argues on this point, I seriously doubt Ange is gonna say he didn't get the players he wanted - he is going to lose change room and board room & get fired then).

Agree, THFC, the sporting institution deserves better. It deserves a chairman that prioritises winning and driving a winning culture though everything at the club. DL has determined that a winning culture is the stadium, hotels & additional revenue streams. That's winning in the boardroom! In 25 years, he has not once prioritised a winning football culture & it's truly hurting the fans, the club's stature (as a brand) and no doubt the players as coaches.

 

[sundanceyid10]

well said mate. in any other industry or sporting institution, DL would've been fired a long time ago (for a lack of performance). He's cleverly separated himself from the on-field matters (and clearly he has fans who believe the same) almost as if he has nothing to do with it. The proof is the fact we've had some of the world's top managers (conte, mou) & a few world class talents (Bale, Madrid, Berba, Kane, Son) who never achieved anything in his time.

Quite simply, DL has mastered the art of doing just the right amount to keep himself & the board that supports him happy and doing just the right amount of buying / spend (look how many ppl are saying Ange has spend xx million already) but never buying the top talent or the players the team needs when they need it.

I said in another post, it's incredible how during Mou's time we didn't buy the defenders he wanted - but we have them now (Romero, VDV & Dragusin) and during Conte's time, we didn't get any of the players he wanted & now during Ange's time we already have opted for lesser players (before anyone argues on this point, I seriously doubt Ange is gonna say he didn't get the players he wanted - he is going to lose change room and board room & get fired then).

Agree, THFC, the sporting institution deserves better. It deserves a chairman that prioritises winning and driving a winning culture though everything at the club. DL has determined that a winning culture is the stadium, hotels & additional revenue streams. That's winning in the boardroom! In 25 years, he has not once prioritised a winning football culture & it's truly hurting the fans, the club's stature (as a brand) and no doubt the players as coaches.

This, Levy also thinks 4th is winning and embarrassing comments like finishing above Arsenal like it’s a trophy.

 

[E17yid]

I'm not sure they have it in them. I thought it was an issue prior to the Arsenal game that I looked around and was unsure of where the big performances were going to come from. We'd relied on a younger Son and Kane for so long in that respect. Not saying we're incapable of winning or anything, far from it, but I don't see the players there who will step up when things do get a little tough, or when we need that additional quality.

I probably look at someone like Maddison the most as someone who should be stepping up for us in such moments, but I think a big issue is that I'm not sure it's something I even expect from a lot of the others. We miss that profile of player IMO.

You might be right but I’m going to disagree at the moment. I think they can but like any player they need to be managed correctly.

If what you say is true, then it’s even more of a damning indictment on Ange as he puts so much emphasis on character when recruiting players. We’ve all heard the stories about the phone calls and what not so if players like Maddison, Solanke, Johnson etc haven’t got it in them to step up when needed then, as I say, it’s a damning indictment on Ange. As I say, though, I think they do, well, I hope so anyway.

 

[kitchen]

Wow. The lack of patience from supporters is shocking.

BBC article today putting Ange under pressure. Just like the idiot gooners most of us would have wanted Arteta out after finishing 8th. Now look at them when they actually stuck with and backed a manager.

Ange is the right man. He's the right fit. His football is the right sort. He needs time.

Unfortunately most football fans want instant success and will want him out after a few losses. Losses where we've outplayed the opposition mind, lost by fine margins and were a bit of attacking quality short of being the real deal. The game where we played badly (Coventry) we won and that's football.

Unless we have a terrible season, which I don't think we will. He needs to stay. He still needs a few more transfer windows and more time but given time it will come good in my opinion. I have faith in the man.