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Manager Watch: Ange Postecoglou

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
55,790
102,323
Ange said he already has his coaching staff working on set pieces and doesn't generally employ an out and out specialist.

Some on here have taken this to mean that he doesn't care about defending corners, or something.

The irony in that statement.

Well we fucking should be using a specialist because its an extremely repetitive problem and its negligent to allow the current set up to continue with the set piece work as its costing us overall.
 

fishhhandaricecake

Well-Known Member
Nov 15, 2018
20,020
49,987
Agreed, but it feels like a short term and very specific problem, rather than overall shittiness.
💯 it seems fixable compared to like under AVB or Nuno etc when we started getting thrashed it was like ok let’s get rid now as it was just a complete mess.

We are not a mess at all, we just need to get some better attackers, a better CDM and improve a few back up positions and improve set piece defending and Ange needs to tweak it a bit if/when teams like Newcastle under Howe etc have seemingly worked us out, then we’d be flying.
 

k1cks77

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2022
733
1,873
I very much disagree with this idea that "teams have found out how we play." It's hardly a secret. Most teams have a style of play. We just have to do it better.
Stuart pearce said it on talksport against newcastle, ‘an 8 year old knows how to beat spurs. Hit it over the top and Get runners in behind, or crowd the keeper on corners.’

At this elite level we simply cannot be THAT easy to score against, and being ‘better at the plan’ wont work unless something with our structure or training is changed. Its all very well and good saying we’ll outscore people but we still need structure at the back. I actually dread to think how many more we would have conceded if we didn't have Mickey to the rescue at the back.
 

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
22,899
83,049
Ange post-match interview:
1) We have bigger problems than just set-piece defending.
2) He concedes that the 2 set-piece goals were poor.
3) We are missing/not focused enough on 'small details' of the game; he didn't elaborate which ones, but gave an example: for the counter-attack for the second goal, we were unaware of the danger when we lost the ball
4) He said Romero's a World-Cup winner and wants to get more of him into the others.
5) He felt that we controlled the game.

Ange likely thinks that his players lack concentration/focus/awareness across the game, and this is our main problem.
It has to be in defensive transition or even before it happens.

Ange's teams are supposed to swarm the opposition as soon as they lose it.

We aren't doing that, we are slow to react and slow to pick up where the ball may go.

You can coach some players but if they switch off repeatedly for a split second then you are in trouble.

We need to find players who are;
1. Able to play the way Ange wants - brave, forward and see passes quickly.
2. Switched on during transitions.
3. Aggressive aerially (not all but at least 5 or 6 in the 11).
4. Mentally tough but also not ego driven
 

k1cks77

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2022
733
1,873
I really really really hate myself for saying this. Sack Ange close season.
Imo its okay to question things, but give the man a chance to answer those questions.

people also forget how much of a shit show our club was from top to bottom last season and look how rosey things looked until two weeks ago, a big part of that is ange and what he has done in such a short period of time.there is a reason why some of our new signings ignored the lure of newastles riches, and the attraction of man utd and bayern… it was because of ange. He needs another season as a minimum imo.
 

fishhhandaricecake

Well-Known Member
Nov 15, 2018
20,020
49,987
Ange post-match interview:
1) We have bigger problems than just set-piece defending.
2) He concedes that the 2 set-piece goals were poor.
3) We are missing/not focused enough on 'small details' of the game; he didn't elaborate which ones, but gave an example: for the counter-attack for the second goal, we were unaware of the danger when we lost the ball
4) He said Romero's a World-Cup winner and wants to get more of him into the others.
5) He felt that we controlled the game.

Ange likely thinks that his players lack concentration/focus/awareness across the game, and this is our main problem.
He’s right about most of this.

Bar Son, Romero and maybe Maddison, it’s a very young team who will continue to get better and learn just like Arsenals team have done under Legohead.

Concentration and focus and game management comes with experience and maturity and playing together as a team and squad for a longer period of time.

That being said we have clear tactical issues in how we setup to defend corners and on transition against counter attacks so it’s not just due to concentration, but I get what Ange is saying.
 

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
22,899
83,049
Yes to all of this apart from
Sack him Christmas if it’s gone to shit. We can’t keep just giving managers 1 and a 1/4 seasons. I highly doubt it will have ‘gone to shit’ by Xmas but even if we are 10th next Xmas like to see us stick by him. Arteta had Arsenal bottom after 4 games one season and finished what 8th in his first season? but look at them now…

Ange needs fully backing this summer and he needs to sort out the set pieces and tighten us up a bit.
Yeah should always stick with a coach as long as there are shoots of progress.

