What's new

Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

soup

On the straightened arrow
May 26, 2004
3,511
3,633
I watched his press conference and I am even more Ange in than I was yesterday/Friday. He gets it.
He embodies a real Tottenham coach so there's no one better for me. Give him a 6 year contract and the patience he needs.
 

only1waddle

Well-Known Member
Jun 18, 2012
8,417
13,044
I think we need to watch his press conferences more.

So much criticism in the last few weeks on what he has said about set pieces but all they’ve done is read a single line quote rather than taking on board what he has actually said.

I think the criticism of our set piece defending is valid even if you understand the bigger picture Ange was conveying.
Saying it's all part of a bigger picture and we shouldn't be giving away cheap free kicks and corners is valid, but to expect us to do that in the first year, after Celtic suffered the same thing is a bit negligent on his part, especially when it's now happening more frequently, that's arrogance on his part, and a bit disrespectful to people paying to watch and travel to games.
I'm on the Ange train but he was talking some bollocks there.
 

dontcallme

SC Supporter
Mar 18, 2005
35,108
87,557
I think the criticism of our set piece defending is valid even if you understand the bigger picture Ange was conveying.
Saying it's all part of a bigger picture and we shouldn't be giving away cheap free kicks and corners is valid, but to expect us to do that in the first year, after Celtic suffered the same thing is a bit negligent on his part, especially when it's now happening more frequently, that's arrogance on his part, and a bit disrespectful to people paying to watch and travel to games.
I'm on the Ange train but he was talking some bollocks there.
I didn’t say the criticisms of our set pieces is invalid. I said the misinterpretation of his words is.
 

TEESSIDE1

Married, new job and Spurs on the up!
Jul 3, 2006
15,453
19,385
Beating Burnley and Sheffield secures us 5th, that’s all we need to focus on.

No point in throwing the toys out the pram because of 2 losses to Liverpool and City, it would be unfair to judge him based on those games. We never win at Anfield, and City promised to borrow us the title for a few weeks if we help them win it.

We’ll never win anything again if we continue our approach of oh it’s Liverpool, City and co… let’s not turn up.

Look at Palace - absolutely woeful pre the new manager. They’ve the same crap defence and midfield but now they’re defending as a team and picking up some very good results. Whereas we’ve better players but most of the squad are playing like rabbits in headlights.

They’re not miraculously going to be any better next season. Regardless of whether we bring in 2-3 quality first team players, we’re still going to have the same riff raff who can’t be relied upon. Our squad needs a major overhaul, granted it can’t be all done in one window but you’re talking 10 plus players out and 10 in. Unless we may some major improvements in the summer we’ll be no better next season.
 

only1waddle

Well-Known Member
Jun 18, 2012
8,417
13,044
I didn’t say the criticisms of our set pieces is invalid. I said the misinterpretation of his words is.

Yeah I get that, the media will cut corners for sound bites, I'm just saying even his full explanation has an element of bollocks about it.
 

TEESSIDE1

Married, new job and Spurs on the up!
Jul 3, 2006
15,453
19,385
Yeah I get that, the media will cut corners for sound bites, I'm just saying even his full explanation has an element of bollocks about it.

Over the last few years we’ve heard ‘we need to build from the back’ in response to us needing a new defence. We’ve now finally got:

A decent keeper
A decent right back
2 potential world class centre backs
1 very promising centre back
1 potential world class left back

Yet our defence looks a complete shambles due to our suicidal tactics.

You would think now that we’ve got a very good first XI set of defenders that this would be a foundation to build on. Keep it solid at the back, get the best out of our currently available full set of central midfielders and make the most of our limited attacking options.

Instead Ange looks to have a scattergun approach, trying to apply band aids here there any everywhere without consolidating and making the most of the players currently available to him. Sure he wants them to play a certain style of football but if we don’t have the players to do it, all you’re going to do is damage the player’s confidence and expose their weaknesses for the rest of the league to see and take advantage of.
 

easley91

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2011
19,820
56,610
Yeah I get that, the media will cut corners for sound bites, I'm just saying even his full explanation has an element of bollocks about it.
It's not just the media who do it either. They will all take one line out of context and spin it a certain way to invite a specific (often negative) reaction for engagement. You need to watch the whole press conference/interview to see it in full to really get the entire picture. And that isn't just for Ange, it's for every single interview in every walk of life whether it be sport or entertainment.

Even IF his full explanation has an element of that, at least you have the full quote in context with question and his tone of voice/body language (yes they matter too).
 

TEESSIDE1

Married, new job and Spurs on the up!
Jul 3, 2006
15,453
19,385
It's not just the media who do it either. They will all take one line out of context and spin it a certain way to invite a specific (often negative) reaction for engagement. You need to watch the whole press conference/interview to see it in full to really get the entire picture. And that isn't just for Ange, it's for every single interview in every walk of life whether it be sport or entertainment.

Even IF his full explanation has an element of that, at least you have the full quote in context with question and his tone of voice/body language (yes they matter too).

The media do have a point though as we’re going backwards not forwards.

I get what Ange is saying in that you can’t just fix the defence when both the midfield and forward play are also broken.

In saying that his approach is flawed in that he needs to be making the most of what he’s got. Barring the recent injury to Udogie and now Werner, he’s pretty much got a full strength squad in terms of his likely 1st XI players.

As per my post a few mins ago, our best players are in defence…. make this your foundation and build on it. Until we can bring in the type of players he wants, any competent manager would make the most of what they have to play with. He comes across as beyond stubborn… keep it tight at the back, be competitive in central midfield and play counter attacking football… don’t carry on as we are as we’re getting worse, not better.

Confidence aside, there is no way our current squad should be putting in the lacklustre and disjointed performances we’ve had to put up with for the past few months. They’re better than this. It’s the tactics that are the problem.
 

only1waddle

Well-Known Member
Jun 18, 2012
8,417
13,044
It's not just the media who do it either. They will all take one line out of context and spin it a certain way to invite a specific (often negative) reaction for engagement. You need to watch the whole press conference/interview to see it in full to really get the entire picture. And that isn't just for Ange, it's for every single interview in every walk of life whether it be sport or entertainment.

Even IF his full explanation has an element of that, at least you have the full quote in context with question and his tone of voice/body language (yes they matter too).

I've seen it and understand it, it's still bollocks, and it's bollocks because the logic isn't there, but, I get what he's saying about not coughing up cheap free kicks or losing possession and giving away corners, it's a bigger picture, but...
Under pressure after Arsenal they clearly made tactical changes for corners against Chelsea, and we looked better.
It should have been addressed earlier and it was negligence that it wasn't.
 

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
22,899
83,046
I'm pretty sure Ange was asked this question and said he doesn't tell players where to go - he coaches them to make decisions based on the game state. Same as the match where we had 100 passes between Vicario and Romero. The players decide what and where. Ange tries to coach them the philosophy and they try to apply it
And it's pretty obvious some are struggling to know how to do that when opposition players become compact or adapt to their movement.

The only way to overcome that is by having players who are intelligent and constantly adapt to what thr opposition do or players who are incredibly brave on the ball and have the technique to take players out.

Just to list

Richy - doesn't have particularly good 1v1 actions in his locker, and isn't explosive. Decent hold up and movement but he isn't making something happen on his own.

Johnson - With a bit of space he can get beyond defenders but from a standing position or on the ball reception he isn't going to make something happen. His skills will be useful.

Son - His best movement is always in behind or cutting in but for that to work, he needs players who are taking out defenders/drawing out defenders in the middle. We aren't doing that.

Deki - He's powerful and he can hold 2 players off at the same time when he's getting in behind but at the same time he isn't able to really burst away and his right foot let's him down at times.

Maddison - The only player who can hit the ball with little back lift on both feet or receive with excellent balance on the turn in tight spaces. However, he often goes through inconsistent periods when things are a little tough.

Could go through more but I see all of our players having some form of weakness that prevents them from doing the things I mentioned originally.
 

Locotoro

Prince of Zamunda
Sep 2, 2004
9,685
14,890
Over the last few years we’ve heard ‘we need to build from the back’ in response to us needing a new defence. We’ve now finally got:

A decent keeper
A decent right back
2 potential world class centre backs
1 very promising centre back
1 potential world class left back

Yet our defence looks a complete shambles due to our suicidal tactics.

You would think now that we’ve got a very good first XI set of defenders that this would be a foundation to build on. Keep it solid at the back, get the best out of our currently available full set of central midfielders and make the most of our limited attacking options.

Instead Ange looks to have a scattergun approach, trying to apply band aids here there any everywhere without consolidating and making the most of the players currently available to him. Sure he wants them to play a certain style of football but if we don’t have the players to do it, all you’re going to do is damage the player’s confidence and expose their weaknesses for the rest of the league to see and take advantage of.
Defending starts from the front not just with the defenders. We have the right defenders but our midfield and attack are not closing the gaps in front of the defence so it doesn't matter if we have 4 genetically engineered clones of Maldini we will leak goals without the right protection and wasteful attacking play
 

Dakes

DNA of the Tottenham
Jan 28, 2020
2,450
8,237

I love this and I hope everyone pays attention to what he said here.

I firmly believe we can be successful (win things) IF we provide him with the tools he seeks - players with the skills and courage to consistently do what he expects of them.
 

Locotoro

Prince of Zamunda
Sep 2, 2004
9,685
14,890
And it's pretty obvious some are struggling to know how to do that when opposition players become compact or adapt to their movement.

The only way to overcome that is by having players who are intelligent and constantly adapt to what thr opposition do or players who are incredibly brave on the ball and have the technique to take players out.

Just to list

Richy - doesn't have particularly good 1v1 actions in his locker, and isn't explosive. Decent hold up and movement but he isn't making something happen on his own.

Johnson - With a bit of space he can get beyond defenders but from a standing position or on the ball reception he isn't going to make something happen. His skills will be useful.

Son - His best movement is always in behind or cutting in but for that to work, he needs players who are taking out defenders/drawing out defenders in the middle. We aren't doing that.

Deki - He's powerful and he can hold 2 players off at the same time when he's getting in behind but at the same time he isn't able to really burst away and his right foot let's him down at times.

Maddison - The only player who can hit the ball with little back lift on both feet or receive with excellent balance on the turn in tight spaces. However, he often goes through inconsistent periods when things are a little tough.

Could go through more but I see all of our players having some form of weakness that prevents them from doing the things I mentioned originally.
Everything you've said is correct but I don't think the players abilities are the problem. I think it's more their belief and bravery. They all have the ability to carry out Ange's approach the way he wants to but they are scared at the moment. They get the ball in really good positions high and wide and instead of running at the full back they opt to pass it back inside and recycle the ball safely. Every match I watch I'm thinking "yes son, go at him. Yes Deki you got your fullback beat" but seconds later the foot goes on the top of the ball and it goes backwards. The defence stacks up and then we're back to square 1. And when the winger doesn't go at the defender, the pass doesn't come into the box, the striker doesn't make his run, everything becomes static.

That's the lack of self belief I think Ange is referring to. Each of these players can already execute the way they should be they are second guessing themselves
 

Cinemattis

Fully Functional Member
Aug 5, 2013
1,042
4,118
Two of the most important components of a glass cannon, which is what it seems Ange wants to build, is someone who can consistently load the shells and a good marksman. There's no point trying to fire huge shells if they're not being loaded up or don't hit the target.

I think his endgame is to build a team akin to a Real Madrid, Man City or even Arsenal now, who has the other team rolling over before a ball is even kicked through outright expected domination of the pitch and ball, and for that we need real ballers.
In the abysmal performance against Celsea, there was - for me - one small glimmer of light. The last 5-10 minutes with Madders, Benta and GLC on the pitch at the same time. It was obvious that these threee together had some kind of connection and not at least joy in playing together. In the right circumstances I´d love to se all three of them for a longer run together. These are proper ballers.

Can´t really understand what GLC does wrong, the eye test tells me more often than not that we become more forward minded and faster in the ball distribution with him in the side. Might of course be the fact that he´s only brought on in the do or die minutes at the end of a match when we need a goal. But never the less ... Would lvoe to see Madders and GLC playing in front of a proper 6, I suspect on the day the could out play most teams in the PL.
 
Top