Let's say next season we are smashing teams more regularly but occasionally get suckered and are still having set piece issues but sat around 6th/7th.

That's not a scenario to fire him.

However if we are genuinely getting worse and continue to be easy to score against whilst still struggle to break low blocks and control more games, then yes you have to start to make considerations. But I'd still make that change at end of next season.

Anyway, that's all hypothetical and I hope that we are much improved
 

Albertbarich

Well-Known Member
Jul 4, 2020
5,685
21,334
In the first half they sat back in a 442 and hit us on the break or at set plays. Very effective and it did work but we had one disallowed, one off the post and another centimetres wide .

In the second half it felt like we encouraged them to have the ball a little more but we still stuck to our guns and we nearly got it back . So please tell me why ppl want to rip it all up and start again? They're top of the league and we looked on their level, it's just little things we need to be smarter with

Trust the manager, we knew this first season would be shaky but you can see the progress. We strengthen in the summer,and now with a style of play established we can work on those finer details.
 

ultimateloner

Well-Known Member
Jan 25, 2004
4,615
2,287
The problems we are having now cannot be solved by money.
Even better players would
It has to be in defensive transition or even before it happens.

Ange's teams are supposed to swarm the opposition as soon as they lose it.

We aren't doing that, we are slow to react and slow to pick up where the ball may go.

You can coach some players but if they switch off repeatedly for a split second then you are in trouble.

We need to find players who are;
1. Able to play the way Ange wants - brave, forward and see passes quickly.
2. Switched on during transitions.
3. Aggressive aerially (not all but at least 5 or 6 in the 11).
4. Mentally tough but also not ego driven
Who wouldn't want that? Easier said than done. Also it's about how consistently you can apply these. We know now that as it stands most of the team can't do it over the course of the season.
 

ultimateloner

Well-Known Member
Jan 25, 2004
4,615
2,287
He’s right about most of this.

Bar Son, Romero and maybe Maddison, it’s a very young team who will continue to get better and learn just like Arsenals team have done under Legohead.

Concentration and focus and game management comes with experience and maturity and playing together as a team and squad for a longer period of time.

That being said we have clear tactical issues in how we setup to defend corners and on transition against counter attacks so it’s not just due to concentration, but I get what Ange is saying.
Yeah it's hard to disagree with Ange. Whether he can do it is another matter.
For now I'm happy enough with where we are. I dont think that we as a team had digressed, unlike some others. I think we got some of the 'new coach' bonus, and were playing with less pressure due to low expectations, early in the season. The honey-moon period is over now so we revert to type; a team that can play on its day but will succumb under pressure aka Spursy (just like Man Utd, Villa etc etc).
 

rossdapep

Well-Known Member
Aug 25, 2011
22,899
83,049
Some have too much of a short memory.

Last April we were saying this team is poor, imbalanced and with a crap mentality.

Kane left and everyone said we'd be lucky to get top 6.

Then people said they expect to see a lot of bad results but as long as their was progress, they can deal with it.

Now think about the squad from last summer, we only added Maddison, Van de Ven, Johnson, Vicario and Solomon.

Maddison has gone right off it and should be our creative hub.

Van de Ven has been superb but missed 2.5 months

Vicario has been great bar the set piece issue.

Solomon has been injured

Johnson wasn't supposed to be a starter and was more for the immediate future.

So 3 excellent additions, 1 who is improving and 1 who has been injured.

If you again consider what we were saying last April, we haven't really made significant changes.

We moved players on but also not enough. Hojbjerg, Emerson,

We also lost Perisic, one player who would have really been superb in Ange's set up.

Sure, Sarr and Udogie have entered the fray and been excellent but they also have dropped off like players their age tend to do and they don't have the support around them.

We are still at least 6 players away and few out to make this Anges team
 

fishhhandaricecake

Well-Known Member
Nov 15, 2018
20,020
49,987
Some have too much of a short memory.

Last April we were saying this team is poor, imbalanced and with a crap mentality.

Kane left and everyone said we'd be lucky to get top 6.

Then people said they expect to see a lot of bad results but as long as their was progress, they can deal with it.

Now think about the squad from last summer, we only added Maddison, Van de Ven, Johnson, Vicario and Solomon.

Maddison has gone right off it and should be our creative hub.

Van de Ven has been superb but missed 2.5 months

Vicario has been great bar the set piece issue.

Solomon has been injured

Johnson wasn't supposed to be a starter and was more for the immediate future.

So 3 excellent additions, 1 who is improving and 1 who has been injured.

If you again consider what we were saying last April, we haven't really made significant changes.

We moved players on but also not enough. Hojbjerg, Emerson,

We also lost Perisic, one player who would have really been superb in Ange's set up.

Sure, Sarr and Udogie have entered the fray and been excellent but they also have dropped off like players their age tend to do and they don't have the support around them.

We are still at least 6 players away and few out to make this Anges team
Outstanding post sir 👏 absolutely nailed it.
 

Impspur1

Well-Known Member
May 8, 2014
2,555
6,253
Some have too much of a short memory.

Last April we were saying this team is poor, imbalanced and with a crap mentality.

Kane left and everyone said we'd be lucky to get top 6.

Then people said they expect to see a lot of bad results but as long as their was progress, they can deal with it.

Now think about the squad from last summer, we only added Maddison, Van de Ven, Johnson, Vicario and Solomon.

Maddison has gone right off it and should be our creative hub.

Van de Ven has been superb but missed 2.5 months

Vicario has been great bar the set piece issue.

Solomon has been injured

Johnson wasn't supposed to be a starter and was more for the immediate future.

So 3 excellent additions, 1 who is improving and 1 who has been injured.

If you again consider what we were saying last April, we haven't really made significant changes.

We moved players on but also not enough. Hojbjerg, Emerson,

We also lost Perisic, one player who would have really been superb in Ange's set up.

Sure, Sarr and Udogie have entered the fray and been excellent but they also have dropped off like players their age tend to do and they don't have the support around them.

We are still at least 6 players away and few out to make this Anges team
Very much this. Great post
 

Ginola+Tonic

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2021
1,512
9,541
Some have too much of a short memory.

Last April we were saying this team is poor, imbalanced and with a crap mentality.

Kane left and everyone said we'd be lucky to get top 6.

Then people said they expect to see a lot of bad results but as long as their was progress, they can deal with it.

Now think about the squad from last summer, we only added Maddison, Van de Ven, Johnson, Vicario and Solomon.

Maddison has gone right off it and should be our creative hub.

Van de Ven has been superb but missed 2.5 months

Vicario has been great bar the set piece issue.

Solomon has been injured

Johnson wasn't supposed to be a starter and was more for the immediate future.

So 3 excellent additions, 1 who is improving and 1 who has been injured.

If you again consider what we were saying last April, we haven't really made significant changes.

We moved players on but also not enough. Hojbjerg, Emerson,

We also lost Perisic, one player who would have really been superb in Ange's set up.

Sure, Sarr and Udogie have entered the fray and been excellent but they also have dropped off like players their age tend to do and they don't have the support around them.

We are still at least 6 players away and few out to make this Anges team
It’s literally as if wait for it…………

We’re in the middle of a rebuild we all wanted and asked for therefore inconsistencies.

We’re very much on the right track.
As long as Ange addresses the set piece issues.
 

Jay.

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2016
657
1,210
3rd time this season we’ve been beaten at home by a big london rival. That’s bullshit. Don’t go soft on this lot. Look at what’s coming up, things turn toxic pretty quick.
 

makeveli

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2012
899
2,141
I was blaming ange but I don’t think it’s him we still have some very weak minded players that are just not good enough, our team would get battered in the cl, we are so weak in the middle of the park we need 3 world class players like ange said Romero mentality to guide the younglins, it’s going to be a painful end to the season but let’s try to get some players in get the deadwood out and we may be a lot stronger next year
 

Shanks

Kinda not anymore....
May 11, 2005
31,529
20,308
Jesus, I often wonder if we watch the same things, or if fans have gone that far into 'social media soundbites' to reflect games.

Fee areas need sorting but it's such a massive improvement on last season, it's actually a joke.

Yesterday was small bargains, a 2nd goal that should never have been (kulu pen), unlucky OG, a stronger keeper and a dodgy offside call

It's no where near us rolling over and not playing, we actually played well, really well, other than those fee moments.
 

allatsea

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
9,174
16,561
Over the past few weeks Ange will have found out a lot about our players. Particularly the mentality of several. I am sure some such as Maddison will be under pressure to get in the starting line up next season unless his performances significantly improve.
 
